Department of Homeland Security Keeping a List of CCW Holders

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Jeff White

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No, this isn't some whacked out conspiracy theory. At least one state, Missouri, is sharing CCW holder information with DHS:

http://stlouis.cbslocal.com/2013/03...dminstration-helping-feds-compile-a-gun-list/

Kinder Says Nixon Administration Helping Feds Compile a Gun List
Kevin Killeen
March 7, 2013 4:05 PM


ST. LOUIS–(KMOX)– Lt. Governor Peter Kinder says the Missouri Department of Revenue is illegally sharing information on concealed gun permit applicants with the U.S. Department of Homeland Security.

“We’re trying to get answers from the Governor and he’s stonewalling us,” Kinder said, “Missourians have a right to know where this policy came from.”

KMOX is awaiting calls back from both Governor Jay Nixon’s office. The Department of Revenue issued a statement saying its operations are “consistent with the protocols of state law.”

The allegation first surfaced Monday in a lawsuit filed by Eric Griffin of Stoddard County, Missouri. Griffin’s suit claims he was seeking a concealed carry gun licence at a local fee office, when he was told his personal information would be forwarded to other government agencies. A judge has issued a temporary restraining order against the alleged data sharing, and a hearing is scheduled for Tuesday.

Meanwhile, Republican lawmakers say such data sharing would be a violation of Missouri law.................rest of the story at the link

http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/...cle_93bcd344-3eae-5c18-a26b-5369c71207ec.html

Mo. Revenue Department faces questions
Print Email
1 hour ago • By Elizabeth Crisp [email protected] ​573-635-6178


Is Missouri tracking personal info through drivers licenses, gun permits?

The Missouri Department of Revenue faced a first round of questioning today over whether private information is being tracked through the state’s new drivers’ license system.

A Missouri House committee is preparing to hold a hearing next Monday regarding allegations that the Revenue Department and local license fee offices have been scanning documents that contain personal data, including that related to concealed carry permits, and sharing those documents with a third party and the federal government.

In a House Budget Committee hearing today, DOR Deputy Director John Mollenkamp said the department is still working on gathering data for Monday’s meeting but assured members that documents are scanned, encrypted and sent only to the state data center in Jefferson City.

“It stops there – the scanned documents go no further,” he said.

The Revenue Department recently rolled out new drivers’ licenses with enhanced security features that are supposed to curb the risk of identity theft and fraud. Because of the new security features, the licenses are mailed to recipients from a third-party vendor that prints them.

Mollenkamp said the printers are high-tech and too expensive for the state to own its own.

“They are the printer – the printer for the new-style license,” he said.

He said the outside company never receives copies of the original source documents and instead gets basic information from a data file, including the driver’s license photo, name, address and descriptive details, like height and weight, which appear on the front of the license.

The equipment used in local fee offices to collect the documents – scanners and computers – is owned by the third-party vendor, Mollenkamp said. Routers that have been used to transmit the data were purchased through a Homeland Security Department grant, he said.

“It is my understanding that there is not any information being sent to the federal government,” Mollenkamp said.

Rep. Jay Barnes, a Republican from Jefferson City who chairs the House Government and Accountability Oversight Committee, has sent a letter to the Revenue Department, the state Office of Administration and other agencies, requesting copies of all rules and procedures related to the copying and transfer of personal information of Missouri residents applying for drivers’ licenses or concealed carry permits. According to the letter, Barnes’ committee is planning a hearing for Monday, and he wants the information before then.

A Stoddard County man filed a lawsuit this week claiming that the new state system for issuing those violates privacy rights because it allows personal and private information to be collected and then disseminated to a private party and the federal government.

In the suit, Eric Griffin claims he was trying to complete the process of having a concealed carry permit added to his driver's license when he was told digital copies of his documents would be saved in the Department of Revenue's system..........Rest of the story at the link

If this is true it's very scary. Existing law prohibits the federal government from registering guns. Are they registering people who have permits to carry them? How many states besides Missouri are participating?

What is the Department of Homeland Security going to do with a list of CCW holders?
 
I can think of other potential mechanisms thru which Homeland Security could obtain CCW data. My question is why do they need or want it. What do they wish to do with the data?
 
It is against state law in Alabama to release this information to anyone(with few exceptions)"To knowingly publish or release to the public in any form any information or records related to the licensing process, or the current validity of any license, except as authorized in this subsection or in response to a court order or subpoena, is a Class A misdemeanor." Code of Alabama 1975 Section 13a-11-75.
 
The more I hear about some of the stuff DHS pulling and the more "Authority" they are assuming for themselves, the more they are starting to look like the start of Hitler's SS in the 1930's.
 
They need this info so they will know where to send their MRAP's with their soldiers armed with the 6000 weapons they recently accquired, loaded with part of the billion + rounds of ammo they have. DHS will become obamas "army " when he decides to take over.
 
Scary actions by scary people, working under the cover of alleged
Homeland Security makes me think my homeland is not secure from them.
 
This is why I'm a proponent of constitutional carry, you don't end up on some list.
 
I've always been told they didn't have this info, but it is all stored in a database. Sharing this information is relatively trivial. I figured they could have ready access when they wanted it.


Dfsixstring
SR9c
LCP
RST4S
 
...the more they are starting to look like the start of Hitler's SS in the 1930's.

They are looking like a headless SS; these policies perpetuate themselves in the culture of federal law enforcement agencies increasingly militarized since the reaction to the race riots and war protests in the 1960s and growing uncontrolled as a shared mindset.
 
Once the data is stored sharing it is a trivial matter.
Blocking it from being shared if in an easily accessed data base will be unlikely to accomplish a lot unofficially, though it could make using that information officially more difficult.

If something is stored in a database the feds can often gain access to the database during some investigation using subpoenas or warrants on an individual within the database. Once they have access to the database what stops them from taking copying everything they have access to instead of just researching the one individual they are officially dealing with?

You cannt have such databases and prevent them from eventually going to centralized government. The only thing such formalities as placing a hold on formally transfering the data may do is prevent the federal government from using it as legitimately obtained evidence or information in the meantime (though they may still be able to show they obtained it validly in some other investigation etc). So at most they can know they just cannot officially know.



Similarly some chain retail stores keep sales records of customers, including gun stores that make firearm sales. Occasionally agents may access or have access to a database of such records of many thousands of customers during an investigation on an individual. Do you think they stick to only copying the information on that single customer, or maybe just grabbing a copy of the database itself, both copied almost as quickly with modern technology?

We do have legislation in place with FOPA though that makes it a crime to collect or contribute to or maintain information in a database on who owns what guns at the federal level beyond NFA items. So officially they cannot have such things.
 
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That's scary being a citizen of Missouri. I think I may have to write to the gov. and reps about this. Thanks for the information.
 
Database

How about records of firearms serial numbers taken when LEOs are notified in a "shall notify" state such as Alaska?
 
Each time the federal government infringes on constitutional rights with impunity, it gets easier to do.
 
It looks like maybe the guy in Stoddard County who filed suit spoke with a clerical worker at a fee office (an office which contracts with the state to issue license plates and drivers licenses - not a state employee) and proceeded with that information to court. I hope that's all it is. But I'll be glad to see a legislative inquiry into the matter.
How many posts on here have we seen where somebody calls the Sheriff's office and talks to a secretary about ccw permits and then posts about how the Sheriff is against private gun ownership?
 
I live in a place where I have never felt the need to get a CCW... and I'm glad, because I always knew that sort of stuff would end up putting you on some government list.
 
Your probably on a list from being on this website. The posts are public. You don't think the govt is collecting information on everyone? I'm not a conspiracy theorist, but lets face the facts here. They are doing more information gathering than anyone could ever imagine in preparation for EVER having to use it.... Sad that they collect the data before they have a real cause. If you think your speaking out about liberties publicly on the internet and your not some how tracked or part of data collection then think again my friend. FWIW I'm still writing my legislators :D
 
I live in a place where I have never felt the need to get a CCW...
You live behind an impenetrable force field?

I'll bet that doctor in Connecticut felt the same way... when his wife and daughters were still alive...
 
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