Quantcast
  1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Can a Ex-Felon Own Black Powder Guns?

Discussion in 'Legal' started by Zeke Menuar, Jul 6, 2005.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Zeke Menuar

    Zeke Menuar Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2003
    Messages:
    1,228
    Location:
    Oregon Monsoon Central
    A co-worker asked me this question and I didn't have the answer.

    The co-worker in question was convicted of a non-violent Class A felony in Oregon. He is off supervision.

    Can he possess old timey guns like flintlocks and other black powder firearms?

    What about the newfangled in-line muzzleloaders?

    Can a felon's gun rights ever be restored?

    Thanks
    ZM
     
  2. 2nd Amendment

    2nd Amendment member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2002
    Messages:
    1,929
    Location:
    Indiana
    I believe it depends on the state, but in most it's still allowed. Years ago I knew an old timer who had been convicted of something(I forget right now) who carried an old BP revolver everywhere he went. Perfectly legal then and I don't know of any changes since.

    Getting rights "restored"? Ha!
     
  3. Standing Wolf

    Standing Wolf Member in memoriam

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2002
    Messages:
    24,041
    Location:
    Idahohoho, the jolliest state
    A great many states restore felons' voting rights; to the best of my knowledge, however, no states restore felons' Second Amendment civil rights.
     
  4. Sharps Shooter

    Sharps Shooter Member

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2005
    Messages:
    740
    Location:
    Southeast Idaho
    I think it's legal for an ex-felon to have a black powder rifle. In Idaho at least. My buddy's son-in-law is an ex-felon (dope) and he hunts with one of those in-line muzzle loaders. It seems like it's called a "Knight," but I'm not sure. He has told me he can't legally carry a regular cartridge rifle.
     
  5. Khaotic

    Khaotic Member

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2005
    Messages:
    212
    As far as I am aware... (could be wrong, feel free to correct) most states don't care very much about BP ownership, far as that goes.

    Michigan is apparently one of the exceptions, they do have some related controls.

    It'd be helpful if someone more knowledgeable chimed in here.
    (hint, hint :eek: )

    -K
     
  6. captain obvious

    captain obvious Member

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2004
    Messages:
    436
    Location:
    Fairfax County VA (Wolf's district NOT Moran's) -
    In WV you can mail order a BP weapon as if it was a book - same goes for most states, I believe, with Michigan standing out in my mind as one exception.
     
  7. armoredman

    armoredman Member

    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2003
    Messages:
    16,220
    Location:
    proud to be in AZ
    Emphatically no. Check local and state laws for what a firearm is described as. In AZ, felons in possession of a BP firearm will be treated the same as a cartridge firearm, all the time.
    The funny/sad thing is, the only felons carrying BP would be the ones who are trying to be law abiding....
     
  8. WT

    WT Member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2003
    Messages:
    1,985
    He is NOT an ex-felon. He IS a felon.

    In my state he can't touch a gun.
     
  9. GunGoBoom

    GunGoBoom member

    Joined:
    Aug 4, 2004
    Messages:
    1,645
    Guys, I got this straight from the horse's mouth - a guy that did some federal time, and is a big hunter. Check with a *local* criminal defense lawyer to be sure, but apparently here's the deal in OK:

    -Inline muzzleloaders using 209 primers ===> NO
    -Traditional muzzeloaders using caps/nipples with external hammer, & black powder ===> YES, that is ok.
     
  10. Gung-Ho

    Gung-Ho member

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2005
    Messages:
    185
    Location:
    Undisclosed. Somewhere West Of The Rockies
    Yeah. He probably parked to far from the curb. :rolleyes:
     
  11. wdlsguy

    wdlsguy Member

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2004
    Messages:
    2,880
    Location:
    TX
    Texas

    Texas Penal Code § 46.04. UNLAWFUL POSSESSION OF FIREARM.
    (a) A person who has been convicted of a felony commits an offense if he possesses a firearm:
    (1) after conviction and before the fifth anniversary of the person's release from confinement following conviction of the felony or the person's release from supervision under community supervision, parole, or mandatory supervision, whichever date is later; or
    (2) after the period described by Subdivision (1), at any location other than the premises at which the person lives.
    ...
    (e) An offense under Subsection (a) is a felony of the third degree. An offense under Subsection (b) or (c) is a Class A misdemeanor.


    Texas Penal Code § 46.01. DEFINITIONS.
    In this chapter:
    ...
    (3) "Firearm" means any device designed, made, or adapted to expel a projectile through a barrel by using the energy generated by an explosion or burning substance or any device readily convertible to that use. Firearm does not include a firearm that may have, as an integral part, a folding knife blade or other characteristics of weapons made illegal by this chapter and that is:
    (A) an antique or curio firearm manufactured before 1899; or
    (B) a replica of an antique or curio firearm manufactured before 1899, but only if the replica does not use rim fire or center fire ammunition.
    ...
     
  12. TarpleyG

    TarpleyG Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2002
    Messages:
    2,981
    Location:
    North Carolina
    :D :D :D
     
  13. Gung-Ho

    Gung-Ho member

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2005
    Messages:
    185
    Location:
    Undisclosed. Somewhere West Of The Rockies
    Did you check out the hot links on Y/N??? :D
     
  14. SHOOT1SAM

    SHOOT1SAM Member

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2004
    Messages:
    782
    Location:
    Boise, Idaho
    First of all, I may be completely wrong here, so I just want to state that for the record.

    It is my understanding that any muzzle loading revolver, rifle, shotgun, etc., is NOT classified as a "Firearm" as we are referring to here, by the BATFE. Some states, however, might classify them as such.

    Sam
     
  15. Harve Curry

    Harve Curry Member

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2004
    Messages:
    1,756
    Location:
    Black Range of New Mexico
    What ever happened to "served his/her debt to society" , or "paid his debt to society" ??

    With all the laws accumulating on the books anyone of us could someday count ourselves among the felons, ex-cons, whatever.

    Frank James, John Wesley Hardin, got their guns back. Not that they were the best examples to get them back. As I understand it James did live out a honest productive life in L.A. California. John Selman fixed the mistake made in Hardin's case.

    I did know a gunshop in Arizona that specialized in muzzleloader stuff and antiques because the owner couldn't have modern fixed ammunition firearms.
     
    Last edited: Jul 8, 2005
  16. Barbara

    Barbara Member

    Joined:
    Nov 3, 2003
    Messages:
    3,230
    Location:
    Michigan
    Michigan does give felons back their right to a firearm although it affects their eligibility to carry concealed.

    There's some legislation brewing right now that might concievably put an end to that, though..allegedly because of problems its causing with reciprocity with Texas, but I'm not so sure.
     
  17. R.H. Lee

    R.H. Lee Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2004
    Messages:
    7,377
    Location:
    CA
    I dunno. What's an 'ex-felon'? Did he undo the damage he caused? Did he make whoever he hurt whole again? If not, he doesn't even deserve to be sucking oxygen IMO.
     
  18. Gung-Ho

    Gung-Ho member

    Joined:
    Apr 4, 2005
    Messages:
    185
    Location:
    Undisclosed. Somewhere West Of The Rockies
    If its a debt that cannot be repaid, then his life should be forfeit. However, if he has repaid his debt to society and has been set free, he should have ALL his rights.
     
  19. MillCreek

    MillCreek Member

    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2004
    Messages:
    830
    Location:
    Snohomish County, Washington USA
    I have read in the Seattle papers about felons petitioning to have their gun ownership restored. Although I don't know the exact procedure, one argues the case in front of a county Superior Court judge and again based on what I read in the papers, several people have had their rights successfully restored. I don't know if they regain their carry permit back.

    If I recall correctly, the majority of the people who are successful in having their rights restored are generally now pillars of the community, the felony was committed a while ago, and it was generally for non-violent crimes. In the local legal newsletters, I have read ads from attorneys that specialize in this area of the law.

    Often the court petition is part of a package that also includes restoration of voting rights. This sticks out in my mind because of our recent conniptions over the governorship election and the court actions thereto. There were a lot of articles in the local media about felons voting, in most cases not knowing that they were not legally permitted to vote absent a court-ordered restoration of rights. So there was a lot of discussion about the civic rights of felons and the restorationt thereto, and there was some discussion about restoration of firearms ownership as well.
     
  20. thorn726

    thorn726 Member

    Joined:
    Dec 15, 2004
    Messages:
    1,388
    Location:
    berkeley, CA

    Wow. it says up there it was for dope. i mean ok if he was a dealer, perhaps there was great damage to the world, maybe even as a possesor, by buying possibly foreign produced drugs , he helped fund terrorism (like all of us do at the gas pump).

    But
    without knowing anything more than he commited a felony???

    i suppose you have never EVER ever done anything that could possibly be construed as a felony? you never drove home a tiny bit drunk, never owned anything illegal whatsoever, nothing ever, in your whole life.

    still- if we give death for felonies, wouldnt life in prison follow for misdemeanors? so - you have never commited a single misdemeanor ever???

    or an infraction??/? ever littered?// broken the speed limit???

    you belong in jail, you just got lucky so far

    i suppose LE could say "oh laws dont apply to me" ok that's sounds very American.

    i cna understand many types of violent criminals, not wanting to release them , heck at this point the thieves are making me scream bloody murder i have been robbed so often.

    but this sentiment scares me
     
  21. Zeke Menuar

    Zeke Menuar Member

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2003
    Messages:
    1,228
    Location:
    Oregon Monsoon Central
    Back on topic please.

    If you'all would refer to my original question. I never said what he did. He was concivited of a Class A felony in Oregon. Sounds like some folks are making things up as they go along.

    If some of you wish to debate the moral/ethical side of a felon getting his gun rights restored, start your own thread and debate away. Leave my thread alone. I am looking for legal answers to a couple of specific questions.

    I told him to join the NRA and have them refer him to a laywer.

    ZM
     
  22. Risasi

    Risasi Member

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2004
    Messages:
    851
    I think I have posted this before...

    But here you go. Don't know about State laws of course.

    http://www.loompanics.com/Articles/LegalFirearms.htm

    As for the rest of you guys. Personally if I am already labelled a criminal then I guess I am already a law breaker. What makes you think as a convicted felon, I am going to start keeping the law?

    But as Zeke said start your own thread...
     
  23. Bemidjiblade

    Bemidjiblade Member

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2004
    Messages:
    160
    Location:
    North Woods, MN
    From the horse's mouth.

    Well, sorry to still be sucking oxygen, what after turning myself in for a felony that no one even knew was committed. :fire:
    I like Chuck Swindoll's quote "Why is it that the more conservative someone is, the less compassionate they become?" Every time I start to hope that's not the case, I run across something like that.

    Back on topic:

    There's the 411 from a felon ( :eek: ) in Minnesota: As of felons released from custody before August 10th 2003 (I missed this cut off by 2 days, grrr), 10 years after their last date of incarceration, they can legally regain their 2nd ammendment rights. After that date, this is no longer allowed. That means that while I get every other right back on February 3rd 2018, I don't get 2nd ammendment back w/o a judge's specific order.

    Phantom Warrior and Slide Lock have probably already drafted the first round of that petition, but they're going to have to wait a while. ;)

    As for black powder: In MN it used to be the case that felons could use muzzle-loaders, but that loophole was closed about 5 years ago, according to my PO. Since she's the woman w/ the discression to throw my butt in jail if I irritate her, I'm going w/ her word.
     
  24. R.H. Lee

    R.H. Lee Member

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2004
    Messages:
    7,377
    Location:
    CA
    Sorry. I didn't realize it was just a BS drug possession charge. We attempted to decrminalize that here awhile back.

    All he has to do is go into a store that sells BP and ask what the procedure is to buy one. If he has to fill out the yellow form (4473?), then he's screwed.
     
  25. dave3006

    dave3006 member

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2003
    Messages:
    898
    A person can be a "felon" for a variety of minor things. All felons are not baby killers. Make the punishments harsh for all real crimes and then let the person be free when they are out.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page