Bushmaster gas piston or gas tube?

[gvnwst]

No. As i stated above, i have a POF. I look at tests not oonly done by the company, but review sites, magazines, and i have watched vidoes of them. Enough to convince me.

Do i believe that a GP system is a must have for everyone? No, casual shooters do not need them. that is why i asked what the rifle was for. If it is needed, i will reccomend it. if not, i won't.


This thread has compelled me to do my own torture test of it. I will try to fire as much ammo as possible over the course of a few months, not cleaning it once.

 

[Coronach]

IMHO? Go with the direct gas. It's dirtier, but dirt from the gas system isn't what ties up the gun. The piston uppers are heavier, more expensive and more complex, for little practical benefit.

Mike

 

[taliv]

No. As i stated above, i have a POF

cool, but i have way too many friends who own guns but have only put 20 rounds through them and claim they're utterly reliable.

i'd normally encourage torture testing, but given the current political climate and ammo availability, i probably wouldn't spend thousands of rounds just to see if a gun worked.

 

[possum]

go with the standard set up, the gas piston driven ar's seem to be not holding up through courses and hard use. the only one that has is the barrett and there is only 2 right now (in 5.56) but they are supposed to hit the civi market soon.

btw i own a bushmaster and this is my second one and i have shot over a dozen other bushmasters. they have all been good to go, so you have a great choice, just stick with the "old fashion" system. btw my bushmaster just surpassed 3700rds today, after 520rds in training were fired today.

 

[gvnwst]

@taliv

That is why i said over a few months. I am just going to sstop cleaning it, so whenever i shoot, i will mark the number of rounds. I will see how many i can go without one malfunction......

 

[Average Joe]

I would prefer the piston, I just don't like dirty gas in my chamber.

 

[gvnwst]

The piston uppers are heavier, more expensive and more complex, for little practical benefit.

Heavier (very little) and more expensive, but more complex? All that is added is a piston and rod. you don't have to worry about twisting the gas tube, and dissasembly is easier. If my knowledge of DI ARs is correct, the DI system is just as complicated, if not more. I think that the Bushmaster system uses a spring on the op rod, but the POF does not, it uses the buffer spring.

 

[SamG.]

This thread has compelled me to do my own torture test of it. I will try to fire as much ammo as possible over the course of a few months, not cleaning it once.

Sounds cool to me Go for it!

also I found these diagrams of both the gas piston and gas tube, just to clear up which is more complex:

If my knowledge of DI ARs is correct, the DI system is just as complicated, if not more.

http://www.bushmaster.com/faqs/attachments/409/gp%20001.pdf
and:

http://www.recguns.com/Pictures/Images/Xm15Diagram.gif

 

[gvnwst]

Yeah, the bushy GP system is more complicated than the POF one. On mine, it is the gas block, plug, piston, and piston rod. Basically, the gas tube gets replaced by a piston and rod (which actually could both be one peice in theory).

 

[rcmodel]

In the event Mr. Obama and Cronies do get a total ban put in place:

You will still be able to get M16/AR15 gas-gun parts at the local Swap & Shop!

The same cannot be said of a piston gun, that so far has limited production & circulation of spare parts available.

rcmodel

 

[H2O MAN]

I looked at everything and decided on a 16" upper with a mid length gas system.
Once I assemble everything it will have a fixed A2 rifle stock with rifle buffer and spring.
This should make for a really smooth shooting, extra reliable general purpose AR.


I found that the AR gas piston is best suited to SBRs with sound suppressors.

 

[SamG.]

In the event Mr. Obama and Cronies do get a total ban put in place:

You will still be able to get M16/AR15 gas-gun parts at the local Swap & Shop!

The same cannot be said of a piston gun, that so far has limited production & circulation of spare parts available.

I agree

 

[s2r]

New AR's often short stroke. There's parkerizing on the rails the bolt carrier rides on. After a couple hundred rounds it should start be fine. Till then you probly need to use hotter ammo.

The guy at Bushmaster said "if it did not take off after 10 or 12 rounds there was a problem". As far as ammo I tried Lake City M855. I have owned about 9different AR's and shot thousands of rounds through them (including wolf) and never had one short stroke.

 

[taliv]

All that is added is a piston and rod. you don't have to worry about twisting the gas tube, and dissasembly is easier. If my knowledge of DI ARs is correct, the DI system is just as complicated, if not more.

now you're just being silly.

on what planet is 1 part with no springs just as complicated if not more than 9 parts with two springs?

i don't think you know either system.

New AR's often short stroke.

i've got to admit, i've never experienced any break-in issues. all of mine have worked from the get go (except for the two I put adjustable gas blocks on which i obviously tweaked for a few dozen rounds to get just the right amount of gas, but i don't think that really counts)

 

[gvnwst]

on what planet is 1 part with no springs just as complicated if not more than 9 parts with two springs?

i don't think you know either system.

I have said that my POF does not have any extra springs, just teh buffer spring.

What i was meaning about DI being complicated, IIRC, the gas goes INTO the BCG, pushing the BC and the bolt in oppisite directions. This to me is more complicated than a piston just pushing on the BC, as in my POF. Feel free to correct me on the workings of the DI system, just don't be mean about it.

 

[taliv]

sorry i got a little snippy

Got a link to a diagram of your system? does it really only have two parts? there's no spring inside the gas block either?

 

[gvnwst]

No, but if you look at my thread i have a pic of the internals. there are three pieces, the piston, the rod (as stated above, these could be combined, i don't know why they werent...) and the plug. there is no spring in the housing, unless it is permenant. POF made a deal to use no extra springs, that is why i got this over the bushy.

EDIT:

I posted pics below.

 

[gvnwst]

well, here is a pic of the POF intenals:



The bolt:

 

[SamG.]

gvnwst how much do the POF go for?

 

[gvnwst]

.............................

I paid $2,000 for mine. That is the top model though, i think the base (same stuff, 16" bbl vs 18") is about $1600. I also have a FFL that charges me nothing more than it costs him. It is expensive, but so are Noveske, LMT ect. POF is the equal of those companies, IMO.

 

[Wanta B]

With a bit of searching you can get POF's base upper for 1160.00...POF is what I have now,I was going to get a Bushmaster too but somebody else got to it first.Hearing the rumor about Bushmaster intentionaly keeping the Masada off the market makes me feel glad NOT to have made the aquisition.

Anyhow I have three DI Bushmasters and have had trouble with them only after being submerged in water...once with sand...a couple of times from being dirty.I have not had any trouble with the POF in any way shape or form so far with around 15,000 rounds through it.By the way I have been torture testing this one.Great system! Long ago I felt the DI was secound best to an op-rod.Does the DI work,yes.However look at the issues that they have had as compared to op-rod types.In the long run my belief is that an op-rod is hands down more reliable.I know the DAEWOO has had some issues,at least I have heard that but out of the 7 myself and a couple of others that I shoot with have found they eat the ARs for lunch.Well maybe not for luch but they are more reliable in hard use.AK OP-ROD with AR lower=awesome!!So I am very happy with the POF because other than the DI I realy like the basic american "Black Gun".

Now barring all that stuff I HAVE to agree with many of the other folks that do to spare parts and if you do not have to submerge the rifle ever the DI rifles do just fine.Just keep 'em clean!

Wanta B

 

[Wanta B]

Weight..!! Honestly who truefuly notices a couple of ounces?!

Wanta B

 

[esmith]

The main selling point of the piston uppers is the thought that they are more reliable. But think about it, GP uppers are more expensive than some of the best DI uppers. I personally believe with a GP AR you are paying a lot for little gain. A LMT, Noveske or Colt AR will act reliably enough.

 

[jerkface11]

A DPMS is reliable enough. If you really want a piston why not get a gun designed for one? Like a nice Saiga.

 

[jmar254]

I took my AR to the range for the first time and had too many FTFs to mention, after I got home and opened it up it was pretty dry, from sitting on the shelf waiting for me to buy it. I think I'll oil the crap out of it and run some more through it. NOTE about the Bushmaster Chrome lined barrel, they recommend running a two / three hundred rounds through it before giving the barrel a good cleaning.