Bushmaster or Stag

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Stag gets my vote. I own one and can't be happier. Lots of info on these sites, but go find me a bad review on a stag. Are you going to war, or going to the range??? If your going to war, get an AK. Milspec this and milspec that, chrome this and chrome that...Stag, BM, rock River all make fine rifles for most people. Maybe some of the bad ass warriors on this site need others, but for 99.9 % of them they wouldn't know the difference if you blindfolded them
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Actually I bet I could tell the difference blindfolded by feeling the incorrect carrier in the Bushy and similar rifles.

I'm going to quibble here and say that I think Stag/CMT sets the average, or "par." That average is well below the milspec (or TDP for the M4) but I can't really agree that Stag is sub par when roughly half the ARs on the market are, in my opinion, inferior to it.

Before you flame, see my first post on this question
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Fair enough if you use average as par. I was using mill-spec as par even though it is way above what the average AR is.
 
Unlike 90% of the replies so far, I'd like to actually address the OP...

What influenced you to narrow your decision to these two, available locally? What prices are you looking at for each?

As others here have already said, depending on the price, you'd be much better served with a carbine from some other companies (Spikes, Daniel Defense and BCM).

To all the defenders of Stag and BM... I entirely understand why you want to protect your purchase and discount the advantage that other carbines from other manufactures may have over yours... BUT, all things being equal (stocker, flat-top carbine priced at or lower) there is simply no reason to skip over something that's closer to the TDP for something that's farther away. None.
 
I was able to get my M&P15 for $649. (This past Christmas). I have nothing against Stag, but I consider the M&P15 to be at least debatably equal to the stag. Personally, I think the M&P15 is better. And for $649, I don't have to spend $1000+ on a colt, D&D, lMT, BCM, etc... Is the M&P15 better than the Colt, D&D, LMT, BCM, etc...? I won't say yes or no. But for some people, it's definitely the "Better - Choice". I.e. I have no need to shoot 75 grain ammo. Therefor, I have absolutely no need for a 1:7 barrel compared to a 1:9 twist. Do I need to spend more on a full auto M-16 BCG? No, I don't. A semi-auto AR BCG is quite fine. Do I really think the 4150 vs 4140 steel barrel is a major concern for "ME"? Not really. Not considering my 4140 is Chrome Lined in my M&P15. Do I really care if the M&P15 is using a carbine length gas system, with a mid-length size gas port? (AKA- Overgassed). Well, considering that 95% of the ammo I will be shooting is .223 and NOT 5.56 military (Higher Pressure Ammo); then no, it's not a big issue.

In other words; the so called "Mil-Spec" AR's like the colt, BCM, LMT, etc... may be "Better" than my M&P15, but the areas they are better at, are areas that are insignificant to me, and thus, not worth the additional $400. And the mil-spec areas that are of concern to me, the M&P15 does have. e.g. staked gas screws on the BCG. So, for me, I definitely think there are better choices than the Bush or the Stag. I just don't know if you HAVE to go all the way up to the price range of the BCM, Colt, and LMT.
 
The M&P is a good gun and at under $700, you couldn't go wrong with that. Every time I've seen a M&P on the shelf though, it has been going for $800+ which at that point, you might was well get a BCM etc.
 
RancidSumo said:
The M&P is a good gun and at under $700, you couldn't go wrong with that. Every time I've seen a M&P on the shelf though, it has been going for $800+ which at that point, you might was well get a BCM etc.
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Can't disagree with that. IF i was going to buy an AR, and the S&W M&P15 weren't on sale, but I just HAD to get one, I would probably buy a BCM for the same price. But I've not had any problems finding a S&W M&P15 on sale. Then again, Cheyenne is a little closer to civilization than Green River. LOL!!! Sorry; had to go there. Actually, I like the GR/RS/EV area. But if you get up to the Sportsman's Warehouse in Casper, or head to Salt lake, Ft Collins, Loveland, Denver, etc... areas; you'll find much better prices. FWIW: Our local gun stores here in Cheyenne, have M&P15 for the $800+ that you're talking about. I bought mine at Sportsman's Warehouse in Loveland Colorado. Remember; you can buy long guns across state lines; (As long as the state borders your state); just can't buy handguns across state lines without having it shipped back home to a dealer.
 
The Spikes has a ton to like about it for pricing very close to what I was looking at for the Stag. The BCM and DDs are great but outside of the price range I was looking at. The Spikes does seem to be more rifle than the Stag even though I will never really NEED it. However if I am going to spend good money I would just assume get the most for it.

I had been between the Stag and BM really because that is what I have already shot, and what was readily available at reasonable pricing from my LGS. I also looked at the M&P but have yet to fire one. You guys make an excellent argument for the Spikes and I am strongly leaning that way right now.
 
I have three Bushmasters and a Colt.

My Bushies function reliably with cheap lacquer/polymer coated steel case ammo, zinc plated Silver Bear, and my own handloads. I've had zero issues despite hard use (smoking and glowing) with all three in five years.

I converted the Colt to 6.8x43mm for hunting.
 
I've owned variety of AR15s, to include Bushmaster. All of the manufacturers who have been around for any amount of time will have good and bad rifles roll off the assembly line. I would challenge anyoone to show me a manufacturer of a non custom AR that did not have a return. That being said, both Bushy and Stag are good choices. Get the one that makes you happy. Neither one is a real M4 or M16, but they weren't designed to be.

As for a real M4 or M16....I've personally handled some military weapons that I would consider, for the lack of a better term...crap.

Buy it...shoot the heck out it, clean it, and claim it yours.
 
Can't disagree with that. IF i was going to buy an AR, and the S&W M&P15 weren't on sale, but I just HAD to get one, I would probably buy a BCM for the same price. But I've not had any problems finding a S&W M&P15 on sale. Then again, Cheyenne is a little closer to civilization than Green River. LOL!!! Sorry; had to go there. Actually, I like the GR/RS/EV area. But if you get up to the Sportsman's Warehouse in Casper, or head to Salt lake, Ft Collins, Loveland, Denver, etc... areas; you'll find much better prices. FWIW: Our local gun stores here in Cheyenne, have M&P15 for the $800+ that you're talking about. I bought mine at Sportsman's Warehouse in Loveland Colorado. Remember; you can buy long guns across state lines; (As long as the state borders your state); just can't buy handguns across state lines without having it shipped back home to a dealer.
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I'm actually living in Golden, CO now for college so I've been able to experience some pretty good gun stores in the last six months. Way better than I have seen anywhere in WY.
 
Both the Stag and BM were going in the low-mid $800s. A little more for the M&Ps that I have seen. For those dollars the Spikes falls right in line.

Still not totally decided as the Stag could go home with me sooner than the Spikes. I am not in any rush however and could always use another pay period to go by.

Living between MA and CT I will be staying with a LGS here in Lil Rhody if I decide not to order a Spikes.
 
CJSO6: i completely understand that the BCM,Colt,Spikes,etc. features most likely you will never need. i've owned a few AR's my "baby" is a BCM i built not long ago but i've owned Olympic,del-ton,etc "the ones everybody says don't buy" and they functions great no issues at all the Olympic was Very accurate. but i just wanted a top of the line AR so i saved my money and bought parts as i could afford them and built a BCM upper. what i'm trying to say is a STAG will make u a happy owner,a Spikes will make u a happy owner so witch ever way u go i think you'll be just fine
 
I've researched the Stag and found them to be quality AR's. People who call them sub-par have no clue what their talking about. Stag has been in the manufacturing business a long time, and manufactures parts for the military. They are the choice of many Law enforcement agencies.
You'll get a lot of opinions here, but do some research. I'm not claiming Stag is the best AR out there, but for the money they're hard to beat. You don't have to spend over $1,000 to get a good AR.
Good luck
 
I've researched the Stag and found them to be quality AR's. People who call them sub-par have no clue what their talking about.
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Research more. Stag does batch testing on their bolts and barrels, uses the wrong carrier, doesn't stake the carrier key, uses the wrong extractor insert, wrong barrel steel, wrong feedramps, wrong buffer, and arguably the incorrect barrel twist (although I will admit that really isn't an issue for many).
 
didn't know there was a "Wrong feed ramp"? and i very seriously doubt Stag does not stake the carrier key now it may not be properly staked but not staked at all come on now.
 
Stag does batch testing on their bolts and barrels
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So does Bravo Co. and most others. It is not cost effective to cert each piece of an assembly like a bolt. Barrel steel is batch tested and certed by lot. Otherwise there would need to be a tracable Serial Number on each Piece of every assembly.

uses the wrong carrier
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Asside from the use of some alien carrier, what could be wrong?

doesn't stake the carrier key
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Carrier staking came to be a necessity on full auto and was just continued on the civilian versions as a part of the mfg process. Its not a bad practice but a properly torqued key is not likely to become loose with average weekend range blasters.



Anyway and BLAH BLAH BLAH. Chart Disciples should get educated.
 
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There are wrong feedramps if you are going by military specifications and incorrect staking might as well be no staking. Two little dints that don't actually hold the screw in don't count as staking.
 
So does Bravo Co. and most others. It is not cost effective to cert each piece of an assembly like a bolt
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Actually BCM tests each bolt and they are marked as such, same with the barrels. Have you even looked at one or are you just talking about something without experience?

Asside from the use of some alien carrier, what could be wrong?
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The correct carrier has a shrouded firing pin and more meat on the buffer end, H-buffers work exceptionally well with a correct carrier. Stag and BM use carbine buffers.

Background: I own a Del-ton kit gun on an Armalite receiver, a BM and a BCM. The DTI and BM have had BCM BCG and CH installed along with H-buffers. The BM BC was staked incorrectly and the DTI BC was incorrectly machined. As for the barrels the DTI barrel is unlined and batch tested the BM barrel is lined and MP tested and the same for BCM. I checked both the BM and DTI for correct extractor springs in the original bolts and they both had the black insert, but neither were marked as MP or HPI like the BCM bolts.
 
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