Can a .32 ACP CC gun have enough balls to be a respectable defense gun?

[JImbothefiveth]

It will not kill game animals. It will kill humans.

How is this?

Furthermore, the concern is with "stopping" not "killing. The attacker dying is something I see as a bad thing, I just want to save my own life or other's lives in that situation, not make sure the attacker dies. With the .25 ACP, there's a good chance of me not being able to save my life.

 

[mljdeckard]

It MAY kill humans. A well-placed needle MAY kill someone. Again, no pistol round is good for self-defense. .25 is dead freakin' last, period. If you are shooting someone at a weird angle, wearing leather, it is unlikely to penetrate AT ALL. When I shoot someone, I don't want their response to be, "OW!! That HURT!!" I want it to do more than leave a welt.

 

[mljdeckard]

The reason I keep a rifle in my truck is that a plan is incomplete without one. In the real world, you may or may not get far enough to get to it and still need it, but if you don't have it, you don't have the option. A handgun is what you use to fight your way back to the long gun you never should have put down in the first place. It makes little sense to not have one at all.

 

[Marlin 45 carbine]

when very lightly dressed (i.e. shorts, t-shirt and such) I carry in a pocket a Beretta .32acp filled with hot handloads. FMJ's.
I've shot it enough into old phone books and catalogs to know I don't want to be shot with it.

 

[RippinSVT]

ggarfield, have you ever actually fired a real gun? Your posts seem sophomoric and have little to no logic. You know what happens when you shoot somebody with a pee-wee round and you don't hit them just right? They still have a chance to do something, not to mention sue the **** out of you (with the current liberalized courts). Dead men don't talk. If you are going through the trouble of getting a ccw permit and buying a gun, why not just buy "enough" gun? There have been time when I had to shoot SQUIRRELS multiple times with .22LR to kill 'em, so I highly doubt an adrenaline-charged assailant is going to be particularly phased by the firearms equivalent of being poked with a pencil.

 

[GaryP]

Yes, At legitimate CC distances if you do yor part.

 

[usp9]

Can a .32 ACP CC gun have enough balls to be a respectable defense gun?

Of course a .32acp can be a respectable self defence round and has been for 100 years. Nothing has changed.

 

[gazpacho]

wbond

FWIW Kel-Tec tests their P32 mouegun with Sellier & Bellot FMJ

Many S Americans and Europeans are happy with their 7.65mm Brownings and 9mm Browning Shorts because their governments dont trust them with 9mm Parabellums, not to mention 45acps.

The CZ-83 in 7.65 Browning is a fine weapon. I own one and recommend it to the recoil intollerant. However, it is about the size of a Glock 27. Because (at this point) my government does not fear me, I may own this firearm, and carry it on my person, concealed.

If I should desire a smaller firearm, or perhaps one with a more powerful cartridge, I could purchase and carry the excellent S&W 640.

The handgun is a compromize firearm, in relation to the rifle. The 7.65mm Browning (32acp) is a compromize to the 9mm Parabellum, which is a compromize 45acp, which is a compromize choice to the 44 magnum. The essence of sidearm choice is deciding how much you are willing to compromize. Given that there are a number of handguns comparable in size to your Firestorm that chamber 9mm and 40s&w, the argument for 32acp in that platform size is moot, unless you are restricted by law or life.

If my little argument doesn't sway you, I recommend reading up on the FBI 1986 Miami shootout. I submit to you that if the FBI agents were armed with 32acp handguns, as were many european police officers, the results would have been catastrophic for the FBI.

 

[kokapelli]

"FWIW Kel-Tec tests their P32 mouegun with Sellier & Bellot FMJ"

What does that have to do with anything! I'm sure that if KelTec does indeed use Sellier & Bellot ammo for testing it's about cost.

I too used to use Sellier & Bellot ammo at the range until I got tired of having at least one or two rounds in every box fail to fire. Sellier & Bellot is notorious for their hard primers that too often have rounds that fail to fire in many guns.

 

[ggarfield965]

RippinSVT, what are you talking about? I have shot .22lr extensively and let me tell you that being hit in the torso with one would not be much fun. A pencil wound? I'll buy that. If the pencil is stainless steel and I stab someone with it as hard as I can then yes. And whoever said something about bullets that cause welts should go play some combat sports in light caliber seeing as that is all they are good for

 

[jackstinson]

S&B is one of those YMMV cases. Some K-T owners have reported hard primers and I'm sure it happens, but I've never personally had an S&B round fail to ignite first time every time...from .25acp through 9mm in many different pistols (including a 1999 K-T P32 and a 2007 P3AT). I must just be lucky?
I think the point of mentioning Kel-Tec using S&B was that it has ballistics about the same as the OP's favorite Fiocchi. Both are a hotter than most American .32acp's. But the .32acp out of a Firestorm's 3.5" barrel has a fair bit more FPE than out of a Kel-Tec P32's short barrel. One inch is a lot in that context.

As for James Bond? He started out with 3 guns: a Beretta .25acp (it could not have been a 950, it was likely a Model 418) with the grips removed (the grip frame taped) in his shoulder rig, but he also had a "sawn barrel .38" under his pillow and a .45 in the Bentley's glovebox. It wasn't until like the 6th book when they took his beloved .25 Beretta and gave him a .32 PPK AND a .38 S&W Airweight. The movies are terribly out of order.
And yep, I do sometimes carry a .32acp myself.

 

[jon_in_wv]

Bigger is always better but a well trained, well practiced man with a warrior mindset and a .32 is more dangerous that 90% of shooters with a 45 who are neither good shots nor inclined to shoot.

 

[kokapelli]

Bigger is always better but a well trained, well practiced man with a warrior mindset and a .32 is more dangerous that 90% of shooters with a 45 who are neither good shots nor inclined to shoot.

I have a different experience with 45 shooters. I personally do not have a 45, but the 45 shooters at the range I belong to are mostly very good shooters.

I would say that overall most of the 45 shooters at my range are significantly better than the none 45 shooters shooters.

 

[Jim Watson]

My Kel Tec .32 goes in my pocket when I can't be bothered to "saddle up." My Colt .32 stays home because if I am going to wear a holster and carry a steel gun it is going to be a bigger caliber.

 

[IMTHDUKE]

Ok....that's why I read these boards...so I know what is best for everyone, anywhere,

Ok....that's why I read these boards...so I know what is best for everyone, anywhere, anytime to do. So I am now altering my carry patterns.........

I use to CCW this one little friend.....

After reading half of the post, I am going to this bad boy....

After readin more I do feel under guned considering the neighborhood and all, so I am goin to this fire eater....

Can someone suggest a good holster? It keeps printing when I am in the mall

 

[kokapelli]

You must have long arms to be able to pull that baby out of your pocket

 

[jocko]

unbelievable

does that thing shoot 22 shorts or just 22 long rifle bullets

 

[kokapelli]

I don't think my daughter could handle that one, but she does handle this 50 cal ok.

 

[Phil DeGraves]

The .32 has been used as a service round for European Police for years. It is capable of killing or stopping a human being under the right circumstances.
Are there better guns/cartridges?
Yes.
Is it better than a .25, or a rock?
Yes.
If that is all I had, I'd carry it. But since it isn't, I'd prefer a minimum of a .38 caliber and more than one at that.

 

[ggarfield965]

Last time I post in this board I promise. But just for the record since I have annoyed the hell out of a few of you I can tell, my standing up for the .22lr and .32 ACP was simple on the basis that they were adequate to stop an assailant or provide an acceptable level of insurance. I do not think the .22LR is ideal, sufficient yes, but barely. I think the .32 ACP is fairly good for CC. This said, if I was going to actually CC and bother to get a compact handgun I would almost certainly go with a 9mm and it would probably be a P239. I still think .44 Mags are a stupid gun to CC, but that's just my opinion. I hope I didn't piss too many people off. Cheers.

 

[KBintheSLC]

Typical velocities are 900 to 1000 fps for 60 grain hollow point .32 ACP American defense ammo. That is pitiful. No wonder most US Citizens think the .32 ACP is wimpy and the .380 much better.

It sounds pitiful, but in the real world, there is little statistical difference in the effectiveness of the two. Both are wimpy rounds. However, I am happy with my .32 for most situations. Defensive shooting is much different than combat for the most part. Most common criminals are cowards, and a couple of rounds of .32 to the chest will likely stop the attack.
Now dealing with psychopaths is a different story. For them, I prefer a high cap 9mm or my shotgun.

 

[ggarfield965]

(oops, I lied)

If it's psychopaths on the loose we're talking, I prefer the old .303 Enfield Mark V. It's action is remarkably fast for a bolt and it's a pretty good argument against life for man and beast alike. They used to use that round in machine guns on bomber planes in WWII. For some reason it has a louder report than a WIN 70 in .30-06. Huzzah!

 

[R.W.Dale]

If my little argument doesn't sway you, I recommend reading up on the FBI 1986 Miami shootout. I submit to you that if the FBI agents were armed with 32acp handguns, as were many european police officers, the results would have been catastrophic for the FBI.

DO WHAT? Do you even know what happened in that incident? The outcome couldn't have possibly been more catistropic for the FBI. If anything this serves to point out how inadequate all handguns are when faced with a determined adversary armed with REAL weapons.

Hell if anything they FBI agents might have made a better showing of themselves if they had been armed with .32's that had a higher cap and quicker reload time than their snub nosed 38's

 

[IMTHDUKE]

I would almost certainly go with a 9mm and it would probably be a P239.

I'm goin go with that in a different flavor...like a 40cal below....

If I wanna drop back to a 9...I wanna size down also...

Again, just my humble, but extremely accurate opinion....
God speed and party on....

 

[nuffsaid]

I have heard of the .22 killing would be burglers and other bad guys. But in the owrds of my hero and handgun instructor, " Carry the most powerful round that you can accuratly and comfortably shot"