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discrimination at the gun store/show?

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by againstthagrane, Apr 13, 2008.

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  1. againstthagrane

    againstthagrane Member

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    it may just be me, but it seems that 75% of the employees at gun stores i frequent are downright racist. the only one that i've found in the area that isn't is the DFW indoor shooting range.
    granted i'm not your typical gun nut. i'm not white (not to generalize, but lets be realistic) i'm young and most of the time i feel like i know more about the guns being sold than the employees.
    when i was looking for an HK p2000sk after they first came out i went to several gun stores that flat out refused to order me one in the configuration i wanted. most of them gave me BS excuses like "It would be faster if you ordered it straight from them" or "we don't do special orders". the latter was from an old miserable looking guy at bass pro shops. the funny thing is i called in a few days later and the woman i spoke to was more than happy to call her distributor and quote me a special order price.
    the bullettrap in plano has got to be the most blatant about their racism. they will pretty much crap on any gun you mention that isn't made in the US or by dark people in another part of the world like beretta and taurus. lol.
    i just want to know if i'm alone or if anyone else gets the "potential al qaeda look when going to certain gun shops.
    i'm not even going to go to much into the whole gun show aspect of the situation other than saying how i'm not surprised that i've experienced racism in the same place where they sell old photos of blacks being lynched for $15 a pop. you'd have to be a seriously sick individual to hang up a picture of someone getting killed in your house. what's next? holocaust pictures? firing line aftermath photos?
    rant over.:cuss:
     
  2. El Tejon

    El Tejon Member

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    I'm O.K. in Texas gun shoppes, until I open my mouth.:D

    "I say, I say, y'all be talking funny, strange, not like us, I say, I say.":neener:

    No, never experienced it, but those reports from down there just break my heart. One would like to think that the gun culture is united by our love of liberty that would trump all inane, backwards concepts such as ethnic/racial discrimination.:(

    Only one way to fight it and that is to make people understand that it is wrong and not in their best interest to behave this way. Change the culture, change the world.
     
  3. The Lone Haranguer

    The Lone Haranguer Member

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    This is me:

    [​IMG]
    ;)

    But, I've personally encountered, seen, heard of or read of these kinds of bad attitudes before (and not just in gun shops or shows), and plenty of members have their own stories. So I am uncertain how much of this can be directly attributed to racism.
     
  4. againstthagrane

    againstthagrane Member

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    white FLOWER!!! haha
     
  5. Blackbeard

    Blackbeard Member

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    Being a white northerner, I can't really appreciate what that must be like. I can only say that there are plenty of idiots to go around. My only advice would be to make sure your appearance is that of an upstanding citizen. If that doesn't work try a cowboy hat. :D

    I'm completely disgusted that anyone would sell lynching photos in this day and age, even in the south. Someone get these people a calendar.
     
  6. rantingredneck

    rantingredneck Member

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    I was at the Greensboro, NC gunshow a couple months back and was trying to sell one of my handguns. I'd walked around for a couple hours with it on my hip and had had a couple of inquiries. Then a fellow stopped me in one of the aisles asking about it. He was really interested. As we were talking the fellow running the table we had stopped in front of (mind you we'd only been there about 30 - 60 seconds by this point) asked us to move along so we weren't blocking his customers. He was selling turquoise jewelry........at a gun show......but that's beside the point. It was also the way in which he addressed the issue. He wasn't looking at me (the one potentially selling a gun in front of his booth), he was staring straight at my potential buyer and his friend. I got the distinct impression that if the fellow I was talking to had not been black the turquoise vendor would not have acted that way. We walked over to the food court area and completed our transaction. I have to say the fellow who bought my gun reacted well. He just smiled sadly and shook his head.
     
  7. MT GUNNY

    MT GUNNY Member

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    Do you everr ask to see a manager or the owner when stuf like this happens?

    Call prior to going to see if they can order then go in with info you got on the phone to be one step ahead of them.
     
  8. ClickClickD'oh

    ClickClickD'oh Member

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    I'm calling BS on you right now. I have never seen such a thing sold at a gunshow in the D/FW metroplex.

    Did you ever happen to think that the reason Bass Pro wouldn't special order an HK p2000sk for you is because Bass Pro in general does not like dealing with compact pistols? How many other compact pistols have you ever seen at Bass Pro?

    I also happen to know the folks over at the Bullet Trap personally. They may overcharge their range memberships, but they certainly aren't racist people. I've bought Berettas, Glocks and CZs from them so I guess you theory of geographic production racism is all washed up isn't it?

    I think your problem may stem more from your attitude then it does from a latent racist streak in the shooting sports industry.


    PS, Beretta is an Italian company, but most of their pistols are made in the US..
     
  9. rantingredneck

    rantingredneck Member

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    Yep, Lily White. Me too. :lol:
     
  10. papajohn

    papajohn Member

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    I think "Lily White" was the intention there........................(So Am I!)

    I work armed security in the inner city, in an office building that is split about 50/50, in racial terms. Most folks know me as a diehard shooter/guncrank, and we often talk about hunting and self defense, calibers and ballistics. But lately I've noticed that most folks that are asking me gun questions are the non-whites. They want to know where I shoot, club dues, what's a good gun, or a fair price. I won't say they're coming over to the Conservative side, but they know the risks of living in the city, and they are not about to let some gangsta wannabe ruin what they've worked so hard for. Race has nothing to do with it, a punk is a punk, and they hate the criminals as much as anyone else.

    I am quite happy to guide them to good websites (like this one) and good stores, and share anything I can. After all, this is the flock I was hired to protect, and I do that any way I can. It's too bad that so many people see only skin color when making judgements. In my case, the more armed sheep I have in my flock, the easier they are to protect!

    PJ
     
  11. againstthagrane

    againstthagrane Member

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    i can appreciate the advice blackbeard, but i was wearing what i always wear on my free time. jeans and a t-shirt and possibly a baseball cap. having worked in retail i can say from first hand experience that people will surprise you. the guy wearing a t-shirt and shorts is just as likely to drop $5000 in your store as the guy in a pinstripe suit and $300 loafers.
    most of the times i've felt discriminated against i've just decided to forgo (sp.?) the manager and make a statement with where i spend my money.
    the bullet trap for example. i went shopping for my first gun there a couple of times and both times i didn't like what i heard or the looks i received so i chose to never shop there or shoot there. whether they know it or not, they've lost thousands in firearm and range sales.
    i AM a big fan of calling ahead now though. its still pretty funny to hear peoples voices crack a little when i tell them my name over the phone (if i'm putting something on hold, etc.)
     
  12. Just Jim

    Just Jim Member

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    Time to shut this thread down, it isn't the high road. ( I seen a liberal ask for it yesterday so I am asking today.)
     
  13. PPGMD

    PPGMD Member

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    Bingo, people don't go to gun shops or the range in their Sunday best. Because chances are it's going to get grease, lube, or gun powder residue on it.

    I don't notice too much racism here, but they do judge you by your cloths, but they aren't looking for your Sunday best. White or black, if you come into the store having to pull up your pants every two minutes they aren't going to treat you very seriously.
     
  14. DerbyDale

    DerbyDale Member

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    75% is a really high number... I'm not sure if I believe that.

    I have seen people (myself included) treated differently because of the following. None of it I would call racism, it's still wrong, but its just how things are.

    How you were dressed?
    Were you dressed like a hobo who couldn't afford what you were looking at? Sometimes sales people think you are a waist of their time, and they will loose anohter potential sale while "talking" with you. They get allot of lookie-lou's in there who never buy. When I was a kid in school I worked at a Radio Shack. I did get to the point where 80-90% of the time, I could tell who was there to buy, and who was a waist of time. I have also been treated like this recently when I was wearing weekend yard work clothes. Come back a few days later dressed a little nicer, and its a whole new experience.

    Were you dressed like a gang member? Some people are just intimidated by "scary looking" individuals. There was a recent post here of a white guy who got treated poorly in a gun shop, becasue of all his tattoo's and ruff appearance (and he was ruff with a revolver).

    How was your attitude?
    You didn't come into the shop with the attitude of; I'm not a white guy so watch out! I know I don't have time for people like that. Same as with white people with the same attitude. I don't care what color their skin is... I will just ignore them and not give them the time of day. The race card gets old, be it the Black Card, the White Card, or a Brown Card... I'm just tied of it...

    Or the attitude of:
    I know more about this stuff that you DumbA****! I cant tell you the number of people I've seen with know-it-all attitudes at gun shops who try to belittle the people there. Then they get mad and don't understand when they are refused anymore assistance or asked to leave.


    I just don't believe racism is as prevalent as it used to be. If it was, Obama would not be where he is today. I wont vote for him, not because of his color, but because I don't like his views on most things. I guess I'm one of those "bitter small town people".
     
  15. againstthagrane

    againstthagrane Member

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    "'m calling BS on you right now. I have never seen such a thing sold at a gunshow in the D/FW metroplex."

    well if YOU haven't seen it, then it must not be true. i didn't realize we had omniscient members on this board. while i have your ear, what is the meaning of life? btw, they had them at the gun show at will rogers about a month ago. believe it or not...

    "Did you ever happen to think that the reason Bass Pro wouldn't special order an HK p2000sk for you is because Bass Pro in general does not like dealing with compact pistols? How many other compact pistols have you ever seen at Bass Pro?"

    they had compact revolvers and berettas at the time i asked for the special order. why would that matter anyways? they are an HK dealer. why would they just not order compact models? obviously its not an issue for them since the lady was more than willing to do so the second time i requested the order.

    i'm glad you've had good experiences with the bullet trap, but myself and ALL of my shooting buddies refuse to go there anymore because of their nazi-like range policies and holier-than-though attitudes to just about any young person that walks in through the door.

    i meant "brown" foreign countries. darker complexioned people. italians. it wasn't meant to be taken totally literally. i'm not going to explain that any further. beretta may make some of their weapons in america, but i doubt that they make MOST them here. mine cleary says "made in italy" on the side. either way, they're an italian company.

    cz is a czech company and therefore would be acceptable under the bullet trap regime.

    i'm not familiar with the term "lily white", can someone help me out?
     
  16. El Tejon

    El Tejon Member

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    PP, depends on what the clothing says about the man. As a former commissioned gun salesman, I know that the guys in the Carhart jackets or overalls is likely a construction/pipe fitter/ etc. who: 1. has cash in his pocket, 2. wants to buy a gun, so be real nice to him you'll make bonus.:D

    I can make generalizations about other clothing, but that's another thread.:D
     
  17. againstthagrane

    againstthagrane Member

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    i was dressed like a gang member in my diesel jeans and fitted t-shirt. if by gang member you mean trendy yuppie.
     
  18. Just Jim

    Just Jim Member

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    This thread is about racism and has nothing to do with guns. Most people in the USA are not racist so to brand gun people as racist isn't in the intrest of the High Road.

    jj
     
  19. El Tejon

    El Tejon Member

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    Just, I disagree. I think airing of dirty laundry and how to correct it is the essence of The High Road.
     
  20. againstthagrane

    againstthagrane Member

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    I NEVER said that gun enthusiasts are racist. i merely stated that it FEELS like many of the employees at gun shops IN MY AREA THAT I FREQUENT give off the impression of prejudice when they snub me as soon as i walk in, refuse to order things when they absolutely can, help the guy who walked in ten minutes after me when i've been waiting patiently making eye contact with the clerks waiting for my turn.

    you guys need to relax and stop being so defensive.

    woosah
     
  21. fatelk

    fatelk Member

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    The older I get, the more I realize that one's perception of racism is very dependant on your perspective.
    I'm part Native American (though you would never know it- very small percentage), and growing up on the Oregon coast, rather sheltered, from my perspective racism did not exist, except maybe a few nuts in the deep south or northern Idaho. From a scientific perspective, there really is no such thing as race, only physical differences in different people-groups, that really have no more inherent meaning than the color of your eyes.

    That being said, as I get older I realize it's a different world for someone who has grown up seeing the ugly side of racism. They will see racism where I would not. Is this real or just perceived racism? I don't know.

    I have seen very little of what I would consider racism at gun shops or shows myself, but then again this is Oregon, so maybe I'm not even qualified to add to this discussion.:)

    As to the perception of racism, I really do think that more often than not people will react to the way a person talks or dresses, than the color of their skin. I'd like to think that nowadays most people realize that skin color is only skin deep.:)
     
  22. acdodd

    acdodd Member

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    That's good. :evil:


    Some people want to see racism in everything.
    I'm an old white guy and I'm treated the same way.
    You're not special, a lot of gun shops treat everyone like that.
    AC
     
  23. ClickClickD'oh

    ClickClickD'oh Member

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    Hey, seeing as how I'm at almost every gunshow that creeps through the metroplex, you would think I would have run into it by now.

    Has anyone that lives in the metroplex, other than yourself, ever seen these?

    Anyone here?

    I don't think anyone has. I don't think they exist.

    Because Bass Pro doesn't deal in compact firearms. Just like they don't deal in ARs.

    If it keeps me from getting shot, I can deal with strict range policies.

    You really are new to this shooting thing aren't you?

    Next time you are in a gun store ask to see any Beretta pistol. $100 says it has MD as place of manufacture on it.

    Wow..

    Yeah, I'll stick with my original theory.. It's your attitude.
     
  24. againstthagrane

    againstthagrane Member

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    i don't see why people feel the need to shut down a thread just because THEY have not experienced it.

    trust me, even old white guys get discriminated against. whites aren't the only race that have ignorant people among them. there are racists of all colors. unless, you have never come across anyone from another race as you then you have probably experienced it. whether you were cognizant of it is another story.
     
  25. Just Jim

    Just Jim Member

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    The majority of American gun owners are not racist. The proof is all to obviouse yet some people have to drag their feelings of racism here to disparage gun owners.

    Gun owners have fought for all Americans right to keep and bear arms. In no area of the fight have anyone ever used race as a qualifier to gun ownership.

    If your feelings have been offended by someone who doesn't like you and sells guns then it should be between you and that store.

    Please shut down this thread, we are not racist.

    jj
     
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