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CZ RAMI Quality?

Discussion in 'Handguns: Autoloaders' started by ejfalvo, Aug 6, 2018.

  1. ejfalvo

    ejfalvo Member

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    I have a chance to buy a CZ RAMI BNIB, for a great price. I usually carry/shoot Sigs. Curious about CZ quality. Thoughts are appreciated.
     
  2. bannockburn

    bannockburn Member

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    ejfalvo

    I currently have one, a P01, and it's a great 9mm. pistol. Quality of construction and materials used are first rate as is the overall fit and finish and ergonomics. If it were me I would buy the CZ RAMI, especially if it's at a decent price. Don't see many of them around and it should make for a very nice CCW.

    iLROZLp.jpg
     
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  3. somethingbenign

    somethingbenign Member

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    I bought a RAMI earlier this year and really enjoy it. The finish is really top notch and constantly get compliments on how nice looking it is. Durability seems good, after a few hundred rounds I haven't had any issues and no signs of wear. I did have a small issue where the white paint on the front sight flaked off my first trip to the range but CZ fixed it right away with very few questions. Sadly my work situation changed and now carrying anything outside a pocket isn't an option for most the day so the RAMI gets passed over for a Beretta Pico most days. I did experience some very light rust after carrying for a few months in a 100F+ building doing construction but I'd bet that reflects more on my lax in maintenance during those months than build quality. I do take out my RAMI to the range if I just want to shoot to enjoy shooting more than any other pistol I own, even my full sized.
     
  4. Batty67

    Batty67 Member

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    I just sold mine from 2011 to finance, in part, my BHP. Mine was dead nuts reliable and the ergonomics were excellent. And I shtot it very well up to 15 yards, and only had a 3" barrel so that as fine. I kept the stock thin rubber grips, and had grip extenders installed on my 10-round magazine so I had support for my pinky. I thought the 14-round magazines were excellent, as is. But, as a double-stack, I found it too "fat" for CHP so I got a Springfield EMP, which I prefer for carry.

    Finish-wise, nice looking pistol, but per all CZs, finishing the inside of the slide was not a priority.
     
  5. fly out

    fly out Member

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    I have a RAMI and I'm happy to own it. I agree it is a little wide but it feels great in the hand (to me).

    Like its cousin the PCR, they are slightly hard to come by, so I bet you can move it along with little trouble if it turns out you don't like it.

    Mine doesn't have a decocker. If that feature matters to you, you might check, as yours might, or might not...
     
  6. flphotog

    flphotog Member

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    I love my CZ's but as much as I tried the Rami didn't make the cut and I finally sold it. Mostly because it is so thick that it just didn't conceal that well. I could easily carry a P-07 or PCR instead of the Rami, so why carry such a small gun.
     
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  7. Jeb Stuart

    Jeb Stuart Member

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    They sure are beautiful top notch Pistols. Love that pic. Wish I had bought one years ago.
     
  8. PoPo22

    PoPo22 Member

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    CZ guns seem to have been very under rated for a long time now in the U.S. They are very popular in Europe and elsewhere in the world, just never got the proper attention in the U.S. that they deserve. They are quality guns, just pick your poison.
     
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  9. Trunk Monkey

    Trunk Monkey Member

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    The .40 S&W CZ RAMI had known issues with feeding. I sent mine back to CZ-USA 3 or 4 times and they couldn't get it right. I ended up selling it. I've heard nothing but good things about their 9mm RAMIs. I personally think there a better choices in that size of gun. I'd rather have a PCR
     
  10. Seven High

    Seven High Member

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    If you can get it for a good price, buy it. They are fairly hard to find on the used market. You should be easily able to sell it if you do not like it.
     
  11. I6turbo

    I6turbo Member

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    I would have no concerns whatsoever of the quality of a 9-mm RAMI, but for me they aren't in the same league in terms of great ergonomics as the CZ 75-based guns like the PCR and P-01.
     
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  12. PhillySoldier

    PhillySoldier Member

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    Im a Sig fan myself. The gf got a rami last year. Its an excellent subcompact. Shoots great and has the lightest recoil out of a 9mm 3" barrel that ive ever used. I liked it so much it got me to invest in a CZ Shadow 2. There are 2 versions of the Rami. I prefer the one with the decocker. Just to add my only cons are the sights on it suck.
     
  13. zaitcev

    zaitcev Member

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    I can't deal with the cheating with the barrel that's not parallel to the slide. On a bigger CZ-75 it's not as noticeable, but on RAMI the barrel is much shorter and this is why you get the grotesque rear sight. It flips the muzzle more, too. The angle makes the boreaxis height greater. As was mentioned before, the 9mm RAMI is a quality product, just the design has its quirks.
     
  14. ClickClickD'oh

    ClickClickD'oh Member

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    Could you clarify that? Because, everything you just wrote has me scratching my head.
     
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  15. Walt Sherrill

    Walt Sherrill Member

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    I can understand it If you don't like the look of the sights -- that's a subjective viewpoint and correct for you. That said, I don't know where some of your other comments come from.... Cheating?

    First, the barrel almost IS parallel to the slide (and it IS parallel to the frame) and it stays that way until the barrel starts to unlock -- when the barrel in some designs start to tilt UP. (Guns with rotating barrel designs -- at least one Beretta model does that -- keep the bore, slide, parallel throughout the firing cycle, but you still have muzzle flip.) How the sights are mounted on the slide have NO EFFECT on muzzle flip or Bore Axis. Put simply, Bore Axis is how high above the shooter's hand, the barrel's bore is located- and sights have no effect on how the bore axis (or how it's height) affects the shooter.

    Muzzle flip is caused by a number of factors, all of which interact and affect each other -- i can think of several but there may be others:
    1. How high the bore's axis is above the shooter's hand. --The higher the bore axis, the greater the tangential effect of recoil's force on the frame in the shooter's hand.
    2. Frame weight -- a heavy frame is less easily moved or affected by recoil than a light one.
    3. Slide weight (which can affect slide velocity).
    4. How far the slide and barrel must travel.
    5. The load used and the weight of the bullet (which can change the speed with which the bullet moves down the barrel). That in turn affects the speed with which the slide and barrel move to the rear.
    6. The recoil spring(s) or recoil spring assembly used, or recoil dampening system, each of which can change the recoil impulse a bit -- but this is often more of a shooter "feel" thing, than something that greatly affects muzzle flip.
    7. Shooter technique (such as how high you can get your hand on the grip frame without causing problems, Getting a higher grip is a practical way of countering a higher bore axis and it can help to reduce muzzle flip
    8. Porting the barrel and slide, which uses gases from the powder's chemical reactions to redirect some of the gas pushing the bullet forward to hold down barrel down.
    Once the slide starts to move to the rear -- movement caused by the other half of the "equal but opposite reaction" that pushes the bullet down the barrel -- the bullet quickly leaves the barrel (often before the slide has moved as much as 1/10th of an inch),. The slide and barrel movement continues to the rear and pushes against the top of the gun's grip frame (in the shooter's hand), a push caused by the rearward movement of the slide and barrel pressing the recoil spring and guide rod against the frame. Then when the barrel and slide hit their stops (or abutements) in the frame, even more recoil force is applied ot the frame and the shooter's hand. Because the frame is held in the shooter's hand BELOW the bore, the recoil force is transferred to the hand as a tangent force at the top of the grip frame, the hand is forced back in a twisting motion. As the gun tries to pivot in the the shooter's grip, the front of the barrel, slide, and frame have tilted up as they move to the rear.

    Different recoil springs, different loads, better technique (in how you hold the gun), and even barrel porting, can all affect and moderate muzzle flip, but sight placement or sight design doesn't affect bore axis or muzzle flip.
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2018 at 9:48 AM
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  16. zaitcev

    zaitcev Member

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    Stick a pencil in, you'll see. On a classic CZ, the bore axis is not parallel to the top of the slide. It becomes parallel when the barrel cants down to unlock. This is how it differs from every other Browning-type action out there. The supposed advantage is, the slide does not have to continue to rub forcefully upon the barrel as it travels back. RAMI uses the exact same design, just a shorter barrel, so the angle is more extreme.
     
  17. frogfurr

    frogfurr Member

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    Although I don't own a Rami I do own a PCR. CZ's are nice. Excellent quality, reliability, and accuracy. I have never stuck a pencil in my PCR's barrel. I have never seen the need to.
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2018 at 11:23 PM
  18. Walt Sherrill

    Walt Sherrill Member

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    The CZ doesn't differ from every other Browning-type action out there. Whether the barrel is parallel to the top of the top of the slide or to the frame is irrelevant. What matters is whether the sights are aligned with the barrel. That's because you don't align the frame with the target, or the top of the barrel with the target, you align the sights with the target which should be adjusted or fit to be in alignment with the barrel. The relationship between the barrel and the top of the slide is absolutely irrelevant. It simply doesn't have anything to do with how the barrel tilts or the gun functions..

    With a traditional Browning Short Recoil Locked Breech gun with a tilting barrel, the barrel must tilt for it to unlock. If it doesn't unlock, it can't get the fired casing out of the chamber, and it can't self load. When the frame, barrel, and slide are shorter, but the cartridge isn't, the amount of tilt required to unlock is greater. .That's because when the gun is smaller -- shorter slide, barrel and frame -- and the cartridge it's handling isn't, the slide must still move back far enough to guide the spent casing out of the chamber to hit the ejector. The slide must still move, but the barrel has less space to move in, and it must TILT so as to not interfere with slide movement.

    About the only place the slide and barrel can rub against each other when the gun cycles is the opening on the front of the slide where the muzzle sticks out. When they design guns with short barrels they generally enlarge that opening so that the tilting barrel will not hit and rub the slide.

    Folks who pick up sub compact versions of a gun they already own are often concerned because the barrel seems to be resting at the bottom of the opening in the slide, and they're afraid that the gun is going to be shooting DOWN. They think it should be centered in that opening. Most of the time it's position is where it needs to be, and the top of the opening on the front of the slide has been enlarged to prevent excessive rubbing or wear. The openings are sometimes almost oval, not round.​

    Whether the top of the slide is parallel to the barrel/bore axis or frame has NOTHING to do with how the barrel and slide interact. It has nothing to do with the amount of tilt observed when the gun cycles. It also has virtually nothing to do with anything you've described. The top of the slide and its relationship to the barrel position (which is NOT the same as the gun's bore axis) is a non-factor in this discussion.
     
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  19. zaitcev

    zaitcev Member

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    Precisely. This is why, on all other guns, where the barrel is parallel to the top of the slide when the gun is in battery, the front and rear sights have about the same height. But on a CZ, they are different, with the rear sight taller than the front. This is because, as you astutely observed, the sight line needs to be parallel to the bore and not the slide. The difference is greater on the RAMI because its barrel is shorter.

    Sounds that we're in a violent agreement, except:

    This is where you're simply wrong. The difference is simple. On a conventional Browning-style gun, the tilt of the barrel continues to increase as the slide travels to the rear after it's unlocked and the barrel is initially canted. This much should be obvious, right? But this means that the front bushing continuously exerts upward force onto the barrel when it cycles back, then at the rear of the travel it must absorb the inertial of the barrel's rotation and force it rotating in the opposite direction (assuming a straight barrel and not something like SIG P290). But on a CZ, all the rotation is done when unlocking (and locking). All the rest of the travel of the slide proceeds without any additional tilting of the barrel. So, the force at the front of the slide is much smaller (it's not zero because the frame of the gun is flipping and this motion has to be transferred too, but it's a second order effect).
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2018 at 2:13 AM
  20. guyfromohio

    guyfromohio Member

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    Quality....great! However, I was disappointed with the feel of mine. I've owned G26s, HKp30sk, and a number of similar-purpose 10-shot subcompacts. By far, the Rami had the worst grip for me. Put in the extended mag and you might as well just carry a PCR or compact. Personally, I'd just go with the compact size CZ again. I sold mine quickly, but fortunately got what I paid due to the rarity of the BD at the time.
     
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