Quantcast
  1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Difference between 2 3/4" and 3" shells

Discussion in 'Shotguns' started by Mals9, Jun 4, 2011.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Mals9

    Mals9 Member

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2010
    Messages:
    145
    Location:
    St. Louis
    I have a Mossberg 12 ga that can handle 2 3/4" and 3" shells. I came across a pretty good deal on a NEF Pardner single shot that is set for 3" shells. I was thinking about getting this so my son and wife can shoot trap with me. I would like to only keep on size shell in stock. How much difference in recoil is there between the 2?

    Mals
     
  2. dfariswheel

    dfariswheel Member

    Joined:
    Dec 26, 2002
    Messages:
    6,117
    Significant.

    The 2 3/4" shells are available in many loads from light recoiling dove and quail, to reduced recoil buckshot, to 2 3/4" Magnum loads.
    The 3" shells are all Magnum loads as far as I know, and the heavier load of shot produces much more recoil.
    If you load a light gun like a single shot with 3" shells the recoil is going to just pound them brutally.

    Of course, most any shotgun that is chambered for 3" shells will also shoot 2 3/4" shells too.
    So, all you need to so is buy 2 3/4" shells in lighter loads for the NEF.
     
  3. Mals9

    Mals9 Member

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2010
    Messages:
    145
    Location:
    St. Louis
    I was under the impression that it was not wise to load 2 3/4" into a 3' chamber because of the shoulder being in front of the end of the shell, this would cause a problem with the barrel over time. I am new to this and this is what the shop told me.

    Mals
     
  4. Birdmang

    Birdmang Member

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2009
    Messages:
    1,189
    Not true
     
  5. Zoogster

    Zoogster Member

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2006
    Messages:
    5,073
    No it won't cause problems, it can slightly reduce accuracy in some guns if it leads to pellet deformation or less stability making the small jump.
    The expanding gas also has to fill that larger than bore sized chamber with pressure before channeling the pressure and payload down the barrel, so larger chambers actually make smaller shells slightly weaker by wasting some of the gas pressure in filling that overbore extra space before usefully channeling the pressure down the proper bore size.


    The NEF Pardner single shots are much lighter than your mossberg, and 3" shells from such a light single shot is going to have much greater felt recoil than from your mossberg.
    Anything fired from the single shot is going to recoil more than fired from your mossberg.
     
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2011
  6. jbkebert

    jbkebert Member

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2009
    Messages:
    2,599
    Location:
    Kansas
    You can shoot 2 3/4" shells through a 3" chamber to your hearts content. No problems.
     
  7. Mals9

    Mals9 Member

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2010
    Messages:
    145
    Location:
    St. Louis
    Thanks for the reply's.

    Mals
     
  8. mgkdrgn

    mgkdrgn Member

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2008
    Messages:
    3,914
    Location:
    Lexington, SC
    I had one of those once (NEF single shot). WO a doubt the hardest kicking shotgun I ever owned ... and that was with 2 3/4" shells.
     
  9. jojo200517

    jojo200517 Member

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2009
    Messages:
    580
    Hey Mals9, I think what you were thinking of before is putting 3 inch shells in a gun designed for 2 3/4 inch only. Now that way is a big no no.

    However 3 and even 3 1/2 inch chambered guns can shoot 2 3/4 inch shells safely. There may however be a small loss of "performance" as others have stated.

    You might want to find some shells that are 1 oz or even 7/8 oz loads for the wife to shoot out of the single shot. The lighter the loads will have less recoil. You might even enjoy them yourself.
     
  10. orphanedcowboy

    orphanedcowboy Member

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2009
    Messages:
    309
    Location:
    Fort Worth, Texas
    I handload 2 3/4" steel loads and shoot them in 3" and 3 1/2" clambered guns and pattern test them over a chronograph and there is no degradation in velocity or pattern density doing so.

    I am amazed at the amount of false and unsubstantiated information out there when it comes to patterns, velocity, chamber size, pellet size and bore diameter in relation to shotguns.

    I will agree on one thing, a single shot H&R/NEF shotgun isn't something I would give someone I love especially in 12ga, they do punish you in factory form. I have a buddy who had a 20ga stock cut up for his son to duck hunt with, I watched that poor kid flinch and turn his head everytime he shot it. I took it and had a stock made for it and him, installed a limbsaver, a recoil reduce and now he loves to shoot it, but he's out growing it fast.
     
  11. Onmilo

    Onmilo Member

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2004
    Messages:
    9,773
    Location:
    Illinois`
    I have an H&R Topper 12 guage I use as a barn gun.
    Nobody in their right mind is going to shoot 3" Magnum steel shot field loads for trap shooting unless they are afflicted with a very twisted form of masochism.
    2 3/4" shells will work just fine in the H&R and specifically, 1 ounce or 1 1/8 ounce trap loads are not going to be punishing to shoot, even in the lightweight single shot, even when shot in strings of 100 and a padded trap shooting vest will go a long way to ensuring no bruises.
     
  12. rcmodel

    rcmodel Member in memoriam

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2007
    Messages:
    59,082
    Location:
    Eastern KS
    That is close to the worst possible choice you could make for a beginner to learn trap shooting with.

    As several have mentioned, it is a light weight, evil recoiling shotgun, even with light loads.

    3" Mags would make it brutal, with a resulting flinching habit that will be very difficult for a new shooter to ever get over!

    I'd really suggest you forget the price savings on the NEF Pardner, and start your wife and son out with a good pump or semi-auto that will kick far less.
    And won't make them hate shooting from now on!

    rc
     
  13. hogcowboy

    hogcowboy Member

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2010
    Messages:
    123
    Location:
    Texas
    Or let them shoot the Mossberg and you shoot the NEF if you must have it.
     
  14. threefeathers

    threefeathers Member

    Joined:
    Jun 5, 2003
    Messages:
    1,171
    Location:
    AZ
    For me the difference was a torn retina, think twice about shooting a lot of 3 inch slugs.
     
  15. Zoogster

    Zoogster Member

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2006
    Messages:
    5,073
    orphanedcowboy said:
    There is a slight loss in velocity for a given choke, and barrel length, based on the chamber size. Subtle but there. Certain powders and longer barrel length make it less perceptible.
    It is certainly not significant, but he asked what it does.
    It is simple math, the chamber is wider than the bore, it is typically slightly over .8 inches, while the barrel is .729 (plus or minus based on choke and possible backboring), and the gas has to fill the larger space of the chamber before it builds to the same pressure and starts imparting velocity to the payload at a faster pace in the barrel. The larger the chamber space the more gas it takes to reach the intended pressure.
    It takes more gas to reach the same pressure the wider the tube, and the projectile is not as wide as that chamber so it does not have the added rear surface area for the pressure to act upon.
    So in a 3 1/2 chamber firing a 2 3/4 load it is going to take a little longer to get up to the same pressure because the gas has to fill more unnecessary space. It is like starting with 3/4 of an inch of 9 gauge barrel, then choking it down to 12 gauge.


    The shot also has to jump that gap, and while that does not effect the shot itself in most modern loads starting within a shot cup unless it doesn't stay centered, it certainly can effect shot that is not in a shot cup because it is an abrupt transition in bore diameter after the shot from a 2 3/4 shell has already been traveling for about .75-1 inches in a 3 1/2 chamber. It does not enter the forcing cone until shot not within a shotcup has been allowed to open slightly. This is especially true in many short abrupt factory forcing cones.
    That can increase how much the shot deforms, which would impact the performance.
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2011
  16. gofastman

    gofastman Member

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2010
    Messages:
    1,062
    Location:
    MN
    The Pardner is a crappy gun, that said, its far from "evil recoiling"
    get a decent slip on butt pad and some Winchester WinLite loads, it will work out just fine for a new shooter.
     
  17. rcmodel

    rcmodel Member in memoriam

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2007
    Messages:
    59,082
    Location:
    Eastern KS
    Unless the slip-on pad makes the stock too long for either his son, or his wife.

    A gun that doesn't fit is right up there with a gun that kicks too much when trying to learn to shoot trap.

    rc
     
  18. Onmilo

    Onmilo Member

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2004
    Messages:
    9,773
    Location:
    Illinois`
    If the shooter is that recoil sensative, the stock can be cut down 3/4" and a Limbsaver grind to fit recoil pad can be added.
    H&R produces a dedicated Trap Gun and people really do shoot them at the Trap Ranges & they come standard with 3" chambers.
    http://www.hr1871.com/Firearms/Shotguns/toppertrap.asp
    Honestly, Trap shooters can be as snobbish and baby like as the combat and Cowboy match shooters.
    If you aren't shooting a $5000 Perazzi with all the recoil reducing toys installed so the gun kicks like a .22 then you aren't really interested in the game,,,:(
     
  19. Bernie Lomax

    Bernie Lomax Member

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2010
    Messages:
    167
    What he said. I have a Mossy 590A1. Shooting 2 3/4" high brass shells is almost pleasant with the heavy barrel and good Hogue recoil pad I have on there. However, shooting 3" magnums is like getting punched in both the shoulder and face at the same time.
     
  20. orphanedcowboy

    orphanedcowboy Member

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2009
    Messages:
    309
    Location:
    Fort Worth, Texas
    Zoogster, in theory your premise sounds good, but how would you explain that a Mossberg 935 with a .775" barrel, no forcing cone will shoot the same handloads roughly 50-75fps faster than any of my Benelli, Browning, or any other standard bore gun.

    Again, the chronograph doesn't lie.
     
  21. WaltonS

    WaltonS Member

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2007
    Messages:
    210
    To be completely frank, most 2 3/4 loads are very controllable by a 150lb adult male (me) whereas the 3" hurt like a mother...
     
  22. Jim Watson

    Jim Watson Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2002
    Messages:
    21,966
    I think if you take your wife and son to the trap range with a six pound single shot, you won't have to worry about them asking to go again. Those little suckers kick, and a 25 target round of trap would be unpleasant at best.
    Maybe you could shoot the NEF and Junior the Mossberg.
     
  23. Dave McCracken

    Dave McCracken Moderator In Memoriam

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2002
    Messages:
    13,938
    Location:
    MD.
    My lifetime round count has to be close to or over 100K.

    I'm shooting about 1K rounds per month lately without any strain or pain.

    For a 64 year old arthritic, I do pretty well with shotguns. Back in my 3 gun days, 50 rounds of 00 and 10 of slugs from an 870 was fun. Major fun.

    And I'd rather not shoot a NEF/H&R single shot for trap or any other high volume shooting sport,unless I can add a good pad and cobble up some 3/4 oz reloads.

    In fact, that's what I did with my NEF. It's a loaner for very small new shooters.
     
  24. SeekHer

    SeekHer Member

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2005
    Messages:
    354
    Location:
    Manitoba, Canada
    If you really want that single shot then what about in 20 or 28 instead of 12--eliminates the recoil problem but makes you have two different shells again.

    If you must get a 12 for them--as some ranges will only allow them to be shot--then get at least a O/U or semi auto for more money granted but a lot less recoil...even a cheap Turkish or Russian import O/U would suffice.

    Legacy Sports--Howa imports some very inexpensive but really good quality shotguns under the Escort brand -- their Verona shotguns are rebadged Fausti and carry the same kind of price tag ($2,500+)
     
  25. RugerMcMarlin

    RugerMcMarlin Member

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2011
    Messages:
    979
    one quarter inch
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page