Differences I noticed Between Gen4 G19 and Gen2 G19

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SGT, I just took delivery of a Gen 4 , 19 for my son in law. I took it apart and polished all the parts after he fired it 200 rounds. Nothing at all like your pictures indicated.

Works Flawlessly. On Glock Talk there is guy who took a piece of brass to his face, and once Glock was aware of the issue, they promptly sent him a new pistol.

Sorry you are having this issue, you have remained very professional throughout the ordeal.
 
Tahco,

I'd like to be able to identify the problem so that if others have it they can fix it, if the fix is something that can be fixed at a user level. I'm sure Glock will take care of it if I send the gun back. When I started trying to do this myself, I didn't expect it to take this long. I was thinking I could just get the parts and install them myself and it'd be fine and running the way it should in a week or so, versus having to send it back and waiting the 6-8 weeks. In retrospect that may have been faster, but then again I did request return shipping instruction and labels over a month ago. I don't know how it happened but I seemed to slip through the cracks at Glock several times. Mr. Mathis seems to have sorted the customer service issues out though. They called me the other day trying to get particulars to send me a replacement recoil spring, which had already been replaced, but I appreciate the effort. I called them today too and didn't have any problems getting in touch with them like I had in the past few months. It rang through straight to the guy I was trying to talk to, and I gave him my information for return instructions to be sent, which I received via email within 15 minutes of talking to him. So I have them when I need them. I'd still like to try this HRED extractor plunger before I ship it off though, just to see if it helps.
 
I don't know how relevant it is, but I finally dug out the box the gun came in to check the test fire date. The test fire date is from July 2010, so it's 13 months old not 18 like I figured. It seems I've gotten more done in the last year than I thought I had. Too bad we don't have seasons here, I might have guessed closer. Glock also test fires with CCI Blazer aluminum cased ammo if anyone's interested, or at least that's what mine was test fired with. WWB is a step up for these things.
 
This is a great thread! Thanks for all your time on this. I was in the market for a new IDPA gun. My G19 Gen 3 has over 5k faultless rounds through it but I am looking for a larger size gun. Naturally I started looking at the G34. Now, there is absolutely no way I will be purchasing a Glock! I'll give the xdm 5.5 a try or look elsewhere. Customer service is extremely important to me in the event something goes wrong with the handgun.

Thanks again for all your great efforts and possibly preventing others from a similar fate!
 
Glock seems to have sorted out the customer service issues that caused a good portion of my heartache. They've been proactive lately and I have had no trouble contacting them when I've tried, but it was terrible there for a few months. Time will ultimately be the judge, but I've got no complaints from recent interactions with them. That said I still haven't figured out what's wrong with the pistol, and I'm running out of ideas, so it may become their problem.
 
I got the White Sound Defense HRED extractor plunger assembly yesterday. I installed that today. I also got the Fedex shipping label emailed to me today so that the pistol can be sent back to Glock. The shipping label will expire in the next 14 days so I'm going to try to make it out tomorrow and try the HRED to see if it's changed anything. I also solved the mystery of what has been eating up the stock extractor plunger assembly. I've posted videos of how to install the HRED for anyone interested and videos on the cause of the extractor plunger wear. Link here:

http://s1193.photobucket.com/albums/aa348/SGTDuffman/Glock Fixes/Extractor Plunger Replacement/
 
Thank you for that EDP video, now I know what's causing that wear. It seems that's also the cause of something else I noticed, when I swing the extractor through its range of movement while only the extractor and firing pin safety are installed in the slide, the extractor swings freely. But when the slide is completely assembled and I swing the extractor, I can feel some binding or interference.
 
Well, I got out today and shot the Glock with the new White Sound Defense HRED extractor plunger, with the new Glock extractor and the 0-4-3 recoil spring assembly. I fired 237 rounds today, for a total of 1,025 on the G19. I also fired the Glock 21SF I have to compare it, the 21SF had 100rds of WWB and 40 reloads fired today. The 21 ejects cleanly and to the right every time. The rounds through the Gen 4 G19 were the following:

100rds 115 gr FMJ UMC Value Pack
62rds 115gr Winchester White Box
50rds American Eagle 115gr FMJ
25rds Winchester "Personal Protection" 147gr JHP

No joy. At first I thought it was fixed because the first 3 or 4 magazines out of the 19 ran great, it was spitting brass well clear and all to the right. Nothing over the left shoulder nothing bouncing off the slide or hitting me in the head or face, it was great. Then it was not so great. After those first few mags, it went back to it's old self and started trickling brass and hitting me in the head. So I put the old extractor plunger back in for a couple mags just to make sure I'm not crazy, and thankfully, I'm not. Then the HRED went back in, but there was no change, after a strong showing out of the gate things went back to "normal" and the erratic weak ejections continued. Time to clean and box this thing up and give it back to Glock. I guess I should have tried CCI Blazer at some point, because that's what they're going to shoot, but it's too late now.

http://s1193.photobucket.com/albums/aa348/SGTDuffman/Glock Fixes/HRED/

And no my backstop isn't rocks. That little rocky outcrop basically ends where you see it and there's a massive mound of dirt off either side of it, though I'm sure there are rocks under the dirt somewhere.
 
Hey sgt duffman. I have the same exact problem as you. I have tried lwd extractor and lighter recoil spring with no success in fixing the erratic ejections. I noticed the wear you are experiencing on your extractor depressor plunger. Would you think that the wear on it could be causing friction and preventing extractor movement? I'll try polishing the tip
 
I just noticed that my G23 EDP has the same wear, but it's no where near as bad. Looking at the extractor from that gun, which was made before Glock started using MIM extractors, the "barrel" or rounded portion of the extractor is slightly shorter than that of the newest extractors. It does still have wear on it from the EDP rubbing against it. I haven't tried the non-LCI extractor yet but its "barrel" is also slightly shorter than Glock's MIM extractors.

Comparing my G27 to my G23 last night I noticed two things which may be causing my particular problems. The EDP channel in the slide of my G27 has a tiny lip just far enough into the channel to catch on the EDP spring. Every time I strip that slide, the EDP is just barely hanging onto the spring, so in effect there's more tension being put on the extractor than there should be during ejection. Also, when looking down through the top of the ejection port comparing the ejectors of both guns, the G23 ejector is angled ever so slightly toward the right, toward the ejection port. The ejector of my G27 is angled ever so slightly in the opposite direction, to the left toward the slide stop.

I could get a new ejector, that's easy enough. And if it's not angled properly I could change the angle much like JBarbaresi on Glocktalk has done. But that lip in the EDP channel is a little more complicated, it's located just forward of where the LCI spring loaded bearing attaches to the spring. I plan to try a non-LCI spring loaded bearing when I try the non-LCI extractor and that may keep the spring from catching on that lip. Otherwise I'll just accept the gun as it is or try some method to smooth that lip down. I have a few other ideas to remedy that but I'll just have to work through them one at a time.

Comparing the machining quality of both slides, it's quite obvious that the firing pin channel and EDP channel of the G27 slide were cut with dull cutters. All of the other areas look fine. Both the firing pin channel and EDP channel of my G23 slide are smooth as glass. The firing pin channel of the G27 slide has spiral gaps about half a millimeter deep into the metal, and the EDP channel has that lip just forward of where an LCI spring loaded bearing would sit, plus you can see the spiraling equidistant gaps in its wall when you shine a light through the other end. For anyone wondering, my G23 prefix is GEA and my G27 prefix is NRR.
 
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Deadly,

I thought it might but the HRED extractor plunger assembly doesn't have the wear and it still has the problem. It did start getting worn, but nowhere nearly as much as the factory Glock extractor plunger did. You can barely see it beginning to wear on the White Sound HRED, so little in fact that thus far I haven't bothered trying to photograph it because I doubt the camera will be able to see it. The Glock factor extractor plunger did seem to wear exponentially though. After the first few hundred rounds it wasn't so bad, then the next few hundred made it quite a bit worse, the few hundred after that were with the White Sound HRED extractor, and it got nowhere nearly as worn down as the Glock one after it's few hundred rounds. That leads me to believe the factory Glock part is either a softer metal or alloy, or that is it coated or plated in some manner. Whichever the case, the factory one experienced much more wear over a few hundred rounds than the HRED did. The first several hundred round on the stock piece were also exclusively Winchester White Box, which some consider a soft load, though I'm not one of them.

As of about 2pm PST today my 19 is headed back to Glock. After 1,025 rounds with 3 different extractors, 2 different extractor plungers, and 2 different recoil spring assemblies I was unable to rectify the problem. It occurred regardless of shooter, elevation, ammunition brand, weight, power, or bullet type. We'll see how long Glock has it and what they do to fix it.
 
Just watched Hickok45 work his way through the Glock G19 generations and when he got to Gen 4 the ejection went to hell. (~12:00) I'm starting to wonder if they're supposed to do that. The extraction looks like a popcorn popper.

http://www.youtube.com/user/hickok45

Glock should have my 19 by the end of the day tomorrow.
 
I love my Glocks, but sad to say, it looks like they are going downhill fast. That gen. 4 is turning out to be huge failure and the ambi mag release is junk too. Problem is they didn't test this stuff to failure before they released it. Or they did but didn't care. I'm losing my confidence in them as well, after years of being called a "Glock Guy". All of my older Glocks are great, never had a problem. Until I got an SF frame with an ambi release. I put a post up here just today discussing my ordeal.

I got the problem resolved through Glock rather quickly. I did have to know to ask for them to cover the shipping, because they were more than glad to let me take care of it. If you want matching SN, you have to ask for that too. If you want a different mag release, again, you have to ask for it, because they will also just swap out old junk for new junk. They WILL NOT offer to do anything. It is all on you. But once you tell them what to do, because that is how the phone call really played out, it only took a few weeks to get a new frame back. Not as fast as Smith --I sent them a revolver on Monday and got it back on Friday!

My big beef with them right now is that they are willing to release stuff from R&D directly to production. No test mules, no test to failure, and it would seem with some of it, no testing at all! I'm glad I have my older Glocks, the ones that earned the reputation. I'm still 100% confident in those, just not the ambi release or the gen. 4 stuff.

I too had the phone problems. Don't let them put you on hold once you get past the operator. Make them give you a shipping tag, and make sure you tell them exactly what you want. Chances are you'll get it. They are pretty good about doing the right thing, but they have to be asked or told to do it --they won't offer to do it.
 
I hope you didn't send the pistol back with YOUR parts in it... By your parts I mean the aftermarket stuff. Glock will only return aftermarket sights, not other parts. They'll even change out parts that you polished, they only return stock pistols. I don't know if they will throw them in the box or not, if they do you probably have to instruct them like everything else. If you want matching SN, you better call and tell them that too.

They better fix this or I'm done getting new Glocks. I'll get that 3rd gen. G24 and be done with it.
 
Nope I took everything out and made them pay for shipping. I don't know how it'll work for me to get it back. They better call and ask if it's something I have to pick up from an FFL, because I absolutely will not work with the FFL closest to me. They're the biggest scumbags I've ever met and charge 3 times what any other FFL does. If you don't give them business they won't buzz you out either. The fact you have to be buzzed in and out I guess also indicates something about their business.

I did ship the Glock back with the 0-4-3 recoil spring and the "newer" Glock extractor. I seriously considered not giving those back too after what it took to get them, but I figured it would be best if they had it set up as I'm having problems with. If I sent it back with all the old stuff in it they would probably just change it out to what I already had and send it back. Hopefully by having the newest stuff in it and having it still not working they'll take whatever additional steps are required. The old beat up extractor plunger went back in, because the HRED is aftermarket. If I could, I would have sent it back without sights on it just in case. I also took video of the serial number and me boxing it up with the parts listed below just in case.

I've heard horror stories about people sending guns back, then getting it returned without accessories or parts, etc. That's any manufacturer, not just Glock. I forgot to send them some chewed up brass to see if they could do anything about that. I didn't send them any spare mags either. They got the case it came in, the pistol with Trijicons installed, 1 magazine, and the paperwork they need and that's all they got. I don't know what they're going to do with it, fix it or replace it, and I don't really care.

I do know that if it comes back doing the same thing it will become someone else's target gun. All I want them to do is fix the gun so that it ejects cleanly and consistently, how they do it, I don't care. I'm gonna be super bummed out if it's not fixed. I got a bunch of spare mags and holsters and stuff that all become useless without a G19. It's going to be a massive financial loss. Loss in the value of a substandard pistol, loss in mags, holster, ammo, targets, parts, and time. Probably over a grand down the toilet. I guess I should wait and see how this turns out, then get all bent out of shape if necessary haha.
 
I don't know how it'll work for me to get it back.
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Federal law says you can send the gun directly to Glock for repair, and they can send it directly back to you, no FFL transfer required.
 
They're the biggest scumbags I've ever met and charge 3 times what any other FFL does. If you don't give them business they won't buzz you out either. The fact you have to be buzzed in and out I guess also indicates something about their business.
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Won't buzz you out if you don't buy something? That sounds like kidnapping to me. If they tried that with me they would either get a busted door or a visit from the police. That's nuts.

I agree that from the videos I've seen of Gen4 glocks the ejection is pretty random. All of my Gen 3s (G17, 19 and 26) eject brass neatly 3-6 feet from me to the right depending on the load.
 
Ya, I do not want to deal with those people. I guess they're too busy screwing over people willing to pay $100 over MSRP to buzz you out.

I hope this fixes it. In spite of all this I'm still torn about Gen 3's. Do I just ditch Gen 4 or Glock all together. Gen 3 would allow me to save some of the money I'll otherwise lose in parts and accessories if I ditch all together, but it'd have to be NAx-xxx serial or prior production Gen 3 or I wouldn't touch it. I'm not really sure I want to touch Glock at all after this, but I don't really want to eat the loss either. Other options I guess would be Sig P229 or P250C or Hk P30. With the P229 or P30 being quite a bit more money, and larger and heavier than a 19, or the P250 being very slightly larger/heavier but also basically new and unproven. I guess I'll have to wait and see.
 
I asked them if they could pay to ship it to them and they said no. I guess some people over there are aholes, but whatever. I'll prob end up selling it. Since it was overnighted, you should call soon to check the status. Even though they say 6-8 weeks, if you call, someone might look at it sooner.
 
I was thinking about calling Mr. Mathis again just to let him know that the extractor and recoil spring assembly hadn't fixed the problem and that the pistol had been sent back. For selfish reasons I'd want to get him involved so it would come back sooner but at the same time I'm curious to see how customer service handles it now that he chewed some ass. I do think their return forms are inadequate for stating the problem though. It's all the pertinent contact information, then a short little like 4 or 5 line section you can write in the problems/services you'd like taken care of. It was tricky trying to fit the history and issues in the small space provided, to the point where the problems of damaging brass got left out completely. While I'd rather not that have been the case, I'm more concerned with the ejection issues.

On a side note I also received another 0-4-3 recoil spring assembly in the mail today. The receipt says it was ordered on 7/11/2011 but I didn't talk to Glock that day. It must be from 7/8/11 when I talked to Dan in customer service, which is still a bit odd. They called me on 8/3/11 to get the serial number so they could figure out what part to send me and I told them I didn't need it because Mr. Mathis had already walked the part through. So I guess this is the part I ordered on July 8, that entered their system on July 11, but they couldn't send on August 3 because they didn't have the serial number and I told them I didn't need anymore? Maybe? I don't really know why this part showed up, but it does prove what I've been saying the last few weeks since I talked to Mr. Mathis. Whatever he did seems to have made them quite a bit more proactive and more responsive. I haven't had problems talking to someone over there since I talked to him either. No more of that being on hold for a half hour then getting hung up on business. I might try calling them tomorrow just to see that they've gotten the gun with everything I sent and to let them know about the brass being damaged too.
 
Called Glock today at about 330pm their time and talked to the warranty work people for about 10 minutes and told them about the brass. They said it was normal for the pistol to damage the brass a bit and said a lot of times it will happen on the rim and 3/4 the way down. I told him the damage was to the case mouth not the rim and to please make a note of it for the pistol because I wasn't able to annotate it on the return paperwork when I ran out of space. He said they'd note it and put a message with the pistol. I had no trouble getting in touch with anyone this time either. Whatever was changed over there customer service wise, is working.
 
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Whatever was changed over there customer service wise, is working.
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See, one man can make a difference. ;) I'd be really surprised if they don't take care of you.
 
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