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CZ 452/CZ 455, anyone have or shoot both?

Discussion in 'Rifle Country' started by solman, Sep 23, 2013.

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  1. solman

    solman Member

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    So I wanted to hear your experiences on the 452 vs. its replacement the 455. I was thinking of picking up one of the 452 Ultra Lux 22lr. Is it a better made rifle than the newer 455 series?
     
  2. viking499

    viking499 Member

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    Get the Ultra Lux. It is in a league of its own. Very Quiet with subsonic ammo.

    I have 5 452's and no 455's if that tells you anything......
     
  3. greyling22

    greyling22 Member

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  4. MacTech

    MacTech Member

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    All three of my CZ's are 452's
    UltraLux (UL)
    Full stock (FS)
    Scout (youth model)

    Both the FS and UL have CZ's stellar Tangent sights, the Scout has simple blade sights, however, all three shoot exceptionally well, and the only difference comes down to ammo preference and shooter skill

    If you have a choice, and plan to shoot iron sights, go with the UL, the sights are far better than the Williams ramps on the 455, plus, the UL is noticeably quieter, with subsonic ammo, you ALMOST don't need hearing protection
     
  5. Napalm

    Napalm Member

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    I have a 452 Ultra lux.

    I prefer the 452 over the 455. THe 452 is a dedicated .22 receiver where the 455 has a plastic spacer in the mag well to accomadate the other calibers.


    My ultra lux is near surpressed level quiet with subsonic ammo


    HEre isa 455 magwell, see the plastic square spacer? lame

    05182012009.jpg
     
  6. Jim Watson

    Jim Watson Member

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    If you want to shoot iron sights, the Ultra Lux is the way to go.
    If you want a scope and are squeamish about taking the big rear sight off, there are better choices.

    A guy here is a CZ fan and wrote up his experience in scoping the rifles with iron sight and "hog back" stock comb. He found an old Weaver with long tube and small objective that would clear the rear sight in medium rings. Other combinations take high rings and a "chin weld" to shoot.

    For glass, I think I'd get an American.
     
  7. bamajoey

    bamajoey Member

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    I think it depends on the individual rifle. I have 3, 452 Americans, 1 shoots better than the other two but not by much. I have a 452 Lux that shoots as good as the American, but my 455 Varmint shoots circles around all the rest, even before I put a Lilja barrel on it.
    All CZ's are good rifles, some better than others.:)
     
  8. Charger442

    Charger442 Member

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    you want to change calibers on your own with just two allen screws and different barrels, the 455 is great. yes, there is a plastic block in there behind the mag, to accommodate the void needed for 22 magnum. but, who cares? its not a point of failure and it effects nothing. i don't get the hate for block. it is removed when the rifle has a 22 magnum barrel and 22 magnum magazine.


    if you ONLY want a 22Lr an are ok with it only being a 22lr, then the 452 is just great. FYI, they are discontinuing making the 452. if that makes them more or less desirable, that's up to the buyer.
     
  9. I6turbo

    I6turbo Member

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    Like many others here I have several of the various 452 models. Mine include the FS, Trainer, Ultra Lux, Scout, and two Americans. The extreme sight radius on the UL is great for iron sight shooting, but I would take the Trainer (or the Trainer's walnut-stocked twin, the Lux) if I had to choose between the UL and Trainer. The Trainer is better balanced, IMO, and the 3.7" difference in barrel length (28.5" for the UL vs 24.8" for the Trainer) has as much handicap in terms of handling and maneuverability as it does upside in terms of increased sight radius. I also don't care for the rubber recoil pad on the UL because it (as well as any other rubber recoil pad) is a shirt-grabber when I go to shoulder the gun. I like the way the guns with hard plastic butt plates slide on and off the shoulder. If the primary use of the gun would be bench shooting, I might choose the UL, but at that point I'd just go with an American or Varmint (or a BRNO 3 or 4 if staying within the CZ/BRNO family).

    Re: scoping the "hog-back" guns and still being able to get good cheek-weld, I've found it can definitely be done, but you may not be able to just slap on any scope or rings that you happen to have handy. You may have to select the scope and rings more carefully. Key considerations are bolt clearance at the ocular end, and sight clearance at the objective end. Essentially all scopes can be fitted to a hog-back CZ, but not all scopes can be properly positioned to allow cheek weld. Removing the rear tangent sight is a three-second job and will allow many scopes to work well whereas they otherwise wouldn't. Here's my 452 FS with an Weaver V9 3-9x40 AO that allows excellent cheek weld for me, and the bolt is well clear of the ocular bell and allows me to grip the bolt knob normally when cycling the bolt. I love the setup and wouldn't position the scope any differently even if I could. Point is, the hog-back stocks are not impossible to scope for good cheek weld.

    452afterrefinish_1_edited-1_zps1d6ccfb5.jpg
     
  10. ColtPythonElite

    ColtPythonElite Member

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    I have three 452s...Trainer, Ultra Lux, and full stock and a 455 American. All are well made and accurate for sporter weight guns.

    As far as sights go, the 452 style are superior to the 455 style.
     
  11. solman

    solman Member

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    Lots of good info posted thanks to all. As I was thinking to keep the iron sights on this gun and not to scope it at all. Perhaps I think the 452 trainer or UL is the way for me to go. Do all the 452's that have sights, have the same sights? What makes the sights better on the 452 than the ones on the 455?
    Now to check price and availability.
     
  12. ColtPythonElite

    ColtPythonElite Member

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    Yes, the 452 sights are the same. The 452 style are better because the rear is a tangent works perfectly for distance changes.

    I prefer my Trainer over my UL. I can hold the Trainer down by my side by the grip and not have the barrel hit the, ground. Not so with the UL.
     
  13. I6turbo

    I6turbo Member

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    The rear tangent on the UL is graduated to 300 meters. The Trainer/Lux and FS are graduated to 200 meters. IMO there's no worthwhile reason to pick the UL just for the 300-meter adjustment if you prefer the other guns otherwise. Beyond 200 meters with an open notch sighted .22LR.... you know... doesn't make enough sense to justify selecting a gun that's otherwise less preferable to you.

    The 455 has very nice iron sights, but you adjust them with screwdrivers and in a much narrower elevation range than the quick-adjust military style tangents on the 452s. If you are a "hold-over" type of guy (don't adjust elevation for distance, but rather just hold above the target as you judge necessary), the 455 sights are great, perhaps even preferable. But I'll tell you from experience, once use the 452 tangents a little bit, you'll most likely be hooked.

    The 452 Scout and 452 Basic [EDIT: it's not called a 452 Basic, but instead a 513 Basic] (Basic was discontinued in 2012 but you might find one still) have adjustable open sights but they are a simpler style with much less adjustment range, not the military tangent style of the above-mentioned 452s. Basic doesn't have the nice, easily-adjustable trigger that the rest of the 452s have, so I don't recommend it.

    The 452 Trainer, UL, Scout, and Left Handed American and Lux are still in production, but often in very short supply. There's currently plenty of ULs and Trainers available, but last time this happened was about 6 months ago and when they were gone prices for the NIB ones that showed up every couple weeks or so shot into the $600+ range for both guns, a few going on GB for as high as $800+. Then when Kentucky Gun Co, Whittaker Guns, Bud's or the like gets some more in, they drop back into the $300-$400 range on GB (and some LGS) like they are now.

    Now is as good a time to buy a 452 as there's likely to ever be. CZ might just completely discontinue the 452 one of these days (they've been trying for a couple years now). Go get yourself one (or more). There's very, very little chance that you'll regret it. :)
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2013
  14. ColtPythonElite

    ColtPythonElite Member

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    I never noticed the UL rear goes to 300. Of course, I never used mine, either. I stuck a set of Denny's BRNO on mine as soon as I pulled it outta the box.
     
  15. I6turbo

    I6turbo Member

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    LOL I guess I found out the same way you did; I read it on this here internet, went and looked at my UL sights and sure enough, 300. I thought it was pretty much wishful thinking -- 8 feet of drop, and all -- but than again, nowhere near as bad as the old WWI and II era military rifles being graduated to 2000 meters. :what:
     
  16. giggitygiggity

    giggitygiggity Member

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    I have a 452 Varmint in .17HMR that is a tack driver. Super accurate and fun to shoot!
     
  17. Danny Creasy

    Danny Creasy Member

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    The 452 models get the nod in my book.

    I own seven 452s and one 513 Basic. I have designed, managed, and competed in local rimfire sporter matches for a couple of decades here in North Alabama and competed in four of the National Sporter Matches at Camp Perry, OH. The 455s are fine rifles in their own right but the 452 models seem to be more consistent.

    It looks like the new 455 hogs back stocked models lack what I consider the finest set of factory open sights in existence - those found on the 452 open sight models. Over half the competitors shooting in the O Class at the CMP's National Rimfire Sporter Match use the open sighted CZ 452 models.

    My friend Willie Rhodes used a left handed CZ 452 American to set the USBR 50 Meter Sporter world record:
    http://usbr.benchrest.net/usbr_rec.htm

    You won't go wrong with a 452 UltraLux.

    Here is the thread that Jim referenced above:

    http://dwightpilkilton.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=talk&action=display&thread=1134
     
    Last edited: Sep 25, 2013
  18. solman

    solman Member

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    thanks Turbo for the sight clarification.
    Now I am shopping for the best deal I can get on the trainer or ultra lux. I may well end up with both as I am a fan of the .22 caliber rifle. Lots of fun to shoot, no brass to scoop up and, no time spent reloading. I would much rather be shooting these days.
    Ammo is a bit of a short supply but so is powder and primers.
     
  19. Olympus

    Olympus Member

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    I don't have both, just the 455 Varmint and I'm a true fan. You get the option of swapping barrels to give you a 22lr, 22wmr, and 17hmr. Not to mention Lilja is now making drop-in replacement barrels for the 455. I added a YoDave trigger kit and have the trigger at 20oz. I shoot dime groups at 50 yards all day without breaking a sweat. Lot of my buddies talk about their "tack driver" 22, but have yet to see one that can outshoot my 455.
     
  20. CB900F

    CB900F Member

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    Solman;

    I've got several of the 452 LH models, and CZ's not making a 455 LH. I'm a very happy camper with the 452's I've got & may get more if available. I don't have any plans to get a 455 beyond the obvious one. Over on Rimfire Central there are consistent reports of: 455 chamber problems. 455 crown problems. And a recall on 455's with single-set triggers.

    900F
     
  21. Double Naught Spy

    Double Naught Spy Sus Venator

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    I have the Ultra Lux. It is an outstanding rifle.
     
  22. gb6491

    gb6491 Member

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    Even more so, as the "300 meter" sight leaf is identical/nearly identical (I'm just eyeballing them) in size to the 200 meter leaf, ditto the range increment bars spacing (more on this in a moment). As far as I know, there is only one size elevation slider for the 452 series rifles with this style sight. Where the leafs differ is that after 100 meters, the increment bars on the 300 meter leaf are marked in 50 meter intervals while the 200 is marked in 25 meter intervals. Zeroed at 25 meters, I found the 200 meter leaf the more representative of bullet impact at the marked the ranges.
    28vawyo.jpg
    Perhaps, I'm missing something here and would welcome anybody setting me straight on this.
    Regards,
    Greg
     
  23. I6turbo

    I6turbo Member

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    gb6491, what you're saying makes sense to me. I did some quick measurements and the maximum actual lift of the rear sight (with the slider all the way forward) is the same on both the 200- and 300-meter sights (about 6.4-mm, IIRC).

    If my brain is working correctly here... the UL's longer sight radius would serve to actually DECREASE the amount of elevation dialed into the gun. That is, with both gun's rear sights full-forward at maximum elevation, the UL would be aiming slightly lower than a Trainer (or an FS with its even shorter barrel and the same 200-meter sight).
     
  24. Furncliff

    Furncliff Member

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    solman your ques. was about the quality of the 452 vs the 455. Check with rimfirecentral.com for all the details, they have a passionate following. All mine are 452's but following RFC it seems the 455's are excellent shooters too. Many folks scope the UL. but then you are not taking advantage of the extra barrel length and might as well pick an American or Varmint. The UL comes with exceptional tangent sights. The next step up is a set of Brno Target Sights.
     
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