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Can Palm Beach County Do This??

Discussion in 'Legal' started by LethalCep, Feb 22, 2011.

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  1. LethalCep

    LethalCep Member

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    Hey. So this is the story. I ordered a mosin for a website to be shipped to my local FFL dealer. After waiting they call me and say that my item is in. I go in give them my ID and he gives me a big no. He says that because i am 19 years of age that i can't receive the rifle due to the ammunition that it shoots. (***) Arccording to him the only rifles i can buy are shotguns and 22LR. But the florida law states that anyone above the age of 18 can purchase a long rifle. Now i am stuck. Can this guy do this? What should i do next?
     
  2. sappnasty

    sappnasty member

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    That's B.S. Anyone 18 years of age or older can buy any long gun as long as it has the legal barrel length (or unless it has a "pistol grip" - Then you gotta be 21 to pick it up). I used to work at Buck's Gun Rack in Daytona Beach and sold a ton of Mosin's to 18 and 19 year olds. The ammo is 7.62x54R...Obviously not able to be used in any pistol type configuration. I would ask for clarification and if you get no where with that, ask to speak to the owner or head cheese...and then if you get no where with that, I would contact local law enforcement. Just my suggestion.
     
  3. LethalCep

    LethalCep Member

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    That's the same thing i was thinking. It's so stupid. He told me it's military ammunition and when i told him these laws he said Palm Beach County has their seperate thing. But a couple weeks ago my 18 year old friend bought a sks from the gun show down here. I think the guy is just a <deleted>
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 22, 2011
  4. Rubberberner

    Rubberberner Member

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    in the state of florida: sale of any firearm or ammo from an FFL to an individual under the age of 21 is prohibited, however, you can legally own a firearm if purchased from a private seller, or if someone of legal age purchases it and "gifts" it to you.
     
  5. LethalCep

    LethalCep Member

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    That only applies to handguns.
     
  6. Clipper

    Clipper Member

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    You're wrong. It applies to any firearm purchase from an FFL. That's Federal law, and has nothing to do with Florida.
     
  7. DammitBoy

    DammitBoy Member

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    You're wrong, it only applies to handguns, but this is the wrong place for this thread.
     
  8. LethalCep

    LethalCep Member

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    So how are other 18 or 19 year old buying rifles. Also why would the guy say I can buy a shotgun?
     
  9. LethalCep

    LethalCep Member

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    Well this is actually my first thread here so yeah I don't know where it goes. Plus I just said it only applies to handguns the you "corrected" by saying the same thing.
     
  10. o Unforgiven o

    o Unforgiven o Member

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    With all due respect sir, YOU are the one who is wrong here. There is no federal law that states anybody under the age of 21 cannot purchase a gun from an FFL. As previously stated, that only applies to sale of HANDGUNS to someone under the age of 21 from an FFL.

    Again as previously posted, what you said only applies to handguns, and that is federal law that has nothing to do with the state laws of Florida.
     
  11. o Unforgiven o

    o Unforgiven o Member

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    To the OP, there is no reason that you cannot legally have that tansferred to you in anywhere in the state of Florida. If you have already spoken with the owner of the shop, I suggest you call the ATF and let them know of the problem.
     
  12. LethalCep

    LethalCep Member

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    Thanks man will do.
     
  13. doc2rn

    doc2rn Member

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    I would advise you, you attract more bees with honey. Use the subtle approach, take in the florida laws concerning sale of a long arm (AKA rifle) and age limit. They are public documents found on the web. Advise you have spoken with ATF and give name and number to the agent. If he then wishes to refund your money so be it, make sure its all of it including shipping fees FFL fees etc.. As a dealer its his right to refuse to serve you, just vote in the future with your wallet by going elsewhere.
     
  14. HOME DEPOT GEORGE

    HOME DEPOT GEORGE Member

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  15. NavyLCDR

    NavyLCDR member

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    The Florida Statute Rubberberner is referring to is this one:
    What he is failing to consider is the definition of minor, which is contained in this Florida statue:
    Give me a minute to find Florida's preemption statute. The only firearms regulation that counties and cities in Florida can enact are waiting periods and regulating the discharge of firearms.
     
  16. NavyLCDR

    NavyLCDR member

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    Here's your Florida pre-emption statute. It is ILLEGAL for the county to regulate the possession or transfer of firearms beyond what state law allows. State laws allow them to only enact waiting periods for handguns:

    You can find Florida firearms statutes here:
    http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes...ml&StatuteYear=2010&Title=->2010->Chapter 790
     
  17. NavyLCDR

    NavyLCDR member

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    The applicable Federal law, BTW is this:

    18 USC 922 (b)(1):
    http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/18/usc_sec_18_00000922----000-.html
     
  18. HOME DEPOT GEORGE

    HOME DEPOT GEORGE Member

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  19. NavyLCDR

    NavyLCDR member

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    Which appear to be null and void, according to state law.
     
  20. thorn726

    thorn726 Member

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    crazy// you need to print out and bring in all these relevant laws. If you find you are legal, and he continues to withhold, you will have to tell him the police are next which would be terrible- last thing anyone needs is a gun shop owner going down as a two bit scammer. Only advantage in him keeping your gun for a year- either using it or reselling and restocking on your money in meantime? hopefully owner is just confused and afraid of breaking the law. But until he sees it in print himself, you can bet he wont hand it over, so you'll probably have to show him yourself
     
  21. AWorthyOpponent

    AWorthyOpponent Member

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    Palm beach gun shop owners have all gotten together and done this. They claim county ordinances, however there are none on the books. It is the same with them demanding that you purchase any ammo that you shoot on the range. The problem was that there are two main places in this area, and that's about it.

    Palm Beach has tried to do stuff in the past though, such as banning firearms in parks, and other places, however I believe most of it has been taken away because they "found out" about the preemption statute.


    I assume you are dealing with Gator Guns, on Military and Okeechobee. They are IDIOTS. Never believe ANYTHING THEY SAY about guns - at all - ever... They should stick to Archery.

    Shoot Straight opened up on Southern, just east of the turnpike. They seem to know what they are taking about. They have a few stores throughout Florida, and from what I can tell. they don't play into the LGS BS.
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2011
  22. Sebastian the Ibis
    • Contributing Member

    Sebastian the Ibis Member

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    Navy LT said it as well as I could.

    Print out the relevant statutes and take them with you to the gun store. The only thing I can add is that there does not appear to be anything in the Palm Beach code which prevents you from obtaining a Mosin in any event: see Chapter 28 here: http://library4.municode.com/default-test/home.htm?infobase=10323&doc_action=whatsnew

    If he says there is a problem with federal law, have him call the ATF 24 hour hotline at (800) 800-3855 (Toll Free).

    If the gun store owner will not give it to you after 5 days, or (I apologize for sounding condescending) give it to your parents. Both of which seem like efficient solutions for dealing with an idiot. Then he is probably trying to rip you off.

    In that case review s 772.11 Fla. Stat. Civil remedies for criminal acts (theft/conversion) If you have any questions PM me I may be able to help ;)
     
  23. ColtPythonElite

    ColtPythonElite Member

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    Whether it's legal or know, I don't know...However, I would guess that the shop owner can refuse to sell to you even if you go back in with a pile of laws printed out showing the "legality" of the transaction. I don't see that calling law enforcement will get anywhere. I can't imagine that they can force him to sell to you.
     
  24. Bonesinium

    Bonesinium Member

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    You are probably right. But is the shop selling him the gun, or has he already paid and the shop transferring him the gun? I have never done this, so don't know, but it seems like a different situation. I don't know though.

    What I do know, is that if what the OP said about their reason for not letting him get it is true, then they are full of crap. He can't get it because of the ammo it shoots? Really? But if it shot .22lr he could? How does that even make sense...not even NJ has a law that stupid, and I doubt Florida does.
     
  25. ColtPythonElite

    ColtPythonElite Member

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    Even if money has changed hands, LEO won't do anything unless you can prove some sort of crime, such as fraud. Most likely the OP would have to take the shop owner to civil court to recover any lost $$ if the owner refuses to give him a refund.
     
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