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DNR to hunters: Hand over your guns on demand

Discussion in 'Legal' started by Audrey, Jan 12, 2009.

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  1. Audrey

    Audrey Member

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    http://www.lakelandtimes.com/main.asp?SectionID=9&SubSectionID=9&ArticleID=8907&TM=37236.69

    The Wisconsin Department of Natural Resources has a simple, blunt message for hunters in Wisconsin: When a DNR warden asks you to give up your legal firearm, do so, plain and simple, no matter what.

    What's more, that goes for all citizens, the agency has asserted. Citizens with firearms, the DNR argues, should always do exactly what law enforcement officers tell them to do, regardless of the circumstances of the situation.

    ...

    Good luck with that!
     
  2. withdrawn34

    withdrawn34 Member.

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    Do they mean in a detainment type situation? If so, I think that is common sense - even if it breaks a law, since the roadside isn't the place to argue the constitution and possibly get shot. File a complaint afterwards.

    Otherwise, if they mean permanently, like random weapons confiscation... then that's another matter.
     
  3. divemedic

    divemedic Member

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    Read the article. I read it as 'confiscate.'
     
  4. Jeff White

    Jeff White Moderator Staff Member

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    Here is the text of the article:

     
  5. Kingcreek

    Kingcreek Member

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    As I read it, both sides may be guilty of turning the issue into some kind of whizzing match.
    I have hunted many times for many years in many states and had more than a couple encounters with DNR LEO types. I try to stay within the laws and I have never had a problem with a CP checking my firearm, permits ,etc. I've always been honest, courteous, and reasonable and every one of them has been the same in return. I got a warning on a boat registration once but the CP let me use his state computer and mobile connection to renew it online while there at the boat ramp. It wouldn't be unusual to find me planting trees or working on my own land while carrying, but I doubt that a CP or deputy sheriff would even comment on it if they happened along.
     
  6. bill in IN

    bill in IN Member

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    I've seen this in many states of late. It seems to be a different tack to gun control. In Indiana Conservation Officers have much more latitude than others. Fortunately this situation hasn't come up with me.
     
  7. akodo

    akodo Member

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    My response.

    The DNR does NOT write laws.

    They have it within their power to strip me of my rights to hunt for looking at them cross-eyed. However beyond that, they cannot seize property without due cause, nor can they make charges stick if all you do is refuse to surrender your weapons.

    You may spend a few nights in the clink for 'disobeying a lawful order' however.

    When you are actively hunting, with an issued license, yes, show them your document. If they want to see your gun, I think you are well within your rights to say 'no, issue me a ticket for hunting with an illegal weapon and I'll see you in court'


    I like this kernal here
    Instructions like

    Police "you don't mind if we look here without a search warrant, do you?"
    Brainwashed Student "Uhh...Sure...I guess..."

    Police "Now tell us every detail of how this happened"
    Brainwashed Student "I...well what happened was..."

    Police "Why did you stop? you weren't thinking about asking for a lawyer, were you? You don't need a lawyer."
    Brainwashed Student "I...I guess not..."
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2009
  8. akodo

    akodo Member

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    until you get the tree hugging hippie who just graduated from college and had to take a job in Po-Dunk-Nowhere enforcing hunting regulations to pad the resume for a later job somewhere 'real' like in Redwood National Forest or other Hippy Cause Natural Reserve Extrodinare location.

    Someone brought up on 'protect the animals' and 'guns are bad' who might be darn anti-hunting in the first place.
     
  9. ServiceSoon

    ServiceSoon Member

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    I would love to hear Jeff's opinion on this matter.
     
  10. ShadyScott999

    ShadyScott999 Member

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    To the best of my knowledge, in SC DNR is THE most powerful LEO. The do NOT have to have a warrant to search your car or home if they reasonably believe you have taken part in gaming violations.
     
  11. franconialocal

    franconialocal Member

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    New Hampshire Law

    I'm only going to address the section I read about "Tell the warden he is trespassing on private property and call 911 to have him removed by the cops"

    I'm sure every state is different, but the way the law reads, outside of a persons "curtilage".....the doctrine of open fields comes into play which is as follows, at least in NH.

    "Courts have held that individuals have no expectation of privacy from police surveillance when they engage in activities on public streets, in public parks, or in areas of buildings open to the public. Moreover, there is no societally recognized expectation of privacy in "open fields" and a person cannot create such an expectation of privacy merely by posting the property with no trespassing signs".

    Sorry....but telling the Warden to go pound sand just isn't going to work. +1 Paul 34.
     
  12. deaconkharma

    deaconkharma Member

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    privacy from view? or no tresppassing

    I'd like to see more context there.That one leaves some questions... privacy is many things such as freedom from "prying eyes" etc. No tresspass means no tresspass. this one sounded more like "just because you are on private property doesn't mean you can't be observed"
     
  13. feedthehogs

    feedthehogs Member

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    Not the same as trespassing.
     
  14. Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow

    Dr. Tad Hussein Winslow member

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    It's real simple:

    Either they HAVE "reasonable suspicion" that a crime was committed, or do not NOT have reasonable suspicion. They do not need probable cause. If they have "reasonable suspicion" and are investigating a possible crime, then sure they have they authority to detain and temporarily confiscate. If there's no reasonable suspicion that a crime was committed, and you had something to do with it, then of course that would be an illegal order (hand over your guns). Why does it take pages of hemming and hawing around the edges without focusing in on that real legal issue? Reasonable suspicion has many many many cases interpreting its meaning under various circumstances.
     
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