Discussion in 'Legal' started by bfieldburt, Mar 1, 2004.
There is mounting evidence that terrorists and criminals have access to these weapons. It (gunshow amdt) will work without burdening gunshow operators, or unlicensed dealers. The vast majority of individuals at gunshows are law-abiding individuals. We need to insure simply that everyone is treated the same at gunshows.
Larry Craig is back on!!! Yay!
And phones with built in cameras, and watches.. oh heck.. just ban everything.. oh to heck with it, put everyone in a 'concentration camp' uh I mean "safety camp" yeah.. that's it.. it's for the children.
Just got off phone with Cornyn and Hutchison,
both favor clean bill/why did they vote ok on the silly ammendments?
both want to expire the awb.
Huthison staff said she did not vote for inital ban media was 'in error on that report and has been contacted to retract the statement.'
anyone have the cong record on the intial ban vote in the senate?
iirc it was in 94
In the lawless parts of the world, fully automatic weapons are widely available for very cheap prices. As easy as it is to smuggle drugs and illegal aliens across our borders, smuggled illegal NFA weapons cannot be too hard for terrs and other enemies of Americans. Mexico has very stringent firearms disarmament laws, yet their Chiapas rebels had no difficulty at all aquiring fully automatic weapons, grenades, and other military weapons. Russia had virtual gun bans, as all totalitarian nations do, yet the breakaway rebels had NO difficulty aquiring instant parity with Russian military forces.
Doing this AWB renewal and gunshow legislation is such a useless act against terrs or criminals, it is itself criminal!
If senator Reed has facts concerning the IRA purchases and has not done anything about it isn't he guilty of failure to report? This sounds like something that could be used to hang him and others of the anti persuasion. Conspriacy or something? Get busy great legal minds.
just called up sen. craig's office to thank him and suggested that he could compare the ban on standard-capacity magazines to a ban restricting all new automobiles sold to the public to only hold five gallons of gas with the thought that people fleeing from the cops wouldn't be as likely to get away. and that like the standard-cap mag ban, it would help in a few instances, but would be much more of an infringment on the general public. heh.
Craig: We've just heard an explanation on why we should change a law on gun commerce. My contention is that there is no loophole. Gunshows are in fact a mirror image of commerce in this country. Individuals can sell a firearm without an FFL. They only need one if they are doing it for business. Under this amendment, they are suggesting this should magically change inside gunshows. Let me set the record straight, we are setting a whole new set of fed regulations against a legal trade. Annually, some 4 million people attend gunshows. I've attended numerous gunshows, you can see an example here. They provide an opportunity for people looking to learn, or buy and sell guns and related materials. Right now if you are buying and selling like this for a living, you have to have an FFL. If you are an individual collector, you don't make a living doing this. You can still go to a gunshow, get a table, and sell a couple guns. What they fail to say is that in the back streets, we'd love to license black markets, but we can't. Reed acknowledged that the vast majority of goers are law-abiding citizens. People can simply set up right outside a gunshow and sell without problems. Gun rights groups frequently set up booths in gunshows. Therefore, gunshows are an important part of our political process. It is estimated that more than a thousand commercial gunshows are held in this country. Gunshows today are regulated by state laws.
Let us talk about statistics. In the mid 80's, an NIJ study found that gunshows are such a tiny source of crime guns, that they weren't even worth reporting. In 1997 the NIJ put the number of crime guns from gunshows at 2%. 1.7% of prison inmates said they used a weapon from a gunshow. Less than 1% of crime guns are from gunshows, after a 2001 study of 18,000 criminals.
If you need any info on who voted for what, when or anything about the ban go here.
By the way, when I called Sen. Warner's office I was told that any reports saying that he was in favor of the AW Ban in any way were a "total fabrication." Two hours later he joined Feinstein.
Do not assume your reps are "safe." They may vote pro in the end but the loudness of the opposition or support determines the types of deals that are made.
Everyone should be calling.
What I like is how many new members have joined THR. Now call your sens/reps - cc your reps on senate emails.
I'd say Larry for Veep, but that would take a good man out of the senate.
Is anybody recording this??? Some of you might remembers MMM Lies and Videotape, I'd love to get the raw footage and this and have a little fun.
Bring me up to speed, were any amendments voted on?
Craig: Now we hear a new argument. Terrorists. We hear that terrorists are going to buy guns to wreak havoc on this country. On 9/11, the weapon of choice was an airliner. Not an M16. Those terrorist examples stated by Reed where only able to be told because current law worked to stop them, and catch them. If you plug this â€˜loophole', you will simply turn the flow back to the black market. If you walk into a gun show, the loophole exists. Walk out, it doesn't. Any individual can sell a firearm to another without doing backgrounds outside of gun shows, and it should be the same within. The answer to a problem is to stack a new law on law-abiding citizens, saying it might someway protect an average citizen? What can happen in a gun show, will still be able to happen outside one. Tighten as we will, we will step much harder on the private citizen rather than the criminal element of the world. That's the reality of any law, guns or anything else.
VA--- here we go.
The place is empty - hmmm?
Warner is apparently up trying to get some amdt of his heard... working out some time rules and such, seems to be a bunch of confusion.
It's funny hearing them all argue about time constraints in this weird political language.
It's not political language, they're alians... from Uranus.....
Went into quorum, they're hudled and working this out...
Time's awastin'... ok, I was gonna say why no quorum call to stop the clock?
Warner just had a statement by him placed into the record regarding the AWB. It was not read. Wish I knew what it said!
Hutchinson did vote against the initial ban - you can check the record at http://www.awbansunset.com/
She did however vote for the gunlock amendment to this bill - so her idea of a clean bill must be different from mine.
I think the AWB and the GunShow elimination amendments will be voted on at 5PM DC time.
Reed: It struck me that there is something different than a private sale and a gun show. Most private sales involve somebody you know. At gun shows, these are gun super markets. No individual has knowledge of who is coming up to them and asking for a weapon. That is why the need for a background check is obvious. These unlicensed sellers have very little knowledge of who they are selling to, it could be a terrorist or criminal. The cases seem so compelling. Describes the cases from before.
AWB and gunshow today? I thought that was Tuesday?
Separate names with a comma.