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Does it burn your hide when a potential buyer doesn't get back to to you to say...

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by Frandy, May 16, 2006.

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  1. JimC

    JimC Member

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    This just happened to me on a sale of a Beretta O/U shotgun.
    It wasn't the end of the world but some people are just inconsiderate.
    I had photos posted on Shotgun World. The "potential buyer" asks for more photos. I take and send them to him.
    I answer all of his questions in regard to the gun and what he needs to do to have the gun shipped to his FFL.
    Suddenly, it's like the guy skipped town or something. No response to either e-mail or PM on the other board.
    He finally gets back to me with a story about suddenly loosing his job, like over night, and can't buy the gun. :confused:
    If you change your mind, say so, don't BS a seller.
    I always end my correspondence with buyers with, "thanks for looking" or "thanks for asking".
    Politeness in today’s world is almost non-existent and the Internet has made it even more prevalent. :banghead:
     
  2. Goet

    Goet Member

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    I ignored one today.

    I'm selling a car for 3500, almost a thousand under book. Some yahoo offered me 2500 CASH, as if I weren't going to get that anyhow.

    I don't even respond to those kinds of emails.

    BTW, it sold 2 days ago for asking price.
     
  3. YellowLab

    YellowLab member

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    Most e-mails are incomplete and inaccurate as to what the person wants to say. Remember most people have public educations, and grammer and courtesy are not tought or encourged.

    Plus most of the blame goes on the SELLER. If you add a few lines to the e-mail (easy to do, all e-mail clients have custom signature options) that they have X days to respond, or any other info you deem critical that they need to know. You are the seller, you make the rules... just don't forget to let the OTHER person know what they are.
     
  4. Kestrel

    Kestrel Member

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    It's irritating to get an inquiry about something you have for sale and the wording, sentence structure and grammar leave you wondering if this person is an adult or even completely coherent.

    ie:

    "do u still have the gun for sale" (Uh, to what gun are you referring?) When I see "u", instead of "you", it makes me think it's a child that spends all his day on instant messenger. I don't take these very seriously.

    "how much are you selling" (no punctuation, incomplete sentence)

    "i may be interested do you want to trade for a (piece-of-junk-third-world-ar-15-upper) and a half box of handloads" (Uh, no - I'm not completely sure which ad you're referring to, but I'm sure I'm not interested in a beat-up, Eagle Arms/Buick Hubcap upper, without most of the finish left on it, for a NIB $850 pistol...)

    (Them) "do you still have it"
    (Me) "Have what?"
    (Them) "the pistol"
    (Me) "Which pistol? I have three listed."
    (Them) "glock"
    (Me) "Yes. Are you interested?"
    (Them) (crickets chirping....)

    I'm exaggerating a tad, but sometimes, you don't really even know how to respond.
     
  5. Meplat

    Meplat Member

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    I honestly don't know if it's a regional thing that is spreading or what, but I do see it all to often even down here in Dixie. And you are very right. It IS very sad.

    In my upbringing, to fail to say "please" when you asked a favor, "thank you" when it was forthcoming, "Yes (or no) Ma'am" or "Sir" to your elders (or past a certain age, elder or not) was grounds for "the glance" from my Dad on the first offense and was quickly rectified because I knew there was going to be no second glance.

    Lest that seem too old fashioned, I could introduce you to a 23 year old young lady and an 18 year old young man who were raised with those same rules, and who I am extremely proud to say still stick to them even though they have outgrown the threat of anything past the first "glance".

    I do know that the last time I was in Chicago on business, a nice waitress brought me a glass of tea (after warning me in a non-joking manner that I had BETTER not ask for sweet tea after hearing my accent) and I said "Thank you ma'am." She got highly indignant that I had referred to her as "Ma'am" even though we were approximately the same age. I explained to her that where I came from, "Ma'am" was a title of respect, and was treated to the response "If you call me that one more time, I can promise to spit in your food". This was in an upscale restaraunt, not a "Eats" place, and this was no happy repartee. I told her "No problem, Ma'am. I was just heading for the door anyway."

    Like you said, sad.

    But like Hank Williams Jr. sang, "...we say grace, and we say Ma'am, and if you ain't into that we don't give a...."

    <sigh>
     
  6. Art Eatman

    Art Eatman Administrator Staff Member

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    You find the weirdlies at gunshows, as well.

    Example: I've got some gun at $350. Guy comes up, starts dickering. I say, "Okay, $330 and it's yours." He looks at it some more. Looks at me. Stares at the ceiling. Puts the gun down. "That's a pretty good price. I'll get back to you on that."

    And away he goes either already knowing I'm $10 under anybody else in the show, or he'll find that out.

    If it's on Saturday, I'll put the gun away. If he comes back, it's, "No, sorry, some guy came by and gave me $340."

    :D, Art
     
  7. torpid

    torpid Member

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    :uhoh:
     
  8. o/u mike

    o/u mike Member

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    Sellers

    It burns me more when a seller goes silent. Check sent, FFL sent, and no communication for a week as to status? Unless it's a health or personal problem, I don't think this makes the buyer comfortable.
     
  9. gezzer

    gezzer Member

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    It burns me when a buyer puts a 39 cent stamp on the envelope with the MO and FFL and mail it across country and then expects me to know where it is and why I have not contacted them that I have recieved it and shipped the Item.

    Send your payments tracable or at least with a delivery confirmation. It's up to the buyer to get the payment to the seller.
     
  10. af1acura

    af1acura Member

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    I was one of the rude people you speak of until I joined the military and basic training set me right. I like to think I am very courteous now. I remember my first phone call home I called my mom ma'am and my dad sir!
     
  11. CrazyIrishman

    CrazyIrishman Member

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    Until I read this thread I didn't realize that the lack of courtesy was so prevalent with the internet! Regardless of whether I am the buyer or seller I always try to maintain some form of communication.

    I have noticed an increase in prospective buyers not responding to emails after you have answered their questions! Some of ya have already mentiioned this in other posts. Since there isn't any follow-up on their part just how are you supposed to succeed?

    Another thing I noticed is that much of todays youth doesn't have a clue about being courteous! I have noticed this especially with my son in the past few months! He used to be respectful and use "SIR" ,"MA'AM" among others in daily conversation! That, I am afraid, has gone the way of the buffalo!
     
  12. akodo

    akodo Member

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    If someone just asks for info, but never replies back, that is no big deal. Hell, it is helpful if you are busy sorting emails to not have people reply back with 'thanks for the info'.

    I mean, how far do you go? They send you a question, you reply, the send back 'thanks for the info, much apprecaited'. Are you now required to send them the reply 'No problem mate, happy to help'? And are they then required to send you a reply to that?

    Standard ettiquite, to my understanding, is to send a thankyou note for a gift, but not for a card or letter (because if you sent a note just for a note, they would have to send a note, cycle infinitely)

    Now, we are at a totally different topic if the person or you comes to an agreement of some sort (be it price, the pomise to hold it, or whatever)

    However, short of that, a series of questions on a product no matter how long is just that, a series of questions, not a chat with a buddy, and you are not doing THEM a favor by replying, you are doing YOU a favor, because you are trying to sell the item, hence if anyone should be saying 'Thank you' it should be the seller saying 'Thanks for looking at my auction'
     
  13. Wiley

    Wiley Member

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    More than once I have gotten back with a 'seller' to thank them for their time and tell them that I will be buying from someone else and been chewed up one side and down the other for my time and effort to be polite.

    Now, if I don't buy for you, you won't hear from me again.

    Don't like it? Find something that nobody else can provide. Hurt feelings solved.
     
  14. Bill T

    Bill T member

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    "It's today's society. No more do people say "Thanks", or very rarely. They don't acknowledge things except maybe with a grunt. There is no more politeness, etiquette, or even self-pride in many people nowadays."

    Rob has hit the nail right on the head. People today don't give a damn. It's all hurray for me and screw you. I'm not picking on the younger generation either. This exists with a lot of bosses and company owners as well. Many think because they pay you a wage, they own you. This didn't take place 30 years ago. My first ever job was a movie theater usher in 1969 for $1.00 an hour. I can honestly say I was treated better in that lowly position than I am now working in a trade that took over 5 years to learn. It's getting worse most every day. I'm really thankful the wife and I never had any kids. I'd hate like hell to see the workplace in another 30 years, or society in general for that matter. Bill T.
     
  15. bruss01

    bruss01 Member

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    Crowbar -
    Here's a clue - if they're unaccustomed to having a door held, they may think you're comming on to them, or just about to. The "look at the floor" is their body language for "sorry, not interested". In some areas, that may be behavior reserved for suitors, boyfriends or husbands and can be seen as "too personal". The amount of "personal space" and isolation people need to feel comfortable has been going up. I think it has to do with how crowded the world is becomming and how insecure people feel in general, any one of the "strangers" you encounter could be a threat, or a panhandler or (especially for young ladies) a pest or a pervert who only wants to get into her panties. The need for space is intruded on when a perfect stranger chooses to initiate any kind of interaction, however kindly or innocently the gesture may have been offered.

    Akodo-
    I agree with you to a good extent. If I write an inquiry, I usually write a polite note expressing curiosity. There's a difference between interest and "interest with intent". Just because I ask a couple of questions doesn't mean I'm planning to make a purchase if I like the answer! Sometimes people ask questions just to discover their own interest level. Suppose someone's looking for a 30-ish caliber rifle. They ask a few questions about this one, a few questions about that one... mull things over, weigh pro's and con's, recount the piggy bank... etc. Don't put a rifle up for sale if you're averse to answering a few casual questions for parties who may be interested. The interest in getting a rifle may be genuine, but the interest in any particular specimen is sometimes a process of discovery.

    When it comes to e-mail, I prefer direct and to the point. One can be civil while being direct. Try to cover everything in one e-mail so we can avoid the endless back-and-forth. A simple request for information (from someone who's obviously trying to make a sale) shouldn't require a please, but any request should be followed by a "thank you" as a common courtesy. Once the seller has provided information that was requested, they shouldn't expect a further response if the querrent hasn't promised any. They asked for info, you provided it. Now the ball is in the querrent's court if the matter is going any further. He shouldn't expect anything further from the seller,either, such as holding merchandise. Now, if a querrent is asking for anything special like additional photos or information that will take some digging for a seller to come up with, then a "please" is definitely in order. There may be some regional differences, but don't expect the whole country to conform to your standards, when in Rome, do as the Romans. So if "ma'am" is an insult on a par with "hag" where you happen to be, for pete's sake make the adjustment and spare everyone a lot of upset. If you're dealing over the internet, remember that your location is in that other person's living room or place of business, and conduct yourself accordingly.
     
  16. AaronE

    AaronE Member

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    A different viewpoint.

    In my current line of work, I get suddenly and unexpectedly sent places...overseas places usually. Ones that MAY or MAY NOT have internet connections..heck a few havent even had phones except the sat-phone that the Co provides.

    I have over the years inadvertantly left a seller hanging for a time while I was gone. One local one I emailed to tell him that I would meet him on Saturday at the local range. This was on Monday, HE was out of town and I was leaving the message for his return. FF to Friday afternoon at 4:40 PM...I get a call from work while on my way home, that I have tickets to asia waiting at the NW counter at the regional airport...for a 10PM departure. :what: I'm an hour away from home...have to turn around, go back to work and fire up my laptop, call spouse and ask her to get my go-bag out and add specific things to it and start cooking supper while I downloaded the required info and backed up my system on the Co servers. Got home at 6:45, wolfed down supper, checked the gear in the bag, checked the gear in the laptop bag and made sure I had the required adapters, diagnostics and umbilical cords, left for the airport at 7:30 (its an hour+ down depending on traffic) and JUST made check-in for my flight.

    At some point out over the Pacific, at a time my body insisted was about 5 AM, :eek: I remembered that I was supposed to meet the seller at the range....in 3 hours. I wouldnt even be on the ground for a plane change by then. AND I had left his phone number on a printout...on my desk at work. where my wife cannot get into. (badged security area). By the time I could get to where I could figure out how to get online and email him (wireless at a Japanese airport Starbucks between flights) he was already back home after having waited for me there for 2 hours.:banghead:

    He didnt check his email until Sunday and was MOST put out with me, All I could do was apologize. In the rush to get out of the house on SHORT notice, the meeting totally fell out of the back of the buffer.

    He did sell the gun to someone else.

    I shrugged and went on, even tho I had REALLY wanted that particular one..as it was one I had bought NEW and sold in a time of SEVERE financial stress some years prior.

    Aaron
     
  17. Mannlicher

    Mannlicher Member

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    does not bother me at all. I don't see anything about it that should bother anyone. Everyone thinks that they are so darn special these days, and wears their feelings on their sleeve like a child.
     
  18. Meplat

    Meplat Member

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    Here's a clue back - if any young lady thinks that the mere act of holding a door for her in a wide open public setting is an attempt to get into her panties, she has an overinflated evaluation of exactly what the interest in whatever is in her panties poses.

    I personally don't let the door go on ANYONE, male, female, or even one of Hillary's "other genders" (lordy, I do wish those ignoramouses would learn the difference between the definitions of the words "gender" and "sex"). If they see that as a threat, they can take two steps back, inform me, and I'll gladly let the door cave their noses in, if that makes them happy. I go with GENERALLY accepted ettiquite practices...I'll be danged if I am going to try to figure out every individual's personal idiosyncrasies. If they don't want me to hold the door open for them because they percieve me as a threat, then what in blazes' name are they doing walking two steps behind me in the first place?

    Never been to Rome, have no plans to go. NOWHERE in this country is "ma'am" or "sir" considered an insult except in the minds of those who are uncouth and uneducated enough to take them that way. For those who insist on taking offense where CLEARLY none is intended, too bad. I'll not abandon ettiquite to all around me, once again, to sastify the idiosyncrasies of a few insecure individuals. The waitress in question was ready to take offense as soon as she heard my accent, and was not joking about it. Civil discourse aside, a paying customer doesn't deserve to be treated to nasty remarks about what he'd "better" or "better not" order before he even has a chance to place that order. And even then, if it happens to be something that particular restaraunt doesn't serve, he deserves (by dint of being a paying customer and someone from whom the waitress EXPECTS a tip) to be informed of it in a civil manner. If, after hearing my explaination of the term "ma'am" as one of respect she had politely told me that she preferred to not be so addressed, I'd have gladly honored her request. Threatening to spit in my food was not a polite request. It dang sure isn't a polite request in an establishment where the tip alone would have run around $20.00 for a few minutes of her time. I called the woman "ma'am", not "bitch".

    Telling her that "that's okay, ma'am, I was just heading for the door anyway" was in no way out of line. In fact, I thought it was highly civil way to leave what she clearly wanted to turn into a nasty engagement.
     
  19. bruss01

    bruss01 Member

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    Meplat -

    With all due respect... men in our current culture are assumed to be lecherous dogs much more broadly than they are presumed to be chivalrous gentlemen. In a small town where everyone knows each other at least by reputation, even strangers may be given the benefit of the doubt. But most people these days live in busy urban and or suburban areas where a person won't know 99 out 100 people they pass in a day's time. Giving them all the benefit of the doubt would be tempting fate. I agree that's a shame, but it's a sad commentary on our modern life.

    If you don't see why a young lady would think that an unknown male might "hold a door" for her as a ruse to walk behind her to either ogle her behind as she walks or to watch where she goes, follow her, etc. then I don't know what to say. And although I didn't create this situation, nor did you, we all have to live with the reality of it. Also, don't be offended if you get into an elevator alone, then turn and see a young lady running to catch it so you hold the door for her, and suddenly she balks when she realizes she'd be getting into an elevator alone with an unknown male. That's just not good judgement for a woman these days unless she's packing heat. A "courtesy" so offered, might be a ruse for a trap. Don't laugh, it's happened.

    People like to pride themselves on being a good judge of character, yet how many times have we heard of some heinous criminal finally being caught and all of his neighbors and co-workers claim "I can't believe it, he was so nice, so normal... etc." Playing it safe these days means hoping for the best, but expecting the worst from people.

    Any comments from the women on the board? If I'm wrong, please set me straight.
     
  20. flatdog

    flatdog Member

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    A couple of thoughts if I might.

    If the young lady confuses courtesy in a public place with lechery then I would say that she has self image issues. Plus it just seems like an awful lot of work to go through to ogle a woman's posterior.


    This is a totally different situation with a high threat level and it's not a good idea whether or not she is armed. It's her choice to make and most likely a courteous man would understand if she declined his offer.

    Many are rasied to give and show respect to others and require the same in return. I"ll just have to continue being polite and let the chips fall as they may.
     
  21. Meplat

    Meplat Member

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    bruss -

    In all due respect back to you Sir (and that IS a sign of respect, and NOT me calling you and old phart, btw)...

    An entirely false assumption for the most of us that we should nourish and act as if it were true? Not I.

    Okay...given that you give "towns" of three hundred thousand or so "small town" designation. I don't. And I can assure you, that going across town and running into an acquaintance is only slightly more likely than running into one in O'Hare airport (which oddly enough, I have done). IOW, I don't know most of the people and they don't know me. It is doubly so now that I have moved to a REAL small town and only travel to the larger city I used to live in perhaps a couple of times a month. I should mention that I do frequent other metropolitan areas of approximately the same size on about the same level of frequency.

    See above.

    No, it's a paranoic's view of modern life that a man who is holding a door for someone in a well populated public place is any more of a threat than a man who might be shopping the same aisle as someone else is. Want us to check our manhoods at the door? Castration before admission to Dillards?

    "I'm so sorry..err (almost called you "Sir")...you'll have to leave your penis and any risidual testorone in your system at the front desk before you can enter."
    Sheesh.

    If that young (or even not so young) lady is in a public place and thinks that anyone who might want to ogle her NEEDS to hold a door for her in order to do so, then no sir, you indeed do not know what to say. That I can agree with. The same goes for "following her around" etc. No one need hold a door for the sake of being polite to accomplish ANY of these goals.

    I don't have to do any such thing. As I said, if it offends anyone that I am being polite, they can declare themselves, and I can promise you polite will cease immediately.

    That, Sir, is a strawman argument. I never said that I expected a woman - young or otherwise - to place herself in a position that might imperil her in any shape, fashion, or form. It would never cross my mind to be offended should a female not want to ride in an elevator with an unknown man, even if I were that unknown man. Nor would I expect her to make idle chit-chat in a dark alley or an abandoned parking garage. Holding an entrance door to a public place, or saying "ma'am" or "sir" in any setting hardly rises to the level of threat however.

    Heat or not, it's not good judgement, but unfortunately, as I said, a strawman argument. I taught my own daughter the same as you describe above.

    There is no way that "the worst" can arise from a man holding a door for someone at the entrance of a public place, or saying "ma'am" or "sir" as a show of respect. As a matter of fact, I think in the case of my dear sweet waitress - who was obviously a geographic bigot - the use of "ma'am" in the sincere manner I did it was a show of much more respect than she had earned. If calling her "ma'am" again insulted her on my way out of the door, then I really hate that. Could have been a more contemporary "urban" male and called her several other unsavory names, but I was not raised that way.
     
  22. Q-Lock

    Q-Lock Member

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    "Castration before admission to Dillards"

    now there's a scary situation!
     
  23. Meplat

    Meplat Member

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    flatdog posted:

    Sir, that sounds too much like common sense to hold up in today's world.

    Like one must hold a door open out of common courtesy in order to find someone to ogle or follow around. Ridiculous statement, that was. There are, as you noted, far too many posteriors...many more than flagrantly displayed, to ogle than to have to take a minute of your time to hold a door to find one.

    It sounds to me as if some people are suffering SEVERE paranoia...and as someone stated earlier, appearances can be decieving. I'll be hanged if I am going to go through this life being rude and crude to ALL people on the off chance that I might salve some idiot's sense of paranoia for that particular day.
     
  24. bruss01

    bruss01 Member

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    It appears we are talking at cross purposes. I was trying to point out that actions which are interpreted as "rude" by some people in response to an offered "courtesy" might in fact not be due to rudeness but to misinterpretation or apprehension regarding the motivation for the courtesy. It is a Big City attitude that you don't get something for nothing, not even common courtesy (which is becomming all to un-common these days, and I join you in mourning its passing). The recipient holding this mindset is apt to wonder "ok, so what's this going to cost me?" A former room-mate of mine had a flat tire on his way home from work one night. A couple of guys pulled up behind him and helped him change the tire. He was glad of the assistance, and took out his wallet in order to give them a token of his gratitude. They took his wallet, which contained his entire week's pay, and sped off. The courtesy or help offered lulls one into an attitude of trust, and once the vulnerability presents itself, it can be easily exploited. It's a classic set-up, people know this and are less willing to appear thankful or return the courtesy, as that might be showing vulnerability. I've seen this happen, and it doesn't puzzle me that people think and act this way. That's not to say we should stop offering courtesy if so inclined - but rather that we shouldn't be puzzled or offended when it isn't returned.

    As far as 300,000 being a small town - uh, no - the town I grew up in was 800 people the entire time I lived there. Now, 20 years later, they've had a population explosion. They're up to 1,200 now!
     
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