Ridge
Member
I think you should take a leason from Homosexual's on this one (Yes,I support gay rights) say it loud and say it proud "I refuse to be a victim!" be open about it,reguardless of how they act they are still your family.
Cry For Help From a Closet Gunnie
- Thread starter Doctor Suarez
- Start date
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I had a similar situation, all the nearby members of my family are somewhere between Liberals and slightly reformed leftists. In my case it was a bit easier for them to accept because I'm mainly interested in historic rifles and they can grok collecting and interest in history a lot easier than shooting per se. They have all come around and I've taken all but one (sister) to the shooting range.
A specific gunphobia (or hoplophobia if you prefer) is very common in urban areas for a very simple reason: they have no experience with guns in any context other than crime. If they hear gunshots in the distance, it's not a range or hunters, it's a drive-by. If they see a gun presented, it's because they're watching a movie or witnessing a crime, and that gun is about to be used to injure or kill someone. Why are terrorists afraid of dogs? Because the only dogs in the Middle East are attack dogs. Same thing.
What I found in my case was that their fear of guns abated very rapidly after they saw my enthusiasm and safe handling of the weapons themselves. A phobia in a mentally ill person requires many sessions of exposure therapy to overcome, but for normal people it melts away like frost in the sun. The problem in your case is going to be staging an initial exposure in such a way that they don't feel like they're in a movie and you're a bad guy drawing on them. I suggest taking the most reasonable member of your family out for 1-on-1 coffee or something and talking him up. Just mention it off hand, in some unthreatening (to him) context. Don't offer to take him to the range unless he's very receptive, but do offer to let him see them. Then talk to someone else, do the same thing and also mention off-hand that you were talking about it with the first convert, and suggest that he was receptive. What you want to do is engineer a consensus in your favor. After that it should be a piece of cake.
Good luck!
A specific gunphobia (or hoplophobia if you prefer) is very common in urban areas for a very simple reason: they have no experience with guns in any context other than crime. If they hear gunshots in the distance, it's not a range or hunters, it's a drive-by. If they see a gun presented, it's because they're watching a movie or witnessing a crime, and that gun is about to be used to injure or kill someone. Why are terrorists afraid of dogs? Because the only dogs in the Middle East are attack dogs. Same thing.
What I found in my case was that their fear of guns abated very rapidly after they saw my enthusiasm and safe handling of the weapons themselves. A phobia in a mentally ill person requires many sessions of exposure therapy to overcome, but for normal people it melts away like frost in the sun. The problem in your case is going to be staging an initial exposure in such a way that they don't feel like they're in a movie and you're a bad guy drawing on them. I suggest taking the most reasonable member of your family out for 1-on-1 coffee or something and talking him up. Just mention it off hand, in some unthreatening (to him) context. Don't offer to take him to the range unless he's very receptive, but do offer to let him see them. Then talk to someone else, do the same thing and also mention off-hand that you were talking about it with the first convert, and suggest that he was receptive. What you want to do is engineer a consensus in your favor. After that it should be a piece of cake.
Good luck!
Doctor Suarez
Member
Here's a thought:
Instead of one-on-one coffee, how about two-on-one? I think, as is typical with parents, they'll be more receptive to anything so long as my wife is for it. If she's there to back me up, I think it would go a long, long way.
Instead of one-on-one coffee, how about two-on-one? I think, as is typical with parents, they'll be more receptive to anything so long as my wife is for it. If she's there to back me up, I think it would go a long, long way.
Mongo the Mutterer
Member
+1
When your love comes home, be at the kitchen table, dressed in BDUs, cleaning an AK with at least 10 30 rd banana clips stacked up....
"Honey, I never told you about my little hobby ..."
HankB
Member
I'll repeat again keep your mouth shut until you're financially independent, but you wrote:
Second, why don't you cultivate a relationship with the family "patriarchs?" Go shooting with them. Let it be known that you have . . . preferably at a family gathering where the patriarchs are present. Then the in-laws will be put in a position where in order to berate you, they have to criticize the patriarchs, too.
First off, as a married adult, living on your own, there's no reason for you to accept subordinate status; you're only subordinate if you accept being subordinate. The method for dealing with dictates of people with no real power over you is "nonviolent noncompliance." Just ignore what they say - you can always walk away - and do what you want. You don't have to rub their noses in it - just live your own life and if they're unhappy with your choices, well, that's their problem. It only becomes your problem if you let it.
Second, why don't you cultivate a relationship with the family "patriarchs?" Go shooting with them. Let it be known that you have . . . preferably at a family gathering where the patriarchs are present. Then the in-laws will be put in a position where in order to berate you, they have to criticize the patriarchs, too.
Augustwest
Member
I really don't understand why you need to say anything. Your wife knows. It's no one else's business.
Zundfolge
Member
Don't hide your guns, but don't go out of your way to tell them about them either.
If/when they find out you're a gun owner, then you get to act all nonplussed...acting as though its no stranger to own guns then it is to own a toaster oven.
If they over-react then they are the ones with a problem and you can calmly ask confront their irrational fears.
If you have to hide your gun ownership, or if you feel you have to "come clean" and "justify" it then in both cases you're reinforcing their attitude that there is something "wrong" with owning guns.
If/when they find out you're a gun owner, then you get to act all nonplussed...acting as though its no stranger to own guns then it is to own a toaster oven.
If they over-react then they are the ones with a problem and you can calmly ask confront their irrational fears.
If you have to hide your gun ownership, or if you feel you have to "come clean" and "justify" it then in both cases you're reinforcing their attitude that there is something "wrong" with owning guns.
Dave Dembinski
Member
- Joined
- Mar 1, 2005
- Messages
- 249
I was very surprised, personally, when my mother found out I had guns and not only didn't flip out, but was alright with me buying my father a rifle for his birthday. She'd always seemed very anti- to me, but I think the fact that I haven't changed much nor have I gone on any shooting sprees since I started owning guns counts for a lot in her eyes.
Your relatives know you. They know you're not a psychopath. I'd second the advice already given to just deal with it if and when they find out, with your wife backing you up.
Your relatives know you. They know you're not a psychopath. I'd second the advice already given to just deal with it if and when they find out, with your wife backing you up.
Kjervin
Member
As far as getting him to put in the safe nook (or notch or whatever) just tell him that you are going to put in a safe. You don't have to tell him it's a gun safe. Tell him you want to have a fireproof (if it is going to be) safe for impotant documents and other valuables that you do not wish to go missing when you are not at home (or in case of natural emergency, fire, etc) which is essentially the truth. People who do not have guns can have safes too, you know.
Good Luck!
Kj
Good Luck!
Kj
Zundfolge
Member
I didn't notice this originaly.
Hell, you need to go to the range with Grandpa and the Cool Uncle!
Get them on your side ... most likely the rest of the family will see your interest in guns as you "falling under Grandpa & Uncle's influence"
If nothing else you get a couple of shootin' buddies (and you can never have enough shootin' buddies...especialy family)
Plus if the rest of the family is anti you'll give these old shooters someone to leave their guns to (and I don't mean that as a goulish way to get free guns. One of the sadnesses suffered by older shooter's is that they know that if they leave their guns to their anti-gun heirs that they will just end up being turned in at a gun "buyback" or otherwise turned over to the police for disposal)
Option 3. But during inevitable fights, be as patient, logical, and calm as you possibly can. Be strong and firm; be a man, and stick to your story without waivering, but try like hell to remain calm and explanatory. EVENTUALLY they will come around, and if they don't, it would then be time to find a new mate, or start flyin solo. That family needs to learn that they're humans, not baboons, and when a woman decides to marry, she decides to commit to her HUSBAND instead of her family. Just one man's opinion.
scout26
Member
+1
Heck, that's the "cool" part of the family anyway...
Marshall
Member
First of all, congrats on the house and your first gun!
Secondly, you mentioned needing your parents help to get the house. I'm not sure why you mentioned it other than possibly pointing out that they may have some sort of hold over you.
If it was a gift, then let it be a gift. If not, then I suggest paying them back before spending money all those rifles, shotguns and handguns you're planning on.
308win
Member
It seems to me that you are ceding leverage to your parents because they are helping you out. If your parents are in fact this controlling the fact that you are a closet gun owner is the least of your worries.
CTRL-ALT-DEL
member
- Joined
- Jul 25, 2005
- Messages
- 27
What Pax said, live your own life. Unless these family members are paying your bills, it is none of their business what you do with YOUR money, YOUR life. Either they accept it, or not. But, Live your own Life.
MikeIsaj
Member
Maybe I'm missing something here. I read the thread twice and I think you are making a mountain out of a mole hill.
First there is an issue here bigger than the guns. PAX said it, LIVE YOUR OWN LIFE! You are a grown man with a wife and I assume a family in the future. You need to loosen, not break the ties and assume your position as an adult in your extended family. Accept their help, we all have, but do not take any offer that is conditional. If they want to help, they will help. If they want to dictate your lifestyle, say no thank you and figure out another way to live your life.
Regarding the guns, don't make a big issue out of them. There is no reason for you to "come clean" with anyone. If in the normal course of things, someone becomes aware of your guns, how they react is their problem. They are entitled to their opinion, they are not entitled to shove it down your throat, or make demands that you change. If they are that offended, they have a decision to make. They can be civil and polite, or they can be ill-mannered, jerks.
Frankly I think you may be surprised at the reaction. Many anti's I've met are actually ignorant. We naturally fear what we don't understand and a little knowledge goes a long way.
First there is an issue here bigger than the guns. PAX said it, LIVE YOUR OWN LIFE! You are a grown man with a wife and I assume a family in the future. You need to loosen, not break the ties and assume your position as an adult in your extended family. Accept their help, we all have, but do not take any offer that is conditional. If they want to help, they will help. If they want to dictate your lifestyle, say no thank you and figure out another way to live your life.
Regarding the guns, don't make a big issue out of them. There is no reason for you to "come clean" with anyone. If in the normal course of things, someone becomes aware of your guns, how they react is their problem. They are entitled to their opinion, they are not entitled to shove it down your throat, or make demands that you change. If they are that offended, they have a decision to make. They can be civil and polite, or they can be ill-mannered, jerks.
Frankly I think you may be surprised at the reaction. Many anti's I've met are actually ignorant. We naturally fear what we don't understand and a little knowledge goes a long way.
If you're not locked in to the house deal, consider living away from relatives. Keeping relatives at a distance does wonders for immediate family relationships, especially considering the stuff you're raising as issues here. Some relatives think sharing common blood gives them special rights to affect your privacy and way of life and forget you're an independent adult with your own life to live.
Standing Wolf
Member in memoriam
There's nothing to "come clean" about. You have a constitutionally protected right to keep and bear arms. There's nothing shameful about exercising that or any of your other rights.
Never has been. Never will be.
Zundfolge
Member
Doctor Suarez, I'm going to ask you a question that I don't expect you to answer in public ... and I don't mean this as some sort of assault on your manhood or your independence,
Didn't you recently post a thread asking about "Libertarian Cities"?
Did the in-laws learn you where considering moving to the US with your bride and taking their "baby" away for the People's Republic of California to that awful United States of America so they found a way to snare you and tie you down to the PRK by helping you pay for grossly overpriced property?
If thats the case then you really need to think long and hard about accepting this blackmail ... and maybe plan on putting your foot down (or just get used to the idea of being your in-laws' "bitch"*)
*apologies to Art's Grammaw
EDIT
Oops ... I withdraw the question, it wasn't Doctor Suarez, it was DocZinn who posted that thread (all you "doctors" look alike to me
)
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=147373
Didn't you recently post a thread asking about "Libertarian Cities"?
Did the in-laws learn you where considering moving to the US with your bride and taking their "baby" away for the People's Republic of California to that awful United States of America so they found a way to snare you and tie you down to the PRK by helping you pay for grossly overpriced property?
If thats the case then you really need to think long and hard about accepting this blackmail ... and maybe plan on putting your foot down (or just get used to the idea of being your in-laws' "bitch"*)
*apologies to Art's Grammaw
EDIT
Oops ... I withdraw the question, it wasn't Doctor Suarez, it was DocZinn who posted that thread (all you "doctors" look alike to me
)http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=147373
Last edited:
Doctor Suarez
Member
Sarright, Zundfolge. What's keeping me in Kali is my own career aspirations. I'm a writer, you see, and as of this week, an employed one!
Just so long as this state's red-county population keeps growing ahead of the tofu-brained city people, things might wind up being okay.
Just so long as this state's red-county population keeps growing ahead of the tofu-brained city people, things might wind up being okay.
jnojr
Member
I don't see any point in "sitting down with them". You aren't very likely to change their minds, but you could start a huge fight.
How about this... get something like an old musket for a wallhanger. If/when they notice it and say anything, give them the 30 second spiel on the era of history it's from. Later, add another, like maybe an M1 Garand to put up on the wall, too (and, of course, every now and then they should be brought down to be cleaned, fired, oiled, and put back!) Don't get drawn into any political arguments... if they go "Oh, Lord, how can you have that horrible schoolchild-killing Devilspawn device in your house?" just give them a look like they just grew a third eye, say "It's a piece of history" and move on to something else.
There's a chance they might ask honest questions and be receptive to one day going shooting with you. If not, the worst you'll have done is prepared them a little bit for the day they learn you possess "evil" guns.
How about this... get something like an old musket for a wallhanger. If/when they notice it and say anything, give them the 30 second spiel on the era of history it's from. Later, add another, like maybe an M1 Garand to put up on the wall, too (and, of course, every now and then they should be brought down to be cleaned, fired, oiled, and put back!) Don't get drawn into any political arguments... if they go "Oh, Lord, how can you have that horrible schoolchild-killing Devilspawn device in your house?" just give them a look like they just grew a third eye, say "It's a piece of history" and move on to something else.
There's a chance they might ask honest questions and be receptive to one day going shooting with you. If not, the worst you'll have done is prepared them a little bit for the day they learn you possess "evil" guns.
ny32182
Member
My mother is anti-gun (my dad doesn't care one way or the other, and has about 4 of his own). I love her to death. But she is 52 years old, grew up in Chicago, regrettably has been through some serious illness in her life, and her mind will not be changed about guns. Her thought processes (on everything; not just guns) are driven almost completely on emotion rather than logic. This is how it works.
-She knows I am a gun owner.
-She still helps me out financially with school/etc.
-The day that that financial aid comes with the condition that I sell my guns (or make any other serious lifestyle adjustment) is the day that I don't accept that financial aid.
Some things are more important to me than help with the bills. Gun ownership is one of them.
You just have to make up your mind about how much you are willing to let your parents or in-laws control your life. As a grown, married adult, and certainly with a steady income (not a student) that choice is entirely yours.
Now personally... I would just buy what I wanted. I wouldn't bring it up, but I wouldn't try to hide it either. As others have stated, you have nothing to "come clean" about. What you are doing is not wrong. It is a personal decision, and if your in-laws find out about it through the normal course of events, they can either live with a decision that you made about your life that doesn't affect them in the least.... or they can't. At that point its up to them about how they are going to feel about it, but your hands are washed.
-She knows I am a gun owner.
-She still helps me out financially with school/etc.
-The day that that financial aid comes with the condition that I sell my guns (or make any other serious lifestyle adjustment) is the day that I don't accept that financial aid.
Some things are more important to me than help with the bills. Gun ownership is one of them.
You just have to make up your mind about how much you are willing to let your parents or in-laws control your life. As a grown, married adult, and certainly with a steady income (not a student) that choice is entirely yours.
Now personally... I would just buy what I wanted. I wouldn't bring it up, but I wouldn't try to hide it either. As others have stated, you have nothing to "come clean" about. What you are doing is not wrong. It is a personal decision, and if your in-laws find out about it through the normal course of events, they can either live with a decision that you made about your life that doesn't affect them in the least.... or they can't. At that point its up to them about how they are going to feel about it, but your hands are washed.
Echo Tango
Member
Well
This is going to sound rather trite, but I just gotta say this.....What you choose to do, be have etc etc isnt your parents/in laws business. Now i understand there are mitigating circumstances however....your prison is completely of your own making and completely within your power to disregard. If you allow them to lord their " senior" status over you then you are allowing yourself to be subjugated to them. Your a adult, they are adults, its time you pointed this out to them. Explain that you value their advice but you dont base your life on their whims.
This is going to sound rather trite, but I just gotta say this.....What you choose to do, be have etc etc isnt your parents/in laws business. Now i understand there are mitigating circumstances however....your prison is completely of your own making and completely within your power to disregard. If you allow them to lord their " senior" status over you then you are allowing yourself to be subjugated to them. Your a adult, they are adults, its time you pointed this out to them. Explain that you value their advice but you dont base your life on their whims.
only1asterisk
member
- Joined
- Jun 13, 2003
- Messages
- 2,412
This is exactly what you need.
Don't let it be a secret, it isn't anything to be ashamed of. If someone should happen to blow a fuse, don't worry, it sounds like a you have a solid family.
Don't be covert, make converts!
David
Mixlesplick
Member
I agree with what most people are writing. There is no need to share this with the rest of your family. Do you share every aspect of your life with your family? This is just one part that they don't need to know about unless it comes up naturally.
You could keep your firearms and supplies in a locked "storage room" that no one needs to rummage through while they are visiting. Just be prepared if they do find out so you can answer their questions reasonably. Also, if they are rabidly anti-gun you should be a little concerned about who they might complain to that their son or son-in-law has guns and they are worried about you. Just don't let them dictate what you can and can't do in this or any aspect of your life.
My dad is a hunter so he has owned rifles and shotguns. He is against handguns because he thinks they are more oriented towards killing people. I tried to share my enthusiasm for shooting handguns but he didn't enjoy it. I told him I got my ccw and he doesn't want me to carry at his house. Now I mostly meet him for lunch or someplace neutral or just lock the gun in my truck in case for family gatherings. I don't know if he assumes I am not carrying because I am with him or not. I just leave that subject alone and so does he.
I found an easy medium with my parents but if it would have caused serious problems I would never have told them about my guns.
You could keep your firearms and supplies in a locked "storage room" that no one needs to rummage through while they are visiting. Just be prepared if they do find out so you can answer their questions reasonably. Also, if they are rabidly anti-gun you should be a little concerned about who they might complain to that their son or son-in-law has guns and they are worried about you. Just don't let them dictate what you can and can't do in this or any aspect of your life.
My dad is a hunter so he has owned rifles and shotguns. He is against handguns because he thinks they are more oriented towards killing people. I tried to share my enthusiasm for shooting handguns but he didn't enjoy it. I told him I got my ccw and he doesn't want me to carry at his house. Now I mostly meet him for lunch or someplace neutral or just lock the gun in my truck in case for family gatherings. I don't know if he assumes I am not carrying because I am with him or not. I just leave that subject alone and so does he.
I found an easy medium with my parents but if it would have caused serious problems I would never have told them about my guns.
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