Country music star gives CCW weapon to off-duty Minneapolis officer to protect in Las Vegas

[Aim1]

Shows how important concealed carry can be. John Rich is one of the biggest names in country music today being one 1/2 of the famous country duo Big & Rich. Interestingly enough this singer was carrying concealed with his permit during the time of the shooting after they had just performed at the concert and were at his bar celebrating.

Apparently he was at the bar when they got the call that there was an active shooter. He said that he and bar patrons started stacking chairs and tables against the windows and doors and were sheltering in place when an off-duty Minneapolis (Minnesota) police officer showed him his badge, asked if he was carrying and said for the first time in his life he didn't have his own pistol on him and if he could borrow the country stars pistol to guard the front door in case the suspect(s) tried to enter. The country star obliged and said that the off-duty cop took held point on the door protecting everyone inside vigilantly for 2 hours.

In all of this sadness it's good to know that there are good people who are still willing to help and protect each other. The cop and the singer are heroes here.

It also goes to show you how important concealed/open carry is. Instead of being victims these people were able to protect themselves. And instead of having an entourage of bodyguards this famous musician chose to protect himself the old fashioned way.

This is why I think carry reciprocity is so important, your 2nd Amendment rights shouldn't change when you cross state lines. Can you imagine if your 1st Amendment rights to Free Speech changed when you entered a different state? It would be unacceptable, yet, people have no problem doing that to 2nd Amendment rights. Your driving privileges carry over from one state to another and driving is a privilege, not a right!



http://www.foxnews.com/entertainmen...police-officer-during-las-vegas-shooting.html

Country music's John Rich gave his gun to a police officer during Las Vegas shooting

John Rich, of Big & Rich, performed at the Route 91 Harvest Festival shortly before shots rang out at the show.

The country star was hanging out at the Redneck Riveria bar, which he owns, after his performance when the crowd at the festival was barraged with bullets.

The gun owner gave his weapon to an off-duty police officer.

 

[Hokie_PhD]

Kudos to him.
And the only thing I disagree with you is where you say "your 2nd Amendment rights shouldn't change when you cross state lines." THEY DON'T. The CONSTITUTION says NOTHING about being a resident of a state. It says nothing about a state having the right to INFRINGE your right. In fact it's VERY CLEAR and states...

SHALL NOT INFRINGE

in other words contrary to anyone who doesn't like our Constitution and especially the 2nd Amendment the states DO NOT have THE RIGHT to deny us of our CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS.

As for this situation. I've been trapped with an active shooter and not been armed only using my martial arts training to cover the door. I'm glad they had folks that knew to not follow the advice of hiding under a desk or other stuff and did what they could to keep an attacker from coming in.

 

[BigBore44]

While you’d have a hell of a time getting me to relinquish my weapon in an active shooter situation, I think this might be a circumstance where it would make sense for one to do so. A very rare situation indeed.

 

[Hokie_PhD]

While you’d have a hell of a time getting me to relinquish my weapon in an active shooter situation, I think this might be a circumstance where it would make sense for one to do so. A very rare situation indeed.

It’s an unusual case. But so are most active shooter cases.

It would seem a police officer would stand less chance of being charged or sued. So I can see giving him a gun. I’m with you on being Leary of doing so, but unless you’re there it’s hard to say what you’d do. I’ve been in such a case and I’d still have a hard time saying what I’d do.

I can tell you that when you hear a shot the first reaction is to wonder what’s going on. The second is to get cover. After that, time goes into slow motion and all that’s when training and instinct come in. In my case I handed my phone to a student to call 911 and I went to the door to be ready to grab the gunman if he came in. Had I been armed I’d have stayed mostly under cover and aimed for the door. Then watched to see if it was police or the gunman entering.

FYI college desks make crappy cover so I’d even rethink that part as most guns will go right through them.

 

[Milt1]

I'm not sure I'd have turned my pistol over that easy. There was an incident that I read about that happened years ago and I don't remember which state it happened in. There were some shooters at a local spot were people could go and shoot. I don't think it was a club rather just a place off the road. A guy pulls up and tells the shooters that he's with a law enforcement agency and that everyone there is shooting illegally and he is going to have to confiscate their weapons. He also produced a badge. When he collected several of the firearms he started shooting the people that were there. I forget the outcome but that incident has stuck in my mind ever since I read it. As I said, I'm not sure I'd have turned my pistol over that easy.

 

[ColtPythonElite]

I wouldn't have given up my gun.

 

[CapnMac]

I wouldn't have given up my gun.

Probably no one who has read The Onnion Field would either.

Just what would an out-of-state, off-duty, out-of-uniform LEO done that would have been any different than what an LTC holder would do? Was he planning on running, badge and gun in the air to the sound of the gunfire?

 

[ontarget]

Not sure I could give mine up either. May possibly give up a BUG if I had one at the time. Who's to say it wasn't a ploy to disarm anyone carrying in the place then turn the gun on them?

 

[BigBore44]

Probably no one who has read The Onnion Field would either.

Just what would an out-of-state, off-duty, out-of-uniform LEO done that would have been any different than what an LTC holder would do? Was he planning on running, badge and gun in the air to the sound of the gunfire?

Really? I’m guessing you haven’t read anything about the incident involving the officer. He borrowed the gun and stood point at the door of the bar for over two hours. Pretty sad, and unnecessarily inflammatory assumption/accusation from you.

 

[shafter]

I wonder what the officer would have done if Rich had said no. You can hardly blame a man for wanting to turn over his weapon, but with wholesale slaughter going on outside I think there are a lot of officers who wouldn't take no for an answer. Although it would go against the grain I think most legal gun owners would hand it over if the cop could quickly prove who he was.

 

[MedWheeler]

I won't critique that actual event, since I know neither the officer involved nor John Rich, and I certainly don't know the training levels and capabilities of either.

Were this exact scenario to play out for me, my response would probably depend on whether or not the OD-LEO worked for an agency that had jurisdiction in that area. If my loved ones were already "taken care of" and I was carrying more than one firearm, I might be inclined to arm him and tell him to deputize me (something a Florida officer, deputy, or trooper can do.) If I had only one firearm on me, I can't say right now how I'd react, but I'd at least offer to assist and/or be deputized. These are assuming the officer made it clear he's only intending to help guard, not to abandon us while taking my gun.

If the LEO is outside his jurisdiction, then he's no more a LEO than I am, and I'd keep my firearm (FWIW, I'm an ex-LEO myself, so I could be as "qualified" as he is to guard a door with a gun, too.) I still might arm him if I'm carrying more than one gun, though.

 

[CoalTrain49]

in other words contrary to anyone who doesn't like our Constitution and especially the 2nd Amendment the states DO NOT have THE RIGHT to deny us of our CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS.

They may not have that right but they certainly exercise it and have for a very long time with the blessing of the supreme court.

People are denied their constitutional rights every day and it just isn't their 2A rights. In theory you are correct, but what is practiced carries more weight. If the constitution says you can carry but a local ordinance says you can't and nobody carries what is the sum total of the effect of the constitution? Effectively none.

 

[entropy]

I won't critique that actual event, since I know neither the officer involved nor John Rich, and I certainly don't know the training levels and capabilities of either.

Were this exact scenario to play out for me, my response would probably depend on whether or not the OD-LEO worked for an agency that had jurisdiction in that area. If my loved ones were already "taken care of" and I was carrying more than one firearm, I might be inclined to arm him and tell him to deputize me (something a Florida officer, deputy, or trooper can do.) If I had only one firearm on me, I can't say right now how I'd react, but I'd at least offer to assist and/or be deputized. These are assuming the officer made it clear he's only intending to help guard, not to abandon us while taking my gun.

If the LEO is outside his jurisdiction, then he's no more a LEO than I am, and I'd keep my firearm (FWIW, I'm an ex-LEO myself, so I could be as "qualified" as he is to guard a door with a gun, too.) I still might arm him if I'm carrying more than one gun, though.

I'm guessing John Rich didn't want to stand guard at the door of his saloon, and welcomed the Mpls. cop's doing so. I doubt he came in saying "anybody has a gun needs to give it to me now!"

 

[GRIZ22]

One of the reasons I carry 2. I've been doing this for years.

There are a variety of situations where someone who is trained is not armed. If you have two guns and give them one, you've increased the bag guy's problem by 100%.

 

[CDW4ME]

I avoid places I can't carry: metal detectors, states where my permit is not valid.
I drive to my destination on vacation.
25 years ^

Off duty cop should have done the same and he wouldn't be asking others for a weapon.

 

[MedWheeler]

entropy writes:

I'm guessing John Rich didn't want to stand guard at the door of his saloon, and welcomed the Mpls. cop's doing so. I doubt he came in saying "anybody has a gun needs to give it to me now!"

I agree. Nothing in my post indicated otherwise.

 

[sequins]

This is a classic example of 2 is 1, and 1 is none.

Always carry a BUG!

 

[ColtPythonElite]

You can't carry a gun for every sheep in the herd.

 

[Choctaw]

Probably no one who has read The Onnion Field would either.

Just what would an out-of-state, off-duty, out-of-uniform LEO done that would have been any different than what an LTC holder would do? Was he planning on running, badge and gun in the air to the sound of the gunfire?

What an ignorant post. My firearms law enforcement training is light years ahead of any LTC holder. After many years of law enforcement I know when and how to fight. You don't learn that in a 3 day school or plinking at the range.

Before you slam law enforcement, you should probably read about those who acted heroically that day.

 

[Sam1911]

What an ignorant post. My firearms law enforcement training is light years ahead of any LTC holder. After many years of law enforcement I know when and how to fight. You don't learn that in a 3 day school or plinking at the range.

Now hold on. Let's not go accusing each other of ignorant posts. The truth is that some law enforcement officers are very well trained in "when and HOW to fight" and some are less so. Some self-defense practitioners are highly versed in both law and tactics and would probably be better off retaining their weapon. (Ahem...especially if they guy they might be handing it to was of a mindset to leave his gun home...) People from both sets have demonstrated in my presence either amazing mastery and/or very scary lack of basic competence.

So let's have a little respect for the fact that there's not a clear answer and both points of view have merit.

 

[.308 Norma]

Interestingly enough this singer was carrying concealed with his permit during the time of the shooting after they had just performed at the concert and were at his bar celebrating.

Aim 1, just for the sake of clarification, you said they were at "his bar" - does John Rich own the bar where they were celebrating?
Anyway, to answer the original question - I might hand over my gun to another person (police officer or not) in a situation like that if I'd been drinking, and felt that the other person would be better able to protect me in my inebriated state. I'd rather deal with a hangover than a gunshot wound along with a hangover.

 

[Aim1]

Aim 1, just for the sake of clarification, you said they were at "his bar" - does John Rich own the bar where they were celebrating?
Anyway, to answer the original question - I might hand over my gun to another person (police officer or not) in a situation like that if I'd been drinking, and felt that the other person would be better able to protect me in my inebriated state. I'd rather deal with a hangover than a gunshot wound along with a hangover.

I believe that John Rich does own the bar.

 

[Ironicaintit]

I don't think I could hand mine over. If I thought he was legit, I may ask where he'd like me to post. But, I couldn't relinquish my weapon to somebody who has already proven to be less prepared than myself.

That's just my knee jerk reaction, with no offense meant to those who go, "once more into the breach"

 

[Meplat 308]

Candidly speaking, I can go into most "novelty" stores in any major urban center and get a replica badge for ten bucks (Price may vary based on location). I'm not giving my pistol to anybody. Far too many variables in a very confusing situation.

Besides, if someone knows you've got a gun, you're doing it wrong.

 

[shafter]

It would be interesting to examine the legal aspects of an officer ordering someone to turn over their weapon. I know an out of state officer doesn't have legal grounds, but I know that in some jurisdictions an officer can commandeer a vehicle under certain circumstances. During a mass casualty event I'm pretty sure someone who has properly identified themselves as a LEO of that state by badge and ID may have legal grounds for doing the same with firearms.