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Concealed carriers can be the worst people.

Discussion in 'Handguns: General Discussion' started by wild cat mccane, Oct 4, 2009.

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  1. ArmedBear

    ArmedBear Member

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    Look, when I took the class that Idaho requires, one of the things that the instructors hammered home was that, if you carry a concealed weapon, you pretty much give up your right to act like a "bad-ass" if you want to stay out of trouble.

    That means no giving stink-eye at someone for looking at your female companion, no doing anything that could be interpreted as you starting or contributing to a fight.

    Apologize even if you're in the right. Do what you can to make it CLEAR you don't want to fight. If you have to use your gun, you want to make sure that you are completely innocent of starting or escalating ANYTHING.

    Why? You might be perfectly fine in a criminal court, but in a civil court, you can still end up paying.

    In some states, there are self-defense protections, but not in all. Not even in Idaho, where carrying in a bar is perfectly legal, open-carrying on the state capital steps is perfectly legal, and guns are as common as any other power tool.

    If you are carrying, you have NO BUSINESS giving someone a threatening look when he's doing nothing illegal. If you want to get in a fight over some guy leaving a bar and admiring your female companion (not threatening, not assaulting), then DON'T CARRY. If your mentality is such that you think that you are right to act threateningly towards people for whatever reason you devise, then DON'T CARRY. You're bad for the rest of us.

    In all seriousness, if someone gave me a threatening look, which is what you did, I might put my hand in draw position, not as a threat, but because I feel like a threat to me is possibly imminent. There's nothing illegal or immoral about readying yourself to defend yourself against an attacker, when you've done nothing to provoke the attack. And looking at a woman in public is neither illegal, nor any justification for an attack.
     
    Last edited: Oct 4, 2009
  2. ArmedBear

    ArmedBear Member

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    Ditto.

    (The other advantage is that you can actually get the gun out if you need to.)
     
  3. megatronrules

    megatronrules Member

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    This is a strange post indeed however I must say that us men do tend to look and sometimes over look at an attractive woman. I've had this happen to me as well when out with my wife is and attractive brunette with a nice rack. do men look at her above and below the neck? yup they sure do,but as along as they don't disrespect i don't care because shes going home with me.

    I think some members of the male gender never grow up past a high school or junior high school mind set of "hey you better not look at my girl". Give me a break if you don't want someone to gawk at your car then don't drive a Ferrari drive a ford or a yugo. The same applies to woman you date an attractive broad with a nice body men(assuming they're straight) ARE GONNA LOOK AT HER. So get over it already.
     
  4. HexHead

    HexHead Member

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    Not necessarily. It's legal here in TN as long as the place isn't posted.
     
  5. orionengnr

    orionengnr Member

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    Yep.
    Yep.

    Considering that you don't even have a state listed for location, I can't even form an opinion on legality...
    Big-time-yep.

    Triple-yep.
    You start out by saying that concealed carriers are the worst people, and then go on to prove your point...in a way I don't think you intended.

    Take a long, hard look in the mirror. Given the evidence, it seems that you are the problem.
     
    Last edited: Oct 4, 2009
  6. wheelgunslinger

    wheelgunslinger Member

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    Sorry man, but the look you were giving me gave me the heebie jeebies. You must have learned how to pop your crazy eyes from Eddie Griffin.

    And, I do not look fortyish. Do I? :(
     
  7. oneounceload

    oneounceload member

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    Still doesn't matter - IF the idiot WAS carrying AND threatening a brandishing or worse, HE needs a comeuppance......Bars, plus booze, equals instant azzhole, and you don't need to aggravate the situation - but the other moron needs a time out care of the county
     
  8. bigfatdave

    bigfatdave Member

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    oneounceload, how do you know the guy exiting had been drinking? Can you reliably determine his exact level of impairment from the OP?
    For all you know it was a bar/grill - exactly the type of establishment that forces me to disarm is I want to stay legal here in Ohio.
    Not every person exiting a bar is drunk, or even the least bit intoxicated. All you have to go on is a one-sided personal account, presented without context, evidence, or a NPOV ... of course the person telling the story is the hero who felt threatened, because the story wouldn't be getting told if he felt otherwise.

    And how the hell does "threatening a brandishing" work? Either you "brandish" or you don't, the brandishing is the threatening act.
     
  9. Tacbandit

    Tacbandit Member

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    "prudence" can and should also include choosing our entertainment destinations a little more carefully...not a judgement on this particular situation, ....just an observation in general...
     
  10. Tacbandit

    Tacbandit Member

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    Depending on where you are...just showing a weapon can be construed as "brandishing"
     
  11. c919

    c919 Member

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    "Is that a broomhandle in your pocket, or are you just..... oh pocket carry C96, sorry sir, carry on."
     
  12. KingAirDriver

    KingAirDriver Member

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    FWIW, here in KS you are able to legally carry concealed into a bar, provided it is not posted with the "Gunbuster." However, if you carry into a bar, you'd better not be drinkin'!
     
  13. wild cat mccane

    wild cat mccane Member

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    Okay, clearly I missed some information that made people wonder why I pissed off a guy that was wearing tighter jeans, had a obvious compact auto in his pocket, and I clearly need to clean up how I glanced quickly at a guy that that stared at my girlfriend for about 20 seconds, also doing it when we were walking away.

    I am not a cave man. I am aware of the male/male competition and that smoking girls get looked at. Yet we are civilized are we not?

    So cliff notes for those that think I did something wrong that made someone grab a gun in their pocket.

    A. Utah.
    B. 2 40-50 year old men. I am 25. My girlfriend of 5 years is 24.
    C. i glanced at him after they walked past. at this point he should have had his back to us, but instead was being such a jerk he was staring right back body facing OUR BACKS
    D. for about a 25 yards away I could make out a compact auto in his tighter jeans.
    E. I understand pocket carry is a tactical advantage. I carry mine this way. But am I threatening when I walking into a bar with my girlfriend?
    F. No, I was not carrying, so no, he did not assume I was carrying too.
    G. When I said he grabbed his gun, I mean to say he stuck his hand into the pocket that clearly had the gun, grabbed the clear handle of that gun, and held it there like he was going to draw it on me.

    I am totally taken aback from some responses.
     
  14. 9MMare

    9MMare Member

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    If this is the rudest encounter this poster has has out in public lately, he's exceptionally lucky....carrying or not. And his sensitivity is a bit concerning since he's relating it to his own CC.
     
  15. Lincoln7

    Lincoln7 Member

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    I don't hate you, Wild Cat. I agree that most of the replys here were unneccessarily harsh. I would also be very uncomfortable if I had encountered someone who is carrying and has possibly been drinking, reach to grasp their firearm in response to your presence. Not cool.
     
  16. Frank Ettin

    Frank Ettin Moderator Staff Member

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    I suspect that a major reason for the harsh response was that you seemed to make the unwarranted assumption that this fellow was an honest person lawfully carrying a concealed weapon. And you titled your post, "Concealed carriers can be the worst people." That's painting all lawful carriers of concealed weapons with an awful broad brush based on one encounter with someone who may not, in fact, have been an honest citizen with a permit to carry a concealed gun.
     
  17. christcorp

    christcorp Member

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    This reminds me of:

    "Once upon a time........"
     
  18. gglass

    gglass Member

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    Hmmm... Why might some of the responses to this post be a little hostile? Could it possibly be the intimation one reads into the title to this thread? "Concealed carriers can be the worst people."

    I have always been under the impression that concealed handgun license holders are just about the safest and most law abiding of any other demographic group.

    Here is a link to a TEXAS DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SAFETY report showing just how safe you are around CHL licensees.

    http://www.txdps.state.tx.us/administration/crime_records/chl/ConvictionRatesReport2007.pdf
     
  19. Wildyams

    Wildyams Member

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    Wild Cat,
    let me start out by saying welcome to THR. You will soon find that we have many knowledgeable people around here. It is not our intent to hurt you or your feelings. One thing you will learn is when you ask for our opinions or present us with a scenario, you will get exactly that, our opinions. Most of us don't sugar coat things with layers of b.s. If they feel you are doing something wrong, they will let you know. That is one of the main reasons I come to THR when I have a question, because I can expect a good answer, even if its not what I want to hear.
    From what I have read in this thread, nothing was too far out of line.

    As for your situation, yeah, I would have been uncomfortable. Maybe you could have cooled things down with a casual "hi" or "good evening" to its not just uncomfortable stares being exchanged.
     
  20. Lonestar49

    Lonestar49 Member

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    Outlaws

    ...

    Funny how bars, booze, guns, women, bring out the_best in the old west type days..

    Same testosterone, same, quick, jealousy's, same stupid fights with min eye contacts.. Well, almost in this case.

    But mix the three main elements and the one with the girl is the most hated by the ones without a girl..

    Just now its cars instead of horses as everyone leaves or arrives.


    Ls
     
  21. jad0110

    jad0110 Member

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    My thoughts as well. How do you know this jerk was carrying legally? Typically, people who go to the trouble / hassle of getting a permit don't do retarded stuff like this and risk loosing their 2nd amendment rights forever. I pocket carry from time-to-time, and I few times I've put my hand in my pocket on the grip of my 642 when in Col Cooper's "condition orange", but I'm always pretty casual about it not drawing attention to what is in my pocket.

    Also, and I really don't mean this to sound harsh towards you, but I used to know a guy that, errr, dressed like a 'banger even though he was about the nicest person you'd ever meet. But he still looked like TROUBLE. Don't know if this may be a factor for you or not.
     
  22. LightningMan

    LightningMan Member

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    Just because you think or know for sure that someone is carring a concealed firearm doesn't mean they have a legal permit to do so. Just a thought, LM.
     
  23. jackstinson

    jackstinson Member

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    Quit looking at everyone's pockets and below their waists. That is just CREEPY!
    As far as I read, the OP has placed himself in the "Concealed carriers can be the worst people" category with his behavior toward a perfect stranger who passed by him and happened to look at a (hopefully) pretty girl.
    I guess playing music in bars for the past three decades has made me somewhat immune to guys "checking out my lady". She's a grown woman and takes care of herself when I am playing and she is in the club.
    Frankly, my wife would be ticked off if no one checked her out...most women would be (whether they care to admit it or not). Women do not get all dressed up to NOT be noticed....Duh.
    The fashion industry would shut down if women didn't want to be looked at and "checked out" ........ Men as well!
     
  24. Double Naught Spy

    Double Naught Spy Sus Venator

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    How can you say people want to be checked out in on sentence and then tell the OP to not check the pockets below the waist because it is creepy? A lot of fashion happens below the waist.

    Besides, what is wrong with threat assessment. You you willing to give up personal security by not checking out that which is readily visible?
     
  25. meef

    meef Member

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    mccane....

    Are you for real? (and I mean that in the most honest, sincere and helpful sort of way)

    You come on a predominantly firearms forum and post a thread titled "Concealed carriers can be the worst people".

    You're taken aback because folks take exception to this? Go figure.

    Or let's try this scenario:

    You wander in off the Internet to a Catholic forum and post a thread that goes like this:

    Honestly dude, fess up... are you a troll?

    :cool:
     
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