Best Bullpup Rifle?

[Cesiumsponge]

Bullpup triggers don't necessarily -have- to be bad. I think the majority of bullpups come from a military background so the trigger pull isn't paramount. Most of the linkage used is spongy because the linkages aren't stiff enough for one reason or another, or it simply rubs up against too much stuff. The trigger pull on the MSAR is less than desirable, but livable.

The trigger on my SG2000 bullpup is better than every trigger I own except a Geiselle DMR two-stage on an AR lower (which was a $280 investment). Sub-1MOA results are typical at 100 yards. Target from last week. I've had better weeks too (lower right grouping is a freak anomaly and doesn't really count)

 

[THE MACHINIST]

Bullpup

Romanian akm.............

 

[Babarsac]

None for me since I'm a lefty and MSAR's stuff is way out of my price range.

 

[H2O MAN]

I like the looks of and what I've read about the Kel-Tec RFB.

 

[dom1104]

wow.


I mean, to each his own but, that kel-tec looks REALLY cheap in that photo.

big ol mold line, bunch of allen headed nuts holding it toghether... I dunno bout you but that looks UUUUUGMO to me.

 

[NCsmitty]

The NRA publication, American Rifleman, has a test of the 308 Kel-Tec RFB in the new Nov issue. They state that it is completely ambidextrous for use. The only things that they didn't like was the cheek weld on steel, became uncomfortable after prolonged shooting and the cover heated. They also feel it would be safer with a loaded-chamber indicator. The magazine must be removed to check for a loaded condition through the mag opening.
It's a compact powerhouse.


NCsmitty

 

[CobraGT]

TAVOR, baby!

Got to try a Tavor a while ago, and man, was it SWEET! I'm saving up to buy one now (3 grand - OUCH!!)

Norinco Type 97 is the only other one I've had a chance to try out - not too bad, but not even in remotely the same league...

We don't really have any other options here...

 

[earlthegoat2]

They also feel it would be safer with a loaded-chamber indicator.

Of course. We all need more mechanical devices to make our rifles "safer". Might as well put an internal lock on it too. And that was in American Rifleman of all places too.


Nonetheless the Steyr AUG is probably the best.

 

[General Geoff]

I'm surprised nobody's mentioned it in their lists, but I love my Walther G22.

 

[gunnutery]

Hmmm, I've been drooling over the FN FS2000 and the Kel Tec RFB. If I could afford either I'd get one of them. I like that the FS2000 can accept AR mags. I'm also glad that the RFB does not use a proprietary mag.

 

[woodybrighton2]

The L85a2 is probably the best military bullpup going considering HK spent 4 or $500 on each one

its doing the buisness in Afganhistan and the end users are not complaining about it .

HK have even built a semi automatic version for the army cadets which would be legal to import but they won't sell it in the US because they hate you

 

[everallm]

Woody

Just to engender the whole sick as a parrot feeling, there's a chap on this side who's reverse engineered the L85A1 (without the whole melting furniture, cross bolt safety that breaks with a hard look etc) and will be providing 80% kits as well as wholly finished.

http://www.prexis.com/sten/homebuilder/index.php?topic=6027.0

(You have to register to access)

 

[45B@cav]

I would say FS2000 for what you can buy. (just my oppinion) I shot a L85A2 at a range in Iraq traded my M4 with a British buddy for a few shots. LOVED IT!!!!!!!!!!! I'm sure the Tavor is incredible but I really enjoyed that L85A2.

 

[Justin]

Of course. We all need more mechanical devices to make our rifles "safer". Might as well put an internal lock on it too. And that was in American Rifleman of all places too.

In this case, the writers at American Rifleman are completely correct. With any of my rifles, be it an AR15 or a bolt-action hunting rifle, I can easily check whether or not there is a round in the chamber by drawing the bolt partway back to visually inspect the chamber.

With any of these rifles, I can do this with a loaded magazine. The RFB is a neat design, but the lack of including an easy way to check the chamber is a fairly major oversight. Even the FN FS2000 allows you to do this by lifting up the hinged cover at the back of the receiver.

Also, in competitive shooting circles, you must be able to demonstrate that your rifle is empty, be it through the use of a chamber flag (high power) or executing an "unload and show clear" in a practical event. With an AR, it's easy to insert a chamber flag, or draw the bolt back, lock it open, and present the rifle to the RO for a visual inspection of the chamber.

Being unable to easily ascertain the condition of the weapon seems like a no-brainer. Hopefully it's something that Kel-Tec corrects in the next iteration of the RFB.

 

[woodybrighton2]

everallam
but does it make a version of the long silly weapon.
now that would really ruin any AR shooters day and done properly with a free floated heavy barrel and a decent barrel send a lot of m14 owners back to the drawing board

 

[General Geoff]

Being unable to easily ascertain the condition of the weapon seems like a no-brainer. Hopefully it's something that Kel-Tec corrects in the next iteration of the RFB.

While I admit that I've never handled an RFB, from my understanding of the action, couldn't you remove the magazine, pull the charging handle back, and inspect the chamber from the mag well?

 

[DoubleTapDrew]

I like the Desert Tactical Stealth Recon Scout for a compact accurate long range rifle.

 

[everallm]

M'mmmmmmm L86.......26" of barrel love....

IF it all comes together I'm looking at a finished L85 and then trying my hand at an 80% kit and building it as either an L22 or an L86.

Going to depend heavily on what the innards and gas system are, if it is a DI system then 26" barrels are relatively easy to get a hold of. If its a piston system using say AR-18/AR180 equipment or it's ilk then a lot more difficulty.

 

[gvnwst]

Wow...old thread...

 

[Justin]

While I admit that I've never handled an RFB, from my understanding of the action, couldn't you remove the magazine, pull the charging handle back, and inspect the chamber from the mag well?

Yes, but there's no way to leave the gun locked open in such a manner that anyone who looks at it can quickly ascertain whether the gun is empty with the bolt locked open. In order to check it, you have to handle the weapon, something that you can't do at any range that has been called cold.

 

[Wes Janson]

Yes, but there's no way to leave the gun locked open in such a manner that anyone who looks at it can quickly ascertain whether the gun is empty with the bolt locked open. In order to check it, you have to handle the weapon, something that you can't do at any range that has been called cold.

Lock the bolt open.

Set the rifle down on its side on the table.

Insert a chamber flag into the chamber.


What's difficult or different about this versus any other rifle? It's easy to tell if the bolt is back or not - look at the position of the charging handle. To check the chamber, just look at the bottom of the rifle. If the rifle is on a bench, it's lying on its side, so you lean over and look in.

I've been a range officer for years, and there are weapons just as difficult to check, if not moreso, than the RFB. The FS2000, which you cite as a better design, requires that a cover be lifting in order to even see into the rifle - an extra step that the RFB doesn't require. And from personal experience with both, I can attest that one does typically need to pick up an FS2000 to look downwards into the port to check the chamber.

 

[Maverick223]

Ancient thread...

I really like my M17s...extremely reliable, and a blast to shoot. The Desert Tac. SRS is pretty fun, but the M17s get my vote. I hope to expand the bullpup sector of the collection pretty soon.

 

[Girodin]

I am a fan of the Micro tech stg 556. It feels better in my hands than the FS2000 does. It is obviously just my opinion but it looks sleeker and better to me as well. What I like about the FS2000 is that it is an ambidextrous design. I like the PS90 for what it is. I would like to get a chance to handle/shoot the RFB. On paper I really like it. It also purports to fix the last major flaw of the bullpup, the crap trigger.

 

[woodybrighton2]

everallm
Member
M'mmmmmmm L86.......26" of barrel love....

IF it all comes together I'm looking at a finished L85 and then trying my hand at an 80% kit and building it as either an L22 or an L86.

Going to depend heavily on what the innards and gas system are, if it is a DI system then 26" barrels are relatively easy to get a hold of. If its a piston system using say AR-18/AR180 equipment or it's ilk then a lot more difficulty.


I hate you:banghead:
you could with a little work turn out an L86 as a proper DMR rather than something that rusts away in the armoury as nobody bothers or they were cut up into carbines

 

[snakeman]

msar hands down