Quantcast
  1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

D.C. gun case may hit Chicago (Tribune Article)

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by Neo-Luddite, Sep 5, 2007.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Neo-Luddite

    Neo-Luddite Member

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2006
    Messages:
    2,990
    Location:
    Northwest IL--the other 'Downstate'
    http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/chi-guns_wed1sep05,0,3684121.story

    D.C. gun case may hit Chicago
    City's law is next target if foes win in Supreme Court

    By James Oliphant | Washington Bureau
    September 5, 2007


    WASHINGTON - Those who would do away with Washington's near-total ban on handguns will tell you point-blank their next target: Chicago.

    Gun-rights advocates scored a stunning success earlier this year when a three-judge panel of a federal appeals court in Washington swept aside the District of Columbia's ban on owning handguns, which had been in place since 1976.

    On Tuesday, the district government appealed the decision to the Supreme Court. If the court takes the case, as many observers believe it will, it could place Chicago's handgun ban, as well as similar laws nationwide, in jeopardy.



    "There is reason to be concerned at this point," said Thomas Mannard, executive director of the Illinois Council Against Handgun Violence.

    "Chicago would be the logical follow-up," said Robert Levy, a libertarian activist who filed the case against the D.C. ban. Levy, too, wants the Supreme Court to take the case, making this a rare instance when both sides in a dispute hope an appeal goes forward.

    In a 2-1 decision in March, a panel of the U.S. Court of Appeals here said the district's ban violated the Constitution's 2nd Amendment. It was the most affirmative and sweeping embrace of the right to bear arms yet by a federal appellate court.

    'We do not need more guns'

    That left the D.C. government in a bind. It faced a choice of asking the Supreme Court to take the case and risk triggering a monumental ruling from its conservative majority -- one that could wipe out gun bans across the nation -- or accepting the appeals court decision and reworking its ordinance. It decided to go for broke.

    At a news conference Tuesday on the steps of the district's police headquarters, Mayor Adrian Fenty said the city had no choice.

    "In the end, the bottom line is that we do not need more guns in this city," said Fenty, flanked by more than a dozen police officers. "The only possible outcome with more handguns is more violence."

    As an example of the urgency of the situation, district officials cited the death Sunday of a teenager who was shot by a 15-year-old in a struggle over a handgun. Five people were killed in the district in close to a 24-hour period over the weekend. In Chicago, the homicide rate is down this year by almost 8 percent compared to a year ago, according to the Chicago Police Department, which credits, among others things, an active effort to keep handguns off the streets.

    "The handgun ban in Chicago has made the city safer," said Tom Vanden Berk, executive director of UCAN, a Chicago social welfare agency. Vanden Berk's son was killed in crossfire in 1992.

    Bans ineffective, critics say

    But critics say that while law-abiding residents cannot keep handguns for self-defense, the ban does nothing to prevent the flow of illegal guns into Chicago from surrounding areas where buying a gun is easier. As an example, they cite the city resorting to such tactics as the recent gun buyback, which netted almost 6,000 handguns and assault weapons in exchange for amnesty and $100 debit cards.



    The first sweeping gun ban in the nation was passed by Morton Grove, Ill., in 1981. After it was upheld by the 7th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals, the Supreme Court declined to hear the case. That gave such cities as Chicago reason to believe that their gun bans were bulletproof. But a Supreme Court ruling now would trump the 7th Circuit decision.

    If the high court were to endorse a broad view of the 2nd Amendment in the D.C. case, it would be a short step for Levy and other gun-rights activists to argue that the amendment also applies to such municipal ordinances as the Chicago ban.

    The district's decision to appeal has left gun-control advocates angst-ridden. They worry that the district's case isn't the best positioned for Supreme Court review and fear a precedent that could have a cascade effect across the nation.

    "There are obvious risks to taking this particular case before this particular court," said Dennis Henigan, legal director of the Brady Center to Prevent Gun Violence.

    The Supreme Court has not directly ruled on the scope of the 2nd Amendment since 1939, and regardless, Henigan said, the current court is "comfortable disregarding very old precedents." Added Kristen Rand, legislative director of the Violence Policy Center in Washington: "I think you can rest assured that virtually every gun law in the country would be at risk."

    D.C.'s attorney general, Linda Singer, said the district could not worry about the effect a negative ruling would have on other cities. "Our responsibility is to the District of Columbia," Singer said.

    - - -

    Chicago gun ban similar to Washington's

    The Chicago handgun ban is considered a close cousin of the District of Columbia law, which prohibits the possession of handguns in the home but permits ownership of rifles and shotguns. The Chicago ordinance, enacted in 1983, bars the ownership of handguns and assault weapons and mandates that guns owned before the ban must be reregistered every two years.
     
  2. Neo-Luddite

    Neo-Luddite Member

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2006
    Messages:
    2,990
    Location:
    Northwest IL--the other 'Downstate'
    I added the bolding to highlight the fact that the only sources allowed to weigh in on the issue in the article are pattently anti-gun rights 100%.
    Not very balanced reporting for the Tribune--anyone care to send a few nice emails?
     
  3. Officers'Wife

    Officers'Wife Member

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2007
    Messages:
    3,021
    Location:
    A long way from heaven and too close to Chicago
    Hi Neo,

    Nothing personal but expecting the Trib or the Daley News to be balanced is much akin to asking the Easter Bunny to deliver Christmas presents.

    Chicago is a hellhole with a violent culture. No law, no ban of any sort is going to change that. Only when the culture changes will the violence abate. As long as the Trib and the Sun Times make excuses the culture will never change. Just the opinion of someone that lived in an area a long way from heaven and too close to Chicago.

    Selena
     
  4. frogomatic

    frogomatic Member

    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2007
    Messages:
    522
    I grew up in southern IL, and frankly I was sick of chicago politics taking away my gun rights from 200 miles away 10 F'n years ago(I've since moved to a state that's not retarded). I hope DC gets a legal beating, and that chicago is next on the list, for the sake of all my gun toting buddies back home.
     
  5. Neo-Luddite

    Neo-Luddite Member

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2006
    Messages:
    2,990
    Location:
    Northwest IL--the other 'Downstate'
    I know--'Balanced Reporting' is asking a lot--especially in Chicago.
     
  6. El Tejon

    El Tejon Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2002
    Messages:
    18,085
    Location:
    Lafayette, Indiana-the Ned Flanders neighbor to Il
    The antis are finally realizing what an atomic bomb Parker represents.:D

    If the Supreme Court upholds an individual right to arms, they are in the same position as Americans for Book Control.:cool: And a new wave of pro-gun litigation will sweep throughout every federal appellate circuit.
     
  7. scout26

    scout26 Member

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2003
    Messages:
    2,621
    Location:
    Illinois - The Deadbeat State

    Hehehehehe......Looks like they finally cracked the code.......

    [Dances around like a giddy schoolgirl]
     
  8. MatthewVanitas

    MatthewVanitas Member

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2002
    Messages:
    3,458
    Location:
    Montreal, Québec
    Which organizations are spearheading the challenge to D.C.?

    Is now the time to be making extra donations to one org or another that's really a player in this case?
     
  9. Dave Workman

    Dave Workman Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2006
    Messages:
    423
    Location:
    Washington state
    Okay, I am puzzled. Just what isn't balanced about this report?

    The Tribune's James Oliphant accurately describes the dilemma now faced by gun control proponents: A Supreme Court ruling upholding the District Court of Appeals decision written by Judge Laurence Silberman could be devastating to restrictive gun laws across the country. I've seen a lot of people say the same thing right here on this forum.

    And you guys are complaining that the Chicago Tribune reports this? It is essentially the same thing I wrote in a Gun Digest, The Magazine analysis a few months ago, and nobody here squawked about that.

    I submit that the Chicago Tribune has nailed this story, and this issue, precisely. Gun control proponents are very fearful of a SCOTUS ruling favorable to the individual rights interpretation, and supporting the notion that gun bans violate the Second Amendment, which protects the right of an individual citizen to keep and bear arms. There is nothing inaccurate or biased about that at all. It's true.

    The Tribune accurately notes that Chicago's gun ban could be the next target, because supporters of the Parker case have indicated that very thing to me. This story even quotes Bob Levy, and his remark comes as no surprise.

    Now, in keeping with the new spirit around here, if you have a beef with this story in the Tribune, send a letter to the editor.
     
  10. Dave Workman

    Dave Workman Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2006
    Messages:
    423
    Location:
    Washington state
    MatthewVanitas:
    Mr. Levy is taking no financial assistance from any pro-gun organizations to fight this case, so far as I know. You will very likely see those organizations, or at least some of them, file supporting briefs.
     
  11. Neo-Luddite

    Neo-Luddite Member

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2006
    Messages:
    2,990
    Location:
    Northwest IL--the other 'Downstate'
    Yes, Dave--letters to the editor!

    Notice that the 'balance' of pro gun opinion is summarized as 'critics say'--and the opposing view is carried aloft with directly attributed statements from no less than four individuals and organizations. I would have expected at least some statement thrown in (supporting Mr. Levy) from the ISRA or NRA spokesperson or that of a similar group.

    And that is my beef.
     
    Last edited: Sep 5, 2007
  12. ServiceSoon

    ServiceSoon Member

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2006
    Messages:
    1,404
    Location:
    Michiana
    Mind if I join you?

    THis case brought to you by...Alan Gura, Gura & Possessky, PLLC; and Robert A. Levy, Senior Fellow in Constitutional Studies, Cato Institute. I do believe that they are not accepting dontations for this case. I'm sure www.cato.org would accept a donation in their name.

    BTW As filed to the SCOTUS the case name is District of Columbia, Mayor Fenty v. Dick Heller.
     
  13. ozwyn

    ozwyn Member

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2006
    Messages:
    714
    Location:
    Maryland
    given what IMO is an amazingly weak appeal, the anti-gun crowd SHOULD be worried.
     
  14. Robert Hairless

    Robert Hairless Member

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2003
    Messages:
    3,983
    Ozwyn, in another thread Henry Bowman pointed out to me that all we've seen is the District's petition for the Supreme Court to hear its appeal. He's a knowledgable attorney.
     
  15. fletcher

    fletcher Member

    Joined:
    May 19, 2004
    Messages:
    2,559
    Location:
    TX
    Sounds good to me.

    Why don't local gun groups have "buybacks" from people who otherwise wouldn't use the gun? It sounds like a good way to score some good firearms in need of a loving home.
     
  16. W.E.G.

    W.E.G. Member

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2006
    Messages:
    7,392
    Location:
    all over Virginia
    The case should not be referred to anymore as the "Parker" case.

    The correct party is HELLER.
    (...and I kinda like that - as in give 'em HELL)

    [​IMG]

    PARTIES TO THE PROCEEDING
    Petitioners District of Columbia and Mayor Adrian M.
    Fenty were defendants-appellees below. Mayor Fenty was
    substituted automatically for the previous Mayor, Anthony
    A. Williams, under Federal Rule of Appellate Procedure
    43(b)(2).
    Respondent Dick Anthony Heller was the only plaintiffappellant
    below held by the court of appeals to have standing.
    The other plaintiffs-appellants were Shelly Parker, Tom
    G. Palmer, Gillian St. Lawrence, Tracey Ambeau, and
    George Lyon.
     
  17. El Tejon

    El Tejon Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2002
    Messages:
    18,085
    Location:
    Lafayette, Indiana-the Ned Flanders neighbor to Il
    Oh, fine, go all lawyer on me.:neener:

    I called it Parker because that's what the appellate case was and that is the nuclear weapon that is poised to wipe out gun control. Parker/Heller=a weapon of mass restoration (of civil rights).:D
     
  18. Standing Wolf

    Standing Wolf Member in memoriam

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2002
    Messages:
    24,041
    Location:
    Idahohoho, the jolliest state
    "In the end, the bottom line is that we do not need more guns in this city," said Fenty, flanked by more than a dozen police officers. "The only possible outcome with more handguns is more violence."

    Yeah, but the cops don't play politics in uniform.
     
  19. MrPeter

    MrPeter Member

    Joined:
    Jan 4, 2007
    Messages:
    523
    Location:
    Olympia, WA
    Cheers to the good folks and wherever they came from that are doing our nation a great service. Anyone know how we can help them? Is the NRA having any kind of hand in this?

    It almost doesn't matter. It's like a dream come true!
     
  20. W.E.G.

    W.E.G. Member

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2006
    Messages:
    7,392
    Location:
    all over Virginia
    You can call it the "Fenty" case, or the "Idiots in DC" case for all I care.

    But understand this - whatever the outcome of the case in the SUPREME COURT OF THE UNITED STATES, the correct reference to the case will be "Heller." I don't make up these rules. I just report them.
     
  21. Noxx

    Noxx Member

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2007
    Messages:
    1,374
    Location:
    SoCal
    I know I've said it before, but I can't help saying it again.

    I cannot wait for SCOTUS to hear this, the impact of a decision in our favor is mind-blowing, real dancing in the streets type stuff.

    Gonna be a bright, bright, sunshiny day :D
     
  22. Mainsail

    Mainsail Member

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2005
    Messages:
    3,070
    Location:
    Washington
    They sure glossed over this little tidbit. Two teenagers struggling over a handgun in a place where it’s 100% illegal to own or possess a handgun. That, on its face, says the ban they are trying so hard to maintain is hopelessly flawed and unworkable.
     
  23. Dave Workman

    Dave Workman Member

    Joined:
    Jul 6, 2006
    Messages:
    423
    Location:
    Washington state
    Neo-Luddite wrote:
    Well, NL, it's not a good beef. This story is about the fears (justifiable IMO) among the anti-gunners about the potential of a favorable ruling by SCOTUS. It's a story about their concerns, not about some pro-gun chest-thumping. That'll come later. Once that is in perspective, there's nothing wrong with this story at all, and if there were a problem, I'd say so. As I said earlier, this is pretty much the same thing I wrote back in the spring.

    It is quite possible that he could not reach anyone at ISRA or NRA...or some other organization, or they did not return his calls. The Second Amendment Foundation earlier today issued a blistering statement about Fenty's remarks that is available at www.saf.org and will likely be on KeepAndBearArms.com tomorrow morning.
     
  24. ServiceSoon

    ServiceSoon Member

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2006
    Messages:
    1,404
    Location:
    Michiana
    That is an exellent question and was the point of this thread. If only there was a pro-gun lawyer that frequented this forum and could make a comment. :evil:

    Some information on this can be found here.
     
  25. hotsauce

    hotsauce Member

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2006
    Messages:
    59
    Chicago is an awesome place to live or visit if you can put up with cold weather which I love. If this happenes I will not return and that makes me sad. The crime rates will go through the roof over night and getting mugged at gun point sucks. D.C. just flat out sucks anyway IMO so I really do not care about ever going there again. BTW, I live in S.C. and it does'nt get quieter than this. Except for the time I hit my range which is my back porch and let off a few rounds.
     
    Last edited: Sep 5, 2007
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page