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Did I do right

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by kwelz, Feb 11, 2008.

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  1. kwelz

    kwelz Member

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    I have a very close friend, honestly a brother in all but blood, who is going through a hard time right now. He is seperating from his wife and his own parents have turned against him. His kids are being used against him and he is pretty much an emotional wreck. Over the weekend things really blew up and he came close to a full out breakdown. He has confessed to me that on friday he thought about killing himself.

    Last night I was over there with my wife keeping him company. While I was there I took his gun. I took him aside and asked him to give it to me. He handed it over without any argument. But a part of me feels odd about having done this.

    My reasoning was two-fold. First off I don't want him having any more thoughts about hurting himself. While I honestly believe he would not harm himself I also felt this was safer. Secondly this way there is no way his Wife could claim he threatened her with his gun since it is now in my possession.

    Obviously I have no intention of keeping it longer than I have to (even though it is a nice gun) but at the same time I feel off about it. I guess all the talk on here about never giving up our guns, and here I am convincing my friend to hand his over to me.
     
  2. Fisherman_48768

    Fisherman_48768 Member

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    Get your friend in for some emotional/psych help NOW.
     
  3. Rey B

    Rey B Member

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    What Fisherman said. Good on you for being there for him but all you did was remove one method of suicide. Get him some help as well.
     
  4. Ben Shepherd

    Ben Shepherd Member

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    I'd say you did right. Especially since he handed it over easily. Get him someone to talk to like his clergyman maybe even just a close friend. Someone he can just talk to.
     
  5. jlday70

    jlday70 Member

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    Make it Legal have him sign it over to you and give him a reciept so when his X comes back and tries to use the fact that he owns guns against him he can say, nope I gave my guns to so and so, to keep me from having this problem and here is the reciept to prove it.

    Then when it is all over just sign them back over to him. I have heard to many horror stories of an X using gun ownership as a reason to have many more charges brought upon the gun owner. It is safer for him to just take that out of the equation right now and if he wants to go to the range they are right there for him.
     
  6. ColinthePilot

    ColinthePilot Member

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    Good on you, Azizza. You had the cajones to step up and deal with a situation that is almost as difficult for you as it is for your friend (I've been there).Step one accomplished. But like the rest said, get him some help. I mean professional help. Friends and clergy are nice, but they don't have professional training in how to deal with serious problems like this. Try to convince him to go willingly, (that way he'll be able to take his gun back when things smooth over) but priority 1 is keeping him alive and if that means Baker Acting his a$$, do it.
     
  7. ants

    ants Member

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    You did right. Now do what Fisherman suggested. These things are very treatable. Help your bro find treatment.
     
  8. kwelz

    kwelz Member

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    Well my Wife and I have been spending a lot of time with him since he needs help. Ben Shepherd, your advice has more irony than you could ever imagine. His father is also his Pastor.

    We are helping him through it. I just wanted to take away the immediate temptation that was there.
     
  9. Mark whiz

    Mark whiz Member

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    Been there, done that, and brought back the T-Shirt - from the perspective of the one wanting to "off" themselves. Fortunately I stopped before the hammer dropped. :D

    You did right, take away the temptation and have him seek help. Personally, being a preacher myself in those days, I think it might be better for him to seek counsel with someone other than just his father - as sometimes working with a neutral person helps add a different perspective and wisdom.

    Also, speaking from a legal standpoint - it might be better if you pay him $5 for his firearm and give him a bill of sale. That way if the wife tries to take everything he has (which sounds very probable in this situation) he will no longer have possesion of it and at worst will only have to compensate her $2.50 for it in the split. You can always return it after the divorce is settled and you are satisfied that he is sound of judgment again.
     
  10. kungfuhippie

    kungfuhippie Member

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    You did good. Just follow through now.
    "Never give up your guns" IMHO means to gun grabbers.
    Frankly you are holding them for him as a means of helping him.
    He will get them back and was full agreement that you are safeguarding them.

    Don't worry about what you did. Get a receipt and all. Hopefully your friend will get better soon. If I was ever in his shoes I know which friend I'd want to take control of my guns, we've already spoken about this (mostly divorce and restraining order) and have it planned out. In my state it's good to have a plan since an FFL will be required for many of the guns.
     
  11. alsaqr

    alsaqr Member

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    You did good.
     
  12. JohnL2

    JohnL2 Member

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    If someone really wants to end it, they will find a way. What is to say he just won't take a long walk into a lake? Or run some hose from the car exhaust to the window?
    The best thing is that you are there for him. And he has someone to lean on, also an outlet to vent. He is fortunate to have good friends like you to help him get through rough patches like this.
    That is the most important thing.
    He handed his gun over to you in trust because he doesn't trust himself anymore. He TRUSTS you. Don't take that lightly.
     
  13. AirForceShooter

    AirForceShooter Member

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    You done really good.
    Now as has been said get him to a professional at once.
    Every shrink will tell you if somebody talks about killing themselves ..believe them. Don't second guess it or blow it off.
    I hope he gets out of it .

    AFS
     
  14. Rokyudai

    Rokyudai Member

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    Azizza,

    You did alright holding the firearm on his behalf. I agree with Mark in that a non-biased party to counsel him would definitely help. It sounds like he has a good support system in you and your wife but if it has come to the point of suicide ideation whether fleeting or not, it would be in his best interest to consider professional help sooner rather than later.

    I think we have all felt at some point or another that we or someone else would be better off without us being around...that's different from wanting to kill yourself. Some people say things to vent but without knowing a thing about your friend, it is best to take any thoughts of self harm seriously especially if things have taken a sudden turn for the worse in the custody or divorce. I feel for your friend and know it's easy to dispense non-medically certified advice...and I know you are really only asking for some form of validation of your action of taking his firearm...just know it's out of concern for another human being my responses come from. He is a guy in crisis, you are helping him. Sometimes help does not look like help in it's process. A good friend tells you things you want to hear. A better friend tells you the truth.
     
  15. Rich K

    Rich K Member

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    You did the right thing.Now get him to talk with his priest, Rabbi, Minister, or a counselor.
     
  16. the naked prophet

    the naked prophet Member

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    He can't hurt himself with his guns (though there are still knives, cord, electricity, etc.), his soon-to-be-ex can't claim he threatened violence with his guns, and his guns can't be confiscated.

    You did good, for many reasons.

    It's normal to be very upset at this, and what man would not despair at the thought of his children being taken away? It may be normal, but it's not a good thing. Your friend needs some help.
     
  17. MT GUNNY

    MT GUNNY Member

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    bill of sale on firearms so ex cant have them.

    remind him that the law will take his firearm rights away if he does somthing
    stupid

    Remember any conversation regarding getting rid of ex whether joking or not is a violation of law and can be imprisond
     
  18. kwelz

    kwelz Member

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    He has never made any comments or indications that he would ever harm her. In fact he has been going out of his way to stay civil towards her and is just trying to see his kids when he can.
     
  19. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator Staff Member

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    You did the right thing. He will thank you later. Like folks have said, guide him towards help. If he wants it, he will accept it. Good luck.
     
  20. Neo-Luddite

    Neo-Luddite Member

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    You are your Brother's keeper and a true friend. If we're lucky we have one or two in a lifetime that are there for us whether the skies are blue or dark and lowering. Keep it up; well done.
     
  21. doc2rn

    doc2rn Member

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    I know it was not easy, but I have to say you done good. Better to remove the temptation than worry whether he will follow through. On himself or the ex, for that matter.
    I had "he has guns" used against me in court the judge laughed and said "lady this is Ks everybody has a gun." I guess it depends on where you are and the judge.
    What you need to do is 1) get him some help and 2) get the guys together to show him he has friends that nothing has changed. I would not have made it through the death of my first wife if this where not the case. The guys came over every night to do something for a month.

    I still say good lookin out!
     
  22. Bigdtc

    Bigdtc Member

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    I think you excercised goood judgement in you'r decisions. I've been through what he has , it is difficult to "sink in" that you'r soon to be Ex, The parents ,etc. could ever side against you. Sometimes they do. He needs to talk it out with someone. Good he has a friend like you, not everyone does!
     
  23. jcoiii

    jcoiii Member

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    Just an aside- how would this person's having visiting a counselor or such affect his future ownership abilities?
     
  24. ojibweindian

    ojibweindian Member

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    Been there, done that.

    I went through a divorce 8 years ago. Gave my guns to my father and brother for safe-keeping (keep the ex from claiming I'd use one to kill her).
    Anyway, she did try that, and I was able to tell the judge that all my guns were two states away.

    Kept me from being served a restraining order, and also cheesed her off. :D

    Moral of this little anecdote? You did the right thing. And keep being there for him. Divorce sucks. But divorce with kids involved? I wouldn't wish that on anyone.
     
  25. DFW1911

    DFW1911 Member

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    I think you did a great job. As Fisherman said, now is the time to visit either a psychiatrist or psychologist; his primary care physician should be able to make a referral.

    FWIW: people in serious depressive states may not want help, as odd as that sounds, so you might have to take the initiative by setting appointments, getting him to appointments, etc.

    He'll thank you one day for all you've done for him.

    Nice work,
    DFW1911
     
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