CZ vs. AREX

[Rittmeister]

I'm contemplating the next addition to my safe.

I am a huge fan of CZs. I currently have a P07 and an SP01, and in the past had both a CZ75 SA and a P09. I'd love to have an SP01 Phantom next, it's got the lighter weight of the P09 but without the extra-long grip frame. The downside is that they're hard to find these days; I keep hoping CZ will put them back into production/distribution. They pop up on Armslist now and then, and it'd just be a matter of having one shipped to my FFL.

However - I'm also intrigued by the new REX01 from AREX. It's getting very positive reviews and addresses all the things I don't like about Sigs (slide release location and price) while keeping the features I do like (ergos, DA/SA, general aesthetics). It's new and unproven but the manufacturing reputation is there, I think (ISO9001 etc). A few shops local to me are finally carrying them though I haven't actually handled one yet.

So, I'm curious what opinions y'all might have as to a choice between the two. Weight is similar, capacity is similar, not much else though. This wouldn't be for carry; mostly for range use and home defense.

The obvious solution would be to buy both Maybe if the budget allows, I will, but for now I'm assuming it'll be one or the other.

Thoughts?

 

[sigarms228]

Between a CZ and Arex, for me it would be no contest and I would go with a CZ. Arex is unproven and unknown what warranty service and parts availability will be down the road. Resale would be much much better for a CZ too. If you want a SIG but don't like the price there are lots of nice used SIGs or CPOs at or near that Arex new price. LGS had a really nice German made/proofed P226 for $629 last time I was there.

 

[armoredman]

Or you might be intrigued to know the Phantom is back in the catalog as of this year? Love mine, get a new one.

 

[Old Dog]

... However - I'm also intrigued by the new REX01 from AREX. It's getting very positive reviews and addresses all the things I don't like about Sigs (slide release location and price) while keeping the features I do like (ergos, DA/SA, general aesthetics). It's new and unproven but the manufacturing reputation is there, I think (ISO9001 etc). A few shops local to me are finally carrying them though I haven't actually handled one yet....

Yeah, the YouTube MAC dude likes the AREX ... it's a crude copy of the SIG P-226 (somehow, even much uglier), and it passed his (gosh, and he is an AREX dealer) YouTube "torture test." I've seen zero other reviews of this pistol; anyone who's seen other impartial reviews (from credible sources), please feel free to link to them ...

Give me the time-tested and proven CZ any day of the week and twice on Sunday over that T-Rex concoction ... (or for that matter, even a well-used, beater SIG). I'm betting that the CZ's accuracy is hands-down better than the AREX product, and the CZ's superior ergonomics and reliability easily render it a much better head-to-head choice over an upstart manufacturer's un-proven copy of another auto-pistol, no matter how great the original is.

 

[kozak6]

The Arex is a proprietary soup of the day import from a no-name company.

What if you need an extractor in 5 years? Or what if you need a spare magazine right now?

You will be able to buy a CZ pistol, parts, mags, accessories, and get factory service 5 years from now. You can't even say that of Arex right now.

 

[lsudave]

The Arex does look interesting, and I am curious about how it's going to turn out being. But it's unproven, and appears to be an entry level gun with a rather high sticker (a move done to separate from the various Turkish guns, and to try to piggyback onto the Sig name).

My personal opinion, all else being equal, and regardless of price: I'd rather have a CZ than an Arex or other Sig-like gun. I'd rather have a Sig than a Canik, SAR or other CZ-like gun. Push come to shove, I'd rather have a CZ than a Sig (and I do)... but that's off-topic.

Here's a suggestion, take it as it's worth: if you're open to used guns, and you are interested in the Sig style aesthetics and shape, but don't care for the high price and the slide release location: look into the Zastava CZ99/EZ9 guns. They're out there for pretty cheap (I picked a CZ99 up on gunbroker for $200), and they're mechanically sound guns. Having already owned one when the Arex came out, to me, the Arex doesn't look like a Sig, it looks like a refined EZ9 with some mods. They have the same decocker/slide release (the CZ99 is ambidextrous, the Arex is not). They don't have a safety, while the Arex does. The barrels are hard-chromed. Mine is acceptably accurate (about as good as any other service gun, and better than me), and I haven't had any feed issues. The guns appear closely related.
Would I recommend a CZ99 as a primary gun- no; but you've said you already have that covered, and are looking for something else for the range. I'd pick up a CZ99 for well under $300 before I would pop for a $500+ Arex.

 

[Rittmeister]

Thanks for the replies.

-Sigarms228 - ditto the unproven-ness of the AREX, something I mentioned above. I frankly had not thought about parts availability, and it definitely bears consideration.
-Armoredman - be still my heart! I'd heard so many reasons why the Phantom wasn't available, ranging from "all the production is going to the Czech military" to "they just ain't makin' 'em right now." I wonder if the newer polymer (per CZ USA's website) offers a huge advantage over the original version (used market). More importantly, I wonder when they'll actually start distributing.
-Old Dog - tell us how ya really feel, why don't ya FYI, there are quite a number of AREX reviews floating around Youtube and elsewhere at this point, so I'm not basing my desire either primarily or only on MAC's recommendation. Your points are valid though.
- kozak6 - the parts argument again, no doubt. I'm starting to see the wisdom.
- lsudave - I've looked into the Zastava guns and I'm just turned off by the aesthetics. Personal preference I guess. What can I say?

I do appreciate all the input. Other than price, I like that the AREX has a manual safety and I like that the slide release isn't in the usual Sig location - every Sig I shoot except for the P320 I wind up holding the slide release down with my thumb and of course it doesn't lock back empty. BUT, if the Phantom is about to become more available that may tip the scales in its favor regardless of anything else. I think I may pick one up, and wait a while to see how things go when the AREXs start breaking/needing fixed.

Thanks!

 

[papaairbear]

Yeah, the YouTube MAC dude likes the AREX ... it's a crude copy of the SIG P-226 (somehow, even much uglier), and it passed his (gosh, and he is an AREX dealer) YouTube "torture test." I've seen zero other reviews of this pistol; anyone who's seen other impartial reviews (from credible sources), please feel free to link to them ...

Give me the time-tested and proven CZ any day of the week and twice on Sunday over that T-Rex concoction ... (or for that matter, even a well-used, beater SIG). I'm betting that the CZ's accuracy is hands-down better than the AREX product, and the CZ's superior ergonomics and reliability easily render it a much better head-to-head choice over an upstart manufacturer's un-proven copy of another auto-pistol, no matter how great the original is.

This guy knows some about hand guns, and he likes it.

I own an SP01, and did own a 75B until I gave it to my son, and I like them tremendously. But, they're not the end all masterpiece pistol fanboys tend to make them out to be,

 

[tarosean]

This guy knows some about hand guns, and he likes it

Seems like I have an 870 or two that could group better at 10yds..

 

[bannockburn]

Rittmeister

The Rex01 does look interesting but until they have some sort of long term track record to back their product and support with I would have to say go with the SP01 Phantom when they become available.

 

[papaairbear]

Seems like I have an 870 or two that could group better at 10yds..

he does shoot a lot of pistols.

 

[jhb]

own both. multiple cz75 and 85s and po7 etc all worked flawlessly out of the box. my arex was doa out of the box. yeah should have checked it better before i accepted the transfer but i missed the decocker/slide release being flawed/defective. i'm stuck paying to ship it back to them. so my experience may be the odd one, but paying the bucks to ship it which is massive about 1/3rd the cost of the gun, unless i find an ffl who will handle it for me, shapes how i picture the company. while the arex folks were pleasant on the phone and such they refuse to help in any way on shipping costs. so be it, they didn't hide that or anything i just was hoping for a working model and i didn't get one. my fault on assuming too much. course cz likely has the same policy so it's not exactly fair to for me to be mad at arex due to this, but i've only bought one arex and over a half dozen czs and all the czs worked and the arex didn't. if i bought another arex id only buy from a brick and mortar store with supreme warranty coverage on their end since arex doesn't have what i need on their end.

it's taught me a lesson on not buying oddballs without superior warranty and shipping costs coverage. while i'm sure it's rare, but when it does happen its a mess of money out of my pocket i shouldn't have had to pay.

 

[armoredman]

I haven't had to send CZ firearms back but the ones I know who have sometimes get a call tag from the company if it's an obvious factory defect. Most companies I deal with do that if I can show them it was not my fault.

-Armoredman - be still my heart! I'd heard so many reasons why the Phantom wasn't available, ranging from "all the production is going to the Czech military" to...

Actually, you nailed it on the head - contract is met. Call 1-800-955-4486 and ask if the new Phantoms, (per the catalog, the polymer has been upgraded to the same material used in the P-09/P-07, MSRP $636.), are available yet, and grab you one.
That AREX reminds me a LOT of my old Astra A-80, which was another SIG P-220/226 clone back in the day. Nothing wrong with it, good solid sidearm, LOONG trigger that the AREX obviously doesn't have, and from what little of the video I could get to play, (connection issues here in the MONW), it looked like a nice short reset. I always liked the P-220, said it was the only 45 ACP pistol that I liked. I know, horror of horrors. I wouldn't mind giving the AREX a whirl someday.

 

[Rittmeister]

Is the newer polymer that desirable over the older stuff? I never heard of the original Phantoms having the same issues as say the P07 frame bulge problem. Yes, I know the new Phantoms will be the new-new, no-bulge polymer. I'm wondering if good deals will become available on the used market for older Phantoms.

 

[ritepath]

I looked at one of those Arex things at a funshow two weeks ago. I didn't think it was possible to be bulkier than a Sig, but they proved me wrong.


Maybe it just feels and looks bigger, all I know is I'd not trade any CZ for three of them.

 

[ritepath]

I looked at one of those Arex things at a funshow two weeks ago. I didn't think it was possible to be bulkier than a Sig, but they proved me wrong.


Maybe it just feels and looks bigger, all I know is I'd not trade any CZ for three of them.

 

[viking499]

Is the newer polymer that desirable over the older stuff? I never heard of the original Phantoms having the same issues as say the P07 frame bulge problem. Yes, I know the new Phantoms will be the new-new, no-bulge polymer. I'm wondering if good deals will become available on the used market for older Phantoms.

I would say that it is just a different blend than what was used in the past. Easier to have one mixture rather than two.

 

[strambo]

Hard to say, I love my Sigs, but understand the concern about the different slide release location. Personally, I never use the slide release on any pistol anyway so it doesn't matter to me (just as a slide lock for admin purposes). The dual slide release/de-cocker is a nifty idea though. ...and CZs are great guns as well!

 

[jjones45]

Personally I'd go with the Cz sp01 phantom or a p01 over an Arex. Not because I believe Arex isn't a good pistol, just because I love Cz's and they are my favorite handgun manufacturer. People's concerns over customer service and parts from an unproven company is a legitimate one, however if you have that mentality you will limit yourself to the same ole guns and never try anything new. Those same concerns were once concerns when Cz started in the 70's or when Sig started. Of course a company has to make its bones and produce a track record. Unless I'm missing something here, I can't think of any gun company that came around without issues they needed to work out and without building a good reputation which takes years and years. By all accounts the Arex is a good gun with good reviews from everyone I've seen who posted one (gun magazines, YouTubers, and average gun owners). If these guns were bad I think there would be some evidence of that somewhere. If you know about machining and manufacturing then you would know that Arex gives nothing up to sig or Cz in those regards. If you follow others logic then no new gun companies should exist ever again because there's always the big "IF" you need that or "IF" this breaks and we don't know what will happen "IF". Imagine what this world would be like if we only bought things that been around since the 70's and 80's because they have a track record and been proven. Forget about the great 1911 companies like Les Baer, Wilson Combat, and Nighthawk Custom because Colt is the only proven company from years ago who will offer great customer service and deal with your problems. I plan to get a Arex Rex Zero1s compact this year so I'll give you a honest review of it when I do. I plan on running about 5000 rounds through it in about 2 months. I know it's not 20,000 rounds like some will say, but if you have that kind of money to spend on ammunition then buying parts and new guns really shouldn't be a problem considering you would have litteraly bought the pistol over and over again. Maybe we should tell the new Hudson gun company to just stop making the H9 and pursuing their dreams because they have no track record and we don't know if we will be able to get replacement parts and good customer service if problems arise. It's just kind of foolish thinking if you ask me, especially since even well established gun companies put lemons out sometimes. Buy what you want and don't let anyone sway you. Do your research and give it a go. With all that said I think the phantom and p01 are the best 9mm's made and you really can't do any better than those as a production combat pistol in that price range and higher

 

[sigarms228]

own both. multiple cz75 and 85s and po7 etc all worked flawlessly out of the box. my arex was doa out of the box. yeah should have checked it better before i accepted the transfer but i missed the decocker/slide release being flawed/defective. i'm stuck paying to ship it back to them. so my experience may be the odd one, but paying the bucks to ship it which is massive about 1/3rd the cost of the gun, unless i find an ffl who will handle it for me, shapes how i picture the company. while the arex folks were pleasant on the phone and such they refuse to help in any way on shipping costs.

it's taught me a lesson on not buying oddballs without superior warranty and shipping costs coverage. while i'm sure it's rare, but when it does happen its a mess of money out of my pocket i shouldn't have had to pay.

Wow that is horrible customer service, especially for startup trying to break into a very competitive market, and sorry to hear about your AREX being DOA out of the box. Tells volumes about their failure to deliver a working firearm out of the box which really questions their quality control and then not paying for shipping both ways for the same for a brand new pistol. That is not standing by their product which for a new startup in the firearms business is not a smart move. Hope your hard lesson learned helps someone else.

 

[armoredman]

Is the newer polymer that desirable over the older stuff? I never heard of the original Phantoms having the same issues as say the P07 frame bulge problem. Yes, I know the new Phantoms will be the new-new, no-bulge polymer.

I can't say one way or another except I have the older Phantom and it seems to be just fine compared to the P-09 material.

I'm wondering if good deals will become available on the used market for older Phantoms...

Maybe, but not mine!

 

[jjones45]

own both. multiple cz75 and 85s and po7 etc all worked flawlessly out of the box. my arex was doa out of the box. yeah should have checked it better before i accepted the transfer but i missed the decocker/slide release being flawed/defective. i'm stuck paying to ship it back to them. so my experience may be the odd one, but paying the bucks to ship it which is massive about 1/3rd the cost of the gun, unless i find an ffl who will handle it for me, shapes how i picture the company. while the arex folks were pleasant on the phone and such they refuse to help in any way on shipping costs. so be it, they didn't hide that or anything i just was hoping for a working model and i didn't get one. my fault on assuming too much. course cz likely has the same policy so it's not exactly fair to for me to be mad at arex due to this, but i've only bought one arex and over a half dozen czs and all the czs worked and the arex didn't. if i bought another arex id only buy from a brick and mortar store with supreme warranty coverage on their end since arex doesn't have what i need on their end.

it's taught me a lesson on not buying oddballs without superior warranty and shipping costs coverage. while i'm sure it's rare, but when it does happen its a mess of money out of my pocket i shouldn't have had to pay.

Fime Group should have definitely handled this situation better. No excuses for that. This is litteraly the first "real" negative thing I heard about this pistol. Just for what it's worth I've seen a sig that had a dao trigger out of the box, it was supposed to be da/sa. Also a friend of mine had the hk45 compact in fde when they were first introduced and it would go da only as well. Also a fireman I know won a ruger about 8 years ago that had a broken firing pin out of the box. Difference is sig, Hk and ruger took care of those customers for free because they recognized it was the companies defect. You should have emailed Fime and shared it with us, sometimes these companies or people who work for them need to be exposed.

 

[jhb]

it is what it is. i was irate initially, but decided nothing they did was wrong as they are clear they wont pay shipping. i dont like it obviously but it is what it is. my fault for not considering the risk of a no name pistol being pushed by youtube reviewers. ive done it many times before so my record has been good on oddballs, not so much on surplus but that's another story. fime were pleasant and stuck to their laid out rules so i cant complain about that. its a business and they have to make money. i get that. i just know first hand the gun isnt indestructible as its being pitched all over youtube by mac and such.

i stick by my point of if i bought another arex i would only buy brick and mortar who would handle shipping fees under some sort of store warranty. i have to admit im biased though.

 

[jjones45]

Well I definitely think your experience warrants those feelings and I would probably feel the same given the same situation. I know a lot of people who won't by brand "X" anymore because of how a situation was handled. Sometimes a company with lose a customer to say a buck, which doesn't make sense to me. But like you said, it's a business. And business doesn't always make sense to us customer. I'm still going to buy a compact this year sometime and give them a shot. I'll definitely check my trigger before I accept it

 

[jhb]

i expect youll have no problems. mines likely a one off. still hasnt changed my mind on local buy only with odd ball brands, with very strong store or oddball brand, support.