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CCW'rs gun used against him in a robbery

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by usmarine0352_2005, May 30, 2012.

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  1. usmarine0352_2005

    usmarine0352_2005 Member

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    .

    His strong arm was hurt when he was slammed against the car so he wasn't able to retain his weapon.



    Think about this when you are training, choosing how you carry your pistol and what type of holster you may use. It could save your life.





    http://www.kare11.com/news/article/977788/396/Conceal-and-carry-permit-holder-robbed-with-own-gun




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  2. oldbear

    oldbear Member

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    Sounds as if it was a totally unprovoked attack with no warning. No matter how much we try you can't be at 100% alert, 100% of the time. If someone puts you on the ground or tightly against a solid object they have a huge advantage. No practical holster would have prevented the B/G from getting his hands on the gun.
     
  3. BK

    BK Member

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    I keep putting off practicing with and carrying a weak side bug.
     
  4. Lex Luthier

    Lex Luthier Member

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    There is a way to walk by questionable people on the street: look them in the eye. It's a shame this guy couldn't see this coming, but how could he allow himself to get close enough to allow such an in jury? I know that area well, and would never have my hands too full, or my eyes not on the situation to not respond.

    The bad guys look for weakness, and perhaps this poor chap was telegraphing the wrong persona. Hope he heals well, and hope the BG pays the greatest price for his actions.
     
  5. jon_in_wv

    jon_in_wv Member

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    Criminals always have the advantage. They attack first, they don't care if they hurt you, and they aren't afraid of going to prison when its over. Even CCW holders are going to lose sometimes.
     
  6. C0untZer0

    C0untZer0 Member

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    The lesson I take away from this - for myself, is:

    1) I need more practive firing one handed

    2) I need more practice firing one handed with my weak hand

    3) When Illinois passes concealed carry, I'm going to be carrying two guns
     
  7. JohnBiltz

    JohnBiltz Member

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    It amazes me that people here think having a gun will save you in every situation. Fights generally go to whoever lands the first effective blow and sometimes you can not control the space around you. He got ambushed, it can happen to anyone.
     
  8. qwert65

    qwert65 Member

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    Sometimes it's not your day. I never open carry, though in this case it may have worked as a deterrent.(speculation)
     
  9. 303tom

    303tom member

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    That is the exact reason I carry my mini in my pocket, if I can get my hand in my pocket, someone is getting shot...............
     
  10. hso

    hso Moderator Staff Member

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    Sounds like another argument for having some additional training in self defense without being totally dependent upon a handgun. The gentleman might have benefitted from SouthNarc's introductory course.
     
  11. huntsman

    huntsman Member

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    +1 on pocket carry, dark street somebody approaches hand in pocket gun in hand and suspect everybody. Carrying a gun can't lull you into a false sense of security.
     
  12. usmarine0352_2005

    usmarine0352_2005 Member

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    I don't think anyone has said having a gun will protect you from every situation.




    I think people are just attempting to learn from another's situation.
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  13. Warp

    Warp Member

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    I think this is a great reminder. I often tell people that just because you conceal your pistol that does not necessarily mean nobody will know it is there...or discover it through something like this. Injured or not an open top holster is extremely difficult to retain your firearm in.
     
  14. blarby

    blarby Member

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    +1 on looking people in the eye.
     
  15. Warp

    Warp Member

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    Some people say looking them in the eye can work against you if it is taken as a challenge, better to scan them to aknowdge their presence and your awareness, but without eye contact
     
  16. Warp

    Warp Member

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    That's not what's going on here...
     
  17. X-Rap

    X-Rap Member

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    I wonder what type of injury made him unable to use his arm? Unless it was broken it looks like it might be a case of lack of will power to totally submit after first contact.
    Good example of what to expect in an attack though. Aside from having a gun this guy seems to have been poorly prepared to survive, this is mere speculation on my part with only the article to formulate an opinion but he was taken out of the game pretty early.
     
  18. tarosean

    tarosean Member

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    He was probably like 90% of the people now-a-days...

    Face buried in a smart phone not paying attention to anything.
     
  19. Neverwinter

    Neverwinter Member

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    We just had a thread where people tried to argue that hand to hand isn't as important as gun skills.

    Sent using Tapatalk 2
     
  20. SharpsDressedMan

    SharpsDressedMan member

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    Police officers get disarmed now and then, as do soldiers. It doesn't always go the way of the good guy............
     
  21. JohnBiltz

    JohnBiltz Member

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    We are all aware of the 21 foot rule for a knife. Its awfully hard to control 21 feet of space on a sidewalk. The guy did not have a blade but instead plowed into the victim driving him into a parked car. That is not the tactic of someone who would be smaller than the victim. He's probably done it before and its a practiced move done from behind the victim. When you get driven into something like a parked car your balance, your center is gone because your weight is now behind your feet and the car will keep you from being able to plant them under you and get any leverage. It was a well timed well executed ambush executed by an ambush predator. If the victim had not had his arm damaged it still might have gotten him killed.
     
  22. Double Naught Spy

    Double Naught Spy Sus Venator

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    I am not sure how I am going to be able to make a gun and holster selection based on this particular type of impacted disability what would also allow for other types of disability and not significantly hinder gun access when not disabled.

    Wow, with no other information, I see we have the victim fully classified with being in condition white and with no will power (too scared) to fight.

    Injuries that would cause a lack of arm use other than breaks? Dislocation of the shoulder, elbow, or wrist, torn muscles, pinched or damages nerves, all of which are possible with impact injuries.

    Just for giggles and grins, next time y'all take a class and have an instructor tell you how s/he is always in condition yellow and knows what is going on around her/him all the time, see how many times you can approach from behind and shoot them with your finger gun or hit them with your imaginary knife. It doesn't make them happy because it reflects that they cannot indeed always being in the condition of readiness that they claim.

    Way back around 2002-2004, Dane Burns provided instruction as part of a Rangemaster class in Dallas. God bless poor Dane. He talked about how he had all sorts of martial arts training and had developed a sixth sense to understand what was happening around him. At lunch at a local Subway eatery, I spied Dane at a table with two other students and I walked over to ask a question. He was recounting his skills to the two students as I stood by patiently, then got impatient. The students were great. They saw me but didn't blow my cover until one started snickering as I went through several movements of feigned aggression and then trying to get as close to him as possible without touching him.

    I have done this sort of awareness test with two others. They were not happy as they had proclaimed their total awareness that they obviously did not have. It makes them look bad, or so they think, but the problem was in their claims, not their lack of awareness. Even the best professionals are not on top of their game every moment of every day.

    As John Blitz noted, you can't control the area around you. 21 feet is an ideal, but one that I would suggest is actually still too close and if you can't control it with just one person from one direction, then you sure as heck can't control it from all directions. And while attacks are often preceded by certain 'tells,' many of the tells that precede attacks are completely normal behaviors. However, not all attacks are preceded in such a manner.
     
  23. X-Rap

    X-Rap Member

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    I don't know what more I can say, there isn't a book written on this encounter but he lost.
    I would love to hear a follow up on what his debilitating injury was. The point I would like to make is much like yours in that bad things happen to good people and we are rarely prepared especially in a very social environment. More often than not what happens after the first blow will determine how we fare.
     
  24. Warp

    Warp Member

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    More to the point, IMO, even if you ARE on top of your game you cannot move about in public, in society, and never allow somebody to get close to you, even from behind.

    I sit at my computer and :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes: every time I read something about how a poster NEVER lets somebody get close to them. Gimme a break.
     
  25. jon_in_wv

    jon_in_wv Member

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    Its considered an insult and challenging in some cultures. You've heard someone say, "What the f*** are you looking at!?!?!" You can make the blanket statement to "look people in the eye," but having worked first hand with criminals for the last 20 years, I'll just say good luck with that.
     
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