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Big Cities & Leftism: Why is it a given?

Discussion in 'Legal' started by Bunkster, Sep 30, 2003.

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  1. Art Eatman

    Art Eatman Administrator Staff Member

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    tcdrennen, Twain and Mencken came along after deTocqueville. :)

    I'm rusty about the title of his 1853-ish book, "Democracy in America", but that's close, I think...

    Art
     
  2. Gordon Fink

    Gordon Fink Member

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    Well, David Weber didn’t invent the welfare state. ;) Read Beggars in Spain by Nancy Kress to see the Dole taken to its frightening yet logical conclusion.

    However, Honor Harrington is next up on the semi-subversive reading list I’ve been feeding my self-described “bleeding-heart liberal†father.

    ~G. Fink
     
  3. tcdrennen

    tcdrennen Member

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    That's it! Haven't read that one in a while, 'bout time to dig it out.

    Sigh. So many books, so little time... :D
     
  4. greyhound

    greyhound Member

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    I hear a LOT of of interesting conversations on the subway every day, and I can back this up 100%. I think probably 75% of the stuff I hear is how me/my son/my daughter can get X out of the system. Either that or complaints about how hard it is to get X out of the system. And like Big-R, these are NOT all minorities I hear it from...

    We have a "gun culture". Well, there's also a "gettin' over" culture out there.
     
  5. Standing Wolf

    Standing Wolf Member in memoriam

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    Looters tend to gravitate toward cities, where there are more opportunities to get away with stealing more wealth and harming more people.
     
  6. Dan from MI

    Dan from MI Member

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    I'm fairly certain that the most democrat large city in America is Detroit Michigan. 96% went to Gore.

    That says something about democrats right there!!!!!!
     
  7. GinSlinger

    GinSlinger Member

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    "A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves money from the Public Treasury. From that moment on the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the Public Treasury with a result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy always followed by dictatorship. The average age of the world's greatest civilizations has been 200 years. These nations have progressed through the following sequence:

    From Bondage to Spiritual Faith
    From Spiritual Faith to Great Courage
    From Courage to Liberty
    From Liberty to Abundance
    From Abundance to Selfishness
    From Selfishness to Complacency
    From Complacency to Apathy
    From Apathy to Dependency
    From Dependency back into Bondage"


    Alexander Tytler Decline and Fall of the Athenian Republic 1776

    Scottish jurist and historian, he was widely known in his time and was professor of Universal History at Edinburgh University in the late 18th century.


    GinSlinger
     
  8. CaesarI

    CaesarI Member

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    Tytler quote

    Recently I was sent a copy of that quote with which I was familiar, however... it didn't quite jive with my own copy of the quote, which I've had saved in my text file for some years now. This caused me to seriously question the validity of the quote.

    Yours is the first I've seen suggesting it came from the book "Decline and Fall of the Athenian Republic" however I can find no solid proof that this book ever existed (let alone that Tytler wrote it, and in 1776)

    The 1989 edition of "Respectfully Quote" lists the quote here:
    http://www.bartleby.com/73/424.html
    and lists it as unverified. I have a later edition of this book... however the book has, characteristically, gone missing.

    in some versions "vote themselves money" is "vote themselves largesse"

    My text file lists the source of the quote as being from an 1801 collection of his lectures. This seems to be a more probable date than 1776 if one reads a biography of him: http://www.electricscotland.com/history/men/tytler_alexander.htm

    He seemed to be rather busy in 1776 however, peruse paragraphs 5 and 6, and I believe the 1801 date may be more plausible. The biography (which is rather a good one) never mentions the book and so I doubt very much that it does exist.

    The title of the book seems to be a variation of Gibbon's "Rise and Fall of the Roman Empire"

    The part of the quote that bothers me is as follows:
    "A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government."

    How many "democracies" had existed by 1776, or even 1801?

    I am now rather motivated to find the source of this quote, and so will likely find it in due time. At which point I will report back to ya'll.

    -Morgan
     
  9. Mike Irwin

    Mike Irwin Member

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    My take on it would be that like pigeons and rats, liberals tend to flock together.

    Vermin tend to live in colonies, why should liberals be any different...
     
  10. longeyes

    longeyes member

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    Same reason Christianity took off in the cities.

    Paganus = rural.

    Go figure.
     
  11. CaesarI

    CaesarI Member

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    Tytler Quote

    OK...
    So I hit up my 1993 edition of Respectfully quoted, and it remains unverified. So the folks that work for the Congress professionally at verifying things couldn't verify the source of the quote, but it *has* been attributed to Alexander Fraser Tytler (as previously noted).

    So I hit up the school Library, and found nothin' Hit up the Library of Congress, and found quite a few things. My quote file identifies the source as an 1801 collection of his lectures. This fits in with his multi-edition book:
    "Elements of general history, ancient and modern." which was mentioned in his Bio, in the link previously given.

    IF the quote was from Tytler, it would be in this book. The search string that yielded the most results:
    Woodhouselee, Alexander Fraser Tytler, Lord, 1747-1813

    Woodhouselee was his family title.

    If anyone can find a copy of this book, it would be worth doing a search for the quote.

    While I am not done with my search for his quote... the information at hand strongly indicates the quote is in fact apocryphal.

    -Morgan
     
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