Compact that powder baby!!!!

[Bentnail63]

So I been loading rifle brass for 223 but am going to start working with 7.62x39 and noticing that when nosing thru the books and powders that many of the powders are showing the "C" meaning compacted. I noticed there is a few powders that are not "C" set like CFE BLK. I am kind of shying away from this but if it is feasible or simple to do then I will pursue.

SO how do I compact the powder in a case after I have pressed in a primer?

I was thinking that I need to slightly vibrate to settle the powder?

OR Lightly tamp the powder in the case with a dowel rod shaped to the mouth with a 1000th like a RCH less diameter?

OR does this happen when seating bullet, does depth of the seating compact the powder somewhat?

Thank you

 

[Ranger99]

Try a drop tube first.
That's the traditional way for a
compressed powder load

 

[.38 Special]

For the most part, the powder is simply compressed by seating the bullet.

In extreme situations, things like drop tubes and vibration and powder compression dies/plugs can be helpful or even necessary.

I personally think it is a mistake to heavily compress charges. If you need anything more than a slight bit of extra pressure while seating your bullets, you probably need a faster powder. https://guns.fandom.com/wiki/.458_Winchester_Magnum

 

[Bentnail63]

For the most part, the powder is simply compressed by seating the bullet.

In extreme situations, things like drop tubes and vibration and powder compression dies/plugs can be helpful or even necessary.

I personally think it is a mistake to heavily compress charges. If you need anything more than a slight bit of extra pressure while seating your bullets, you probably need a faster powder. https://guns.fandom.com/wiki/.458_Winchester_Magnum

Yeah I noticed that CFE BLK does not need to be compacted for 7.62x39 rounds. I am going to explore that direction but noticed that most other powders are showing Compacted for MAX charge.

 

[lordpaxman]

I am kind of shying away from this but if it is feasible or simple to do then I will pursue.

The few loads I’ve tried that were “C”, the base of the bullet barely compressed the powder. IIR the starting load didn’t even compress. If the published load data indicates “C”, don’t worry, be happy. I wouldn’t let that deter me, especially if the powder is available.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

Yeah I noticed that CFE BLK does not need to be compacted for 7.62x39 rounds. I am going to explore that direction but noticed that most other powders are showing Compacted for MAX charge.

Avoid MAX charges.

Compacting the powder is typically just seating the bullet. You’ll hear a “crunch” with some stick powders (IMR Lincoln Logs) but with Ball, flattened sphere and spherical powders you probably won’t even notice a difference. Just use the correct charge for best results and don’t worry about if it is compressed. It’s very doubtful you can shoot the difference.

 

[Blue68f100]

Some of my most accurate loads are compressed. So don't shy away from them. Like said a long drop tube will compressed the load. Now with that said tubular/stick powders can easily be compressed since they will break up. If your using a fine ball or flake powder not so much.

 

[papajim2jordan]

I kinda like hearing those sticks go crunch. Being a bit dyslexic, I first read the title as baby powder. Sort of chapped my cheeks. If nothing else, powder orientation will be one less concern.

 

[MEHavey]

simply compressed by seating the bullet.

^^^^ This ^^^^
with unique exception of very soft cast/highly compressed black powder

 

[Varminterror]

SO how do I compact the powder in a case after I have pressed in a primer?

Seat the bullet on top of it. It’s that simple.

I was thinking that I need to slightly vibrate to settle the powder?

Vibrating or using a drop tube can eliminate compaction of sub-100% case fill loads, but it still doesn’t eliminate compressed loads for many max charge weights.

Plainly, compressing powders which are listed as safe to compress is safe. Even to the point of compressing so far that the powder starts pushing the bullet back out of the case after seating. There are powders which should not be compressed, but for those listed as safe, it’s safe. It is nothing but an old wives’ tale to suggest compressed charges become “spikey” or suddenly increases pressure for those powders which are listed and known to be safe to compress.

Hell, many powders ONLY behave their best when they are compressed.

 

[25-20 WCF]

Yeah I noticed that CFE BLK does not need to be compacted for 7.62x39 rounds. I am going to explore that direction but noticed that most other powders are showing Compacted for MAX charge.

It has nothing to do with "needing" to be compressed at all, CFE BLK is just a more dense powder with a faster burning rate than some others. The appropriate amount simply fits in the case without compression. Maximum charges of some other powders are bigger and fill the case better, requiring compression in order to seat the bullet. Don't be afraid, just do it.


.

 

[DustyRusty]

The stem of your seating die may imprint a ring on your bullet because of the pressure required to compress.
If that bothers you, they offer different seating stems for different bullets to minimize that.
I used a long drop tube to compress powder as much as it could. Just a personal preference.

 

[Show Me]

Note for example a powder won't be compressed under a HDY SP but will under a SST in that caliber.
Compressed is an issue when you seat your bullet and it won't stay where you put it. In that caliber.
The SST sets deeper.
CFE BLK is the bomb in X39.
I just back off when the case is too full. That's loading 101.
Max load isn't something to strive for anyway like has already been mentioned.

 

[Walkalong]

For the most part, the powder is simply compressed by seating the bullet.

In extreme situations, things like drop tubes and vibration and powder compression dies/plugs can be helpful or even necessary.

Correct, the C stands for compressed, meaning only that it gives more than 100% fill of the open space after seating a bullet. Very few loads in manuals will be compressed enough we have to use long thin drop tubes to get the powder down to where it doesn't interfere with bullet seating, so mostly it just compresses a little when you seat the bullet.

OR does this happen when seating bullet, does depth of the seating compact the powder somewhat?

Yep, rarely anything else with most book loads. Don't let it scare you away. Most of my loads are not compressed, but there are many examples of it that do., and I have a few where the bullet compresses the powder slightly. My 6 PPC load needed to be dropped through a long thin tube to make it settle enough not to seat very hard.

 

[zeke]

On the rare occasion am needing the extra powder, am using vibration to settle the powder. Either by rap at tapping individual case, or lightly vibrating a lot of 50 in load tray. Imo, a filled case is conducive to better accuracy , but shy away from compressing powder as believe you may make powder column compressed unevenly. And it is just an opinion.

 

[Bentnail63]

The stem of your seating die may imprint a ring on your bullet because of the pressure required to compress.
If that bothers you, they offer different seating stems for different bullets to minimize that.
I used a long drop tube to compress powder as much as it could. Just a personal preference.

I called Lee and they said send them a couple of bullets and $8.00 and then will make a die seating for that bullet for me.

 

[MEHavey]

OOC: What bullet/powder/load requires that much compression with cast bullets?

 

[Bentnail63]

OOC: What bullet/powder/load requires that much compression with cast bullets?

7.62x39 with most all powders are calling for compacted at MAX loads except so far CFE BLK does not. I am starting to build loads for my single shot Baikal Russia Remington. SO using 123gr Hornady SST's and possible others.

 

[PWC]

Compressed simply means a full case, usually slightly into the neck, and correctly seating the bullet compresses the powder.

 

[lightman]

I've shot slightly compressed charges with no problem. I don't want a charge where I can feel a higher resistance than I feel when normally seating a bullet but litely compressed doesn't bother me. If its in the loading book it should be safe. But work up to max loads with a little caution. You can relieve some of your concerns of compressed charges with either a powder funnel with a drop tube of by gently tapping on the case while dumping the powder. I use my middle finger on the hand that is holding the case to thump on the side of it while pouring the powder.
Loading for the 7.62X39 has other issues that bother me more than compressed charges. The bore diameter can vary from rifle to rifle. Some are .308 and others can be .311-.313. And the other thing that annoys me is that brass can have both small and large primer pockets. Not a big deal, just something else to pay attention to.

 

[armoredman]

I loaded a lot of compressed powder loads in 7.62x39mm with Accurate Arms #1680, ( THE powder for 7.62x39mm, IMHO), and never had to do anything unusual, just seated the bullet like always, no problems in any firearms used.

 

[Jim Watson]

When I had a .222 I loaded it with IMR 4895 because that is what I had for .30-06.
Fill 'er up and crunch a bullet down on it.

A soft cast bullet over black is different, use a drop tube, vibrator, or/and compression die to avoid squashing the lead bullet.

 

[mm93]

I would never compress powder by seating the bullet into it. It can cause problems with your bullets depending on how much you compress it. Most people use a compression die that fits into the press to exactly compress each charge the same amount, and then seat the bullet over that.
I personally only compress black powder, and when loading smokeless I stick with loads and data that don't suggest compressing powder.

 

[Walkalong]

If it’s causing issues with seating, yes, that’s too much, but a little compression doesn’t hurt a thing. If it did, there wouldn’t be so many published loads that are compressed.

 

[westernrover]

Compressed loads are reported by Redding to cause damage to Redding bullet seating dies, the competition seating dies.