Constitution Restoration Act

[TaurusCIA]

Please try to keep the comments, etc. related to the constitutionality issues and not individual religious preferences.

Thank you.

Constitution Restoration Act

I haven't read it all yet but sounds like a step in the right direction to restore God/Creator to the historical position given in the Declaration of Independence...If it does not attempt to establish a particular religion to the exclusion of others.

The word God has very broad meaning and our Creator can't be put in anyones box. I should be free to express my beliefs and celebrate them but so should everyone else.

 

[bobs1066]

" Prohibiting public officials from recognizing God violates the Constitution's Tenth and First Amendments."

Public officials can recognize the Great Turnip in their private lives any way they see fit. What they do on company time is another matter.

 

[TaurusCIA]

The Declaration of Independence

When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.

No it actually IS the matter.

The nation was born because of the belief in a Creator/God who gave us certain rights. It is not to be excluded from there work. It should guide and shape their actions. If our rights are not given by God/Creator then they are not Unalienable Rights. This is the problem with Judges wanting to limit our rights. They believe they are not unalienable and that they should determine when/how they are lost.

Great Turnip

Trying to use derogatory language to stir people up is a little childish.

 

[MrAcheson]

Public officials can recognize the Great Turnip in their private lives any way they see fit. What they do on company time is another matter.

Yeah cause its not like my religious expression is protected by the constitution. So for some reason who I work for gives you the right to meddle in my religious expression? Cause whatever I do is an act of congress after all...

 

[bobs1066]

Maybe I could have been less edgy. The idea of congress whacking the court system on the head & demanding that they display Christian symbols struck me as a bad idea.

 

[Mr. Clark]

Maybe I could have been less edgy. The idea of congress whacking the court system on the head & demanding that they display Christian symbols struck me as a bad idea.

It is a bad idea. A horrible idea, in fact. An idea dreamed up by people who want to control your life just as surely as the liberals do, they just have different priorities. They have now adopted the left's methods as well. I don't think anyone thinks this is where it will end.

God can not be seperated from religion. Period. And religion should be left out of government.

And let's stop this silliness about the founders being christian. Some were. Some were deists (look it up), Jefferson being the best known, some like Thomas Paine were openly hostile to religion, any religion. Read "Common Sense" by Paine, it is an amazing work.

who I work for gives you the right to meddle in my religious expression

If it's on my dime, yes. Do it on your own time with your own money or don't do it.


[Edited to add: There is the whole philosophy of natural rights and natural law that make clear that our rights are inalienble, coming from our nature as humans, that don't refer to a God at all. Ayn Rand being the latest. However, almost every philospher of the enlightenment used a natural law argument, realizing that if God was used to justify rights it would be very easy for some people to say that if you don't believe in God, or MY God, then you have no claim to any rights. Given the era they were working in they just didn't want to go there.]

 

[TaurusCIA]

I don't believe there should be exclusively Christian symbols or any other single religion. I think that God/Creator where used to show that our rights are given by a person, power or authority greater than man so man has no authority to take them away through legislation or judicial decisions.


I do believe that religious symbols should be displayed in their historical context but again not to the exclusion of others that also have historical context.

 

[TaurusCIA]

God can not be separated from religion.

And God can't be separated from the foundation of our country.

The Declaration of Independence

When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.

And let's stop this silliness about the founders being christian.

Whether they were Christian or had some other belief about their origin and purpose, they did choose to put it in the historical record that our right to become a country was given to us by a higher power (God/Creator).

 

[TaurusCIA]

And religion should be left out of government.

Amendment I
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.

The point of the "establishment of religion" restriction was not to force religion out of public life but to protect people from a state mandated religion. It was not meant to remove God/Creator from the foundation of our country.

"the free exercise thereof" means free exercise.

 

[SodiumBenzoate]

I'm all for the right to worship a god (or gods), but I am completely against any state acknowledgement or denial of the existence of a god. Religion just should not be a part of government.

 

[Mr. Clark]

Taurus:

My edit and your post crossed. Sorry.

God can be seperated from the origin of our country. It often was. The Decleration and the Constitution are two different documents with two different purposes. The Bill of Rights, all of them, show which side the founders came down on.

It always amazes me that people who want to remove the current crop of socialists, through legislation, or the use of arms if necessary, expect the people who go through all of that with them to continue to let them steal money from them when it is all over to support ideas those people don't agree with, just because they happened to have been on the right side of the gun issue and those ideas aren't socialist ideas.

Why aren't you happy just living your life the way you want? Why do you want to impose your beleifs on others? How is that different than what the liberals are doing to you?

 

[Mr. Clark]

The point of the "establishment of religion" restriction was not to force religion out of public life

No, it was meant to force religion out of government.

"the free exercise thereof" means free exercise

So I'm free to practice any religion I want, any way I want, I just have to practice one? How is that not an establishment of religion? Granted it isn't the establishment of a specific religion, but how is it not an establishment of religion?

 

[Kaylee]

I'm locking this thread because of the poor luck we've had with religious threads on THR in the past. They have inevitably degenerated into flamefests within a couple pages, so I'm nipping this one in the bud.

To the vast majority of y'all who can control yourselves and debate civilly, my apologies.

-K