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CZ, Decock lever or no decock lever?

Discussion in 'Handguns: Autoloaders' started by GVMan, Apr 6, 2007.

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  1. GVMan

    GVMan Member

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    That is the question. From the CZ catalog it would appear that they offer more pistols with a safety for Cocked and Locked carry than they offer with the option for a manual decock lever. I think I would prefer to decock the pistol and carry it that way. Being a bit inexperienced I like the idea of a heavy initial trigger pull to help prevent accidental discharges, even though I think I have a pretty good habit of, as they say, keeping my booger hook off the bang switch. However, because I am a bit inexperienced, although I do not intend to stay that way, I was wondering what I am missing - are there other advantages or disadvantages to either variant?

    Thanks
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2007
  2. armoredman

    armoredman Member

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    I have had/have both. The decocker compact models, the PCR and the PO1, are outstanding combat pistols.
    [​IMG]
    The decocker drops the hammer to the half cock notch, where it is supposed to ride. The standard CZ-75 requires a careful decocking on a live roundto the half cock notch, or all the way down. With practice, it is safe enough, ( I did it with both an EAA Witness for 13+ years, and a CZ-75 Compact.), but without practice, it can be a bit dangerous. This is why the CZ also has the option of cocked and locked, one of the very few, and the first, DA/SA auto to offer that.
    If a long, deliberate trigger pull is what you really want, then the CZ for you is the CZ-100.
    [​IMG]

    There is nothing to beat the long deliberate trigger pull on this DAO auto! Poly frame, 9mm or 40SW, adjustable rear sights, one handed slide racking device, and not too expensive.

    I would simply go with the PCR, and use the decocker.

    [​IMG]

    Unless a rail is what you want, then my reccomendation is the PO1, best dadgum compact semi-auto made today, IMHO...:cool:

    [​IMG]
     
  3. jsonnier

    jsonnier Member

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    That PO-1 is beautiful . I just wish they made them in .357 Sig .........:)
     
  4. GVMan

    GVMan Member

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    Clarification

    Thank you. I would like to clarify that I only want the long hard pull on the first round fired. I currently have a DAO Kahr and I am a bit dissatisfied with my ability to shoot fast follow up shots accurately.

    Great pics. CZ offers so many variations that it is all a bit confusing. However, I am thankful for being given the choice. It seems many manufacturers don't offer any choices. (except CZ and of course HK)

    From what I can figure from the CZ catalog if I want to go with the manual decock lever I have to choose between a CZ75 BD or the C75 SP-01 Tactical or the P01.

    Are any of these more accurate than the others?
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2007
  5. Jiml3

    Jiml3 Member

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    I have the CZ PCR model and love the decocking feature. Under stressful situations or just plain not giving full attention to what you are doing, a decocker is the lest dangerous method of getting a gun into a safe double action mode. The PCR is also an excellent choice for concealed carry since it is an alloy frame, it is not too heavy and is a great shooter.
     
  6. DMK

    DMK Member

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    I never liked decockers. I don't trust a mechanical aperatus to safely drop the hammer without firing. I decock my CZ40B by grabbing the hammer with thumb and forefinger and pulling it back while pressing the trigger, then slowly letting it down to rest. Keep the gun pointed in a safe direction (usually at a my book shelf since I've seen a stack of books stop bullets pretty effectively, testing various materials at a range).

    The gun will operate in SA or DA regardless of whether you have the decocker or safety.


    If you are in a stressful situation, why decock it at all? Just leave it in SA and put the safety on. Then holster or low ready.

    If you are not giving full attention to the weapon, you should not be handling it all all. A gimmick on the side does not protect you from negligence.
     
  7. Juna

    Juna Member

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    Personally, I prefer decocker models b/c I don't carry "cocked & locked". A manual safety is pretty easy to flip off (even accidentally), and I find a DA trigger pull to be plenty safety for me. I'd hate to forget to disarm the manual safety if my life depended on it. I like being able to have nothing keeping me (or my wife) from pulling the trigger and firing. Plus, I don't like decocking by holding the hammer and pulling the trigger. A firing pin blocking decocker is much safer and easier to decock, IMO. Also, it doesn't decock the hammer all the way down, it puts it into a half-cocked state.

    The down side to a decocker model is that it's a lot more complex internally, which means if you want to strip it all the way down (not just field strip it), then it's quite a bit more complicated. IMO, manual safeties are best for SAO pistols, like 1911s, where you can't really carry hammer down b/c you'd have to cock the hammer before you fire the first round.

    Your options for decocker models from CZ in 9mm are:
    CZ 75 BD (full sized, all steel)
    CZ 75 D PCR (compact, alloy frame) <----- You left this one out
    CZ 75 P-01 (compact, alloy frame, accessory rail)
    CZ 75 SP-01 (full sized, accessory rail)

    They're all extremely accurate, so don't worry about that. What is your intended purpose for the gun? If it's range use & home defense, I'd opt for a full sized CZ 75 BD (cheaper, esp. if you find a lightly used one) or SP-01 (more expensive, but if you want lights/lasers then it's a must). If it's concealed carry, I'd opt for the CZ 75D PCR b/c it has the lighter alloy frame and b/c the P-01's rail makes it have a wider profile, and you're not going to CCW it with a laser or light on, anyway.
     
  8. ARTiger

    ARTiger Member

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    Many have also settled on the decock version of CZ's and feel they're about the perfect gun. Carried half-cocked the gun is available instantly with a single long DA pull without having to first fiddle with a manual safety, but can also be fully cocked for a first shot SA with a crisp smooth short pull. In SA mode, the CZ's are capable of incredible accuracy even at surprisingly long ranges like 100+ yards. Personally, I can't think of a semi-auto handgun action I would prefer more . . . it's on par with that of a S&W DA revolver for functionality.

    Also, I have both the SP01 and a 75BD POLICE. The basic difference is that one has a rail (SP01) and the other has a slimmer more tapered front end. Otherwise, function is identical however the BD gives up a few rounds in mag capacity, but still has 16+1 on tap. For me the 75BD POLICE works better and I just like it more. They both fill the same role and my BD has night sights where the SP01 does not. Now then if you like tacticool stuff hanging off your gun, you may like the SP01 better. (Heck, you can even get a bayonet for it! :what: )

    Beware though of "CZ Virus" . . . Having the two CZ's I do, all that's made me do is realize that it's the CZ 75D Compact "PCR" that I want. It's the very same parrallel to the P01 that the BD is to the SP01. Rail or no rail, etc. The PCR has an alloy frame and that (non-railed) slimmer, tapered front end that helps break up the shape for carry purposes. The compacts are also every bit as sweet handling and accurate as the full-sized versions.

    So, that's "CZ Virus" - I go from no CZ's to what will be 3 by next week in less than a year and will probably not be done by far with buying CZ's. They're just that good, it's almost like stealing when buying them for well <$500.

    [​IMG]
     
  9. GVMan

    GVMan Member

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    Intended Purpose

    Well, that's a good question. Like anyone with a very small collection of firearms, one. I'd like to find that perfect all purpose pistol. After reading extensively on this site I realize that such a pistol does not exist and I am going to need many!

    I think I would like a full size to help improve my accuracy in target shooting and so I don't have to reload the mag every 8 shots. I would also like a compact for CCW. I was thinking that it would be great to have both with the same platform for familiarity. I also like the idea of getting the 22 Kadet conversion. Primarily to teach my kids to shoot.

    Unfortunately my local gun store with a range doesn't have CZ's. The other gun store in the next town has CZ's but does not have a range. I'd love to try one out first.

    Thanks guys for the great information. This site has never let me down!!!
     
  10. Golddog

    Golddog Member

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    The major benefits of CZs are the ergonomics and the single action trigger. Decock models cost you that wonderful trigger pull for the first shot - the shot that probably matters most in an emergency. I've tried lots of DA semi-autos and will never own another; the triggers impede accuracy and make the guns unsafe in life and death situations.
     
  11. RNB65

    RNB65 Member

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    I have the decocker model of the SP01 (the SP01 Tactical). I don't like manual safeties.
     
  12. Mainspring

    Mainspring Member

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    Huh?
     
  13. Mainspring

    Mainspring Member

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    Drop free mags??

    I see in the catalog that the CZ85 Combat advertises "...drop free magazines..." Is this to say mags don't drop free from other CZ pistols? I've played with a couple of CZ75s in the store, and I noted that the mags didn't drop free on those, but kinda figured that it was a "new gun" thing.
     
  14. ARTiger

    ARTiger Member

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    There's a mag brake that can easily be taken off and replaced with a dummy panel if you want drop free mags. Many CZ models do not have the mag break also.
     
  15. rbernie
    • Contributing Member

    rbernie Member

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    The presence or absence of a decocker has nothing to do with how you carry the weapon (i.e. whether you use a safety or not).

    I generally manually decock my weapon and carry it on the half-cock notch. However, I appreciate the fact that I have the OPTION of carrying it cocked-n-locked and would rather have that option that have a useless lever that does nothing that my own fingers can't do.
     
  16. GVMan

    GVMan Member

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    manual decocking

    Wow, this is great information so far. Could someone please explain manually decocking a CZ. I looked at the manual on the web site and I don't really think I have a firm grasp of the how's and why's and what items are crucial to do it without an unintentional discharge.
     
  17. varoadking

    varoadking Member

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    Yup...it's a dumb idea.
     
  18. modifiedbrowning

    modifiedbrowning Member

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    Mainspring, the one handed slide racking device is the thing right behind the ejection port. Basically it protrudes above the slide and lets you rack the slide with one hand by hooking it on a a belt, table or any other flat surface.
     
  19. rbernie
    • Contributing Member

    rbernie Member

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    Practice this with an unloaded firearm:
    • Point the pistol in a relatively safe direction
    • Pinch the hammer between your weak hand's thumb and forefinger - I like to wedge the pad of my thumb in front of the hammer slightly to reduce the likelihood of it slipping thru my fingers
    • Pull the trigger, and feel the hammer spring press the hammer against your thumb
    • Release the trigger
    • Slowly ease the hammer down to the half cock notch
    It's really not hard, and knowing how to decock a pistol is far from being a dumb idea. It's a pretty basic manipulation that anyone that carries a pistol should be capable of performing.

    The key elements of decocking a pistol is being able to ensure that the hammer can't slip, and releasing the trigger the INSTANT that the sear trips the hammer.
     
  20. Mainspring

    Mainspring Member

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    Re: One hand slide racking...Ahhhhh. Tricky. Like the old rear sight on the boot heel trick. Got it.

    ARtiger, or anyone...is the dummy panel that replaces the mag brake a factory thing, or some hillbilly rigged after-market contraption? How reliable is the modification?
     
  21. CypherNinja

    CypherNinja Member

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    The mag brake is basically just a long flat slightly curved leaf spring that makes up the rear of the magwell. Think warped poker card.

    One option is to simply remove it, flatten it, and reinstall it.

    If you want factory, either buy a model that drops free, or find which spring from a drop free model will also fit yours. CZFORUM is great for this.

    There are also hillbilly options as well. :D
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2007
  22. Buck Nekkid

    Buck Nekkid Member

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    I have one CZ decocker, the CZ 40P pictured below. It's ok, but I think I really prefer the CZ advantage of cocked & locked, or DA first shot on a manually decocked pistol.

    [​IMG]
     
  23. Medusa

    Medusa Member

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    Manual decocking is very easy, I prefer the safety switch, though I've almost never used it.

    I pinch the hammer, pull the trigger and ease the hammer forward over the notch, then release the trigger and let the hammer drop to the half-cock notch.

    or ease the hammer just over the half-cock notch, release the trigger, and ease the hammer forward, all the way (75B has the firing pin safety - pin is fixed unless the trigger is pulled). It's as safe as the operator makes it.

    But it's a question of taste. As they say - who likes mother, who likes daughter.
     
  24. ARTiger

    ARTiger Member

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    Since they install them on non-braked guns, I would think they could be had from the factory. Just a piece of stamped steel with a slight curvature that exerts some friction on the magazine. Take it out and straighten and mags drop free.

    The gun would probably work fine without it altogether, but it does provide a shield between the magwell and mainspring, so I like the thought of "something" there.
     
  25. Baba Louie

    Baba Louie Member

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    Buck Nekkid,
    How in the tarnation do you holster (or is it sheathe?) that particular roscoe? (Answer... very very carefully) :D
     
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