Quantcast

Early Winchester 94’ Should I, can I fix it?

Discussion in 'Gunsmithing and Repairs' started by five.five-six, Jul 10, 2020.

?

Fix it?

  1. Nope just shoot it

    2 vote(s)
    25.0%
  2. Hang it on a wall

    1 vote(s)
    12.5%
  3. Fix it

    4 vote(s)
    50.0%
  4. It’s done, sell it to me for $100

    1 vote(s)
    12.5%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. five.five-six

    five.five-six Member

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2010
    Messages:
    219
    Location:
    PRK anaheim
    I don’t know how common a crack this is but do I fix it or just shoot it or wall hang it?

    It’s stamped WCF and serial number gives it a production date of 1914 so it should be strong enough receiver for modern ammunition but the tang has cracks both sides. Do I grind and fill it with MIG or TIG, grind and cold blue or just shoot it? C00DB3DC-87E7-400E-BC48-9B0ED0C92663.jpeg 93A4C56F-ACC7-411D-ABC8-69987D560FD1.jpeg
     
  2. earlthegoat2

    earlthegoat2 Member

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2008
    Messages:
    7,330
    Location:
    SE GA
    Wow that is one ill fitting stock.

    I would just shoot it.
     
    five.five-six likes this.
  3. edwardware

    edwardware Member

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2010
    Messages:
    2,929
    AFAIK that tang doesn't serve any safety related function. . . so I'd be welding, grinding, and refinishing it.

    But I fix guns for the sheer enjoyment of outsmarting the problem.
     
  4. five.five-six

    five.five-six Member

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2010
    Messages:
    219
    Location:
    PRK anaheim
    I don’t think it came with the gun originally. To be fair, the photo is zoomed in to show a hairline crack. The fit looks great from 10’ away. 80B8FAC8-8246-41BC-B069-3E0A86C9796F.jpeg There is no engraving on the receiver but this is the stock:
     
  5. five.five-six

    five.five-six Member

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2010
    Messages:
    219
    Location:
    PRK anaheim
    I’m leaning toward “shoot n see what happens”.


    I’m all about the project of grind a grove, weld, grind smooth and cold blue but what if I can shoot 5,000 rounds the way it is and it doesn’t get any worse?
     
    magyars4 likes this.
  6. BBBBill

    BBBBill Member

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2005
    Messages:
    2,511
    Location:
    Alabama and Florida
    Unless you are skilled TIG welder and know the correct alloy rod to use for that vintage gun, a home brew weld would probably look like hell. My choice and the choice of many pro smiths for such welding is Pullman arms in Worchester, Mass. They have the skills and knowledge to do it right the first time.
     
    entropy, Cemetery21 and five.five-six like this.
  7. five.five-six

    five.five-six Member

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2010
    Messages:
    219
    Location:
    PRK anaheim
    Shoot it till it breaks or send it in before it breaks?

    They are almost as far from me as you can be without leaving the lower 48. (So cal)
     
  8. BBBBill

    BBBBill Member

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2005
    Messages:
    2,511
    Location:
    Alabama and Florida
    Up to you. If it were mine I would send it first as the material is less deformed now than it will be if it continues to crack. I think it will go along way toward a more dimensionally correct repair. Don't want those threaded holes to get shifted any or they might not align properly for installing the bolts later. I would also try to determine why it cracked. Age/use, material weakness, hammer impacting the back? I don't know, but a Winchester gunsmith or someone on a forum for Winchester lever guns might.
     
    five.five-six likes this.
  9. Catpop

    Catpop Member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2012
    Messages:
    2,206
    Location:
    Jack's Neck, NC
    Man, so sorry about receiver being cracked!!!!!

    That is one Super Fine piece of walnut someone replaced on that receiver. But sorry the stock fit is so bad! Although the steel buttplate fit seems very good?
    Must have been an after market mail order prefinished stock? A Bishop or Fagen maybe? I used to buy My rough high grade blanks from Fagen before they closed in the 90s.
     
    five.five-six likes this.
  10. Jackrabbit1957

    Jackrabbit1957 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 6, 2018
    Messages:
    872
    I bought a basket case 94 about 15 years ago, the upper tang was broken just below the area shown it photos. I welded the pieces back together, filed, sanded and polished it, then browned it. The repair came out really nice and you can't tell it was ever broken. Rifle is a early 1894 with production date somewhere in 1898. Shoots great, seems to be fairly accurate.
     
    five.five-six likes this.
  11. Obturation
    • Contributing Member

    Obturation Contributing Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2018
    Messages:
    2,656
    Location:
    Northern illinois
    I'm not a gunsmith, just thinking out loud (errrr... Well you know what I mean). It seems to me there must be stress on the area that cracked, it isn't going to crack from atmospheric pressure alone. So if you know why it cracked and can prevent stress in the area for future use it should be ok, my guess would be stock fit but of course I don't know. My concern would be further/ worse damage more than safety. I personally don't shoot anything that has an obviously damaged part, regardless of the type of damage. I'd just be flinching every time I pulled the trigger waiting for the wrist to give up and get a face full of gun parts. Might never happen but then again it might, it must have crossed your mind or this thread wouldn't have been started.
    I've gone down the bumpy road of having old guns fixed and in the end it's expensive , slow and leaves lingering doubts in my mind about longevity so they become rarely fired safe queens.
    I'm no winchester guru so there may be a simple reliable fix and its no big deal , someone else would know better than me.
    Good luck
     
    five.five-six likes this.
  12. entropy

    entropy Member

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2004
    Messages:
    11,123
    Location:
    G_d's Country, WI
    If your skill level is up to it, you wouldn't be asking this. I agree with BBBBill:

    I would have suggested Turnbull, but I'm not sure if he does welding.
     
  13. five.five-six

    five.five-six Member

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2010
    Messages:
    219
    Location:
    PRK anaheim
    At this point, I’m actively looking for a qualified person to preform the repairs.
     
  14. five.five-six

    five.five-six Member

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2010
    Messages:
    219
    Location:
    PRK anaheim
    I took some more photos. Now I think the aftermarket stock was cut too small and the tangs were drawn together too far which caused the cracks because I didn't see any cracks on the inside

    I'm actually worse with a camera than a rifle but here's what I came up with


    URERiA.jpg

    ZZDf7W.jpg


    9AG2Au.jpg


    aggOyg.jpg


    QlP0DG.jpg


    tvywhb.jpg


    gwjPbN.jpg


    dpdc9G.jpg


    SdQ2yJ.jpg




    These are of the inside and I don't see any cracks which should start in the corners

    jvB77B.jpg

    5ktdwt.jpg

    YGZqKk.jpg

    9X24fU.jpg

    4xlC83.jpg
     
    magyars4 likes this.
  15. Jackrabbit1957

    Jackrabbit1957 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 6, 2018
    Messages:
    872
    Looks like a small fillet weld on the corners would do the trick, I would do some measurements on the stock and compare the thickness to the gap between the two tangs. I don't believe the steel Winchester used at that time was anything exotic or special so maybe use of a mild steel welding rod would be sufficient. Anyone else have any thoughts on it?
     
  16. Catpop

    Catpop Member

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2012
    Messages:
    2,206
    Location:
    Jack's Neck, NC
    You’re probably correct on steel, but remember the 30 WCF (30-30) was smokeless powder from the get-go! It may have changed along then.
    It will take somebody with more brains than me to tell you!
     
    five.five-six likes this.
  17. Jackrabbit1957

    Jackrabbit1957 Member

    Joined:
    Apr 6, 2018
    Messages:
    872
    Those fractures had nothing to do with smokeless powder, they were caused by the stock being too thin between the upper and lower tangs specifically at the rear. This is why I mentioned measuring the stock and comparing that to the distance between the tangs. Most likely the rear stock bolt was over tightened on a improperly fitted stock. There is no reason I can see not to weld up the cracks clean it up and put the rifle back in service.
     
    five.five-six likes this.
  18. five.five-six

    five.five-six Member

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2010
    Messages:
    219
    Location:
    PRK anaheim
    At this point, after looking at the inside of the tangs. I don’t think it even needs to be welded. It came with a modern set of 30.30 dies that were obviously well used, including a lee factory crimp die. I think it has been shot a lot in the condition it is in. Judging from the patina on the stock, it was probably installed about the time I was born.
     
  19. Rex in OTZ

    Rex in OTZ Member

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2019
    Messages:
    359
    20200716_200140.jpg 20200716_200155.jpg

    That beats my late model crack.
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2020
  20. five.five-six

    five.five-six Member

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2010
    Messages:
    219
    Location:
    PRK anaheim
    ^^^ how did that happen?
     
  21. Rex in OTZ

    Rex in OTZ Member

    Joined:
    Nov 29, 2019
    Messages:
    359
    Tangs cracking?
    If your in America having a saddle horse roll over it, will bust them up.

    Out here in OTZ Alaska, Im betting a snowmobile or basket sled wreck.
    One the towns gun tinkers died.
    His home was full of firearms related parts, pieces, and firearms in varying levels of decreptitude.
    This 30/30 lever ring was hanging on a nail in the corner of his work shop, with what appears to be a thick brass plate riveted in there to hold the works together, no wood for it to be found any place.
    I gave her $100 and thought it might make a winter project putting it together in firing condition.
    This seems to be from 1979 with a cintered metal receiver that was electroplated with iron to better take blueing, most that iron is long gone, and you can see they used JB weld to cover the repair and Black painted the receiver till it was wrecked again.
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2020
  22. SGW Gunsmith

    SGW Gunsmith Member

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2018
    Messages:
    454
    Location:
    Northwestern Wisconsin
    If you were to do anything, I would better fit that very nice hunk of stock more solidly to the receiver than it is now. From what you've posted, the tang damage is short of being cracked completely through, so it should not go any further.
    But at least save that stock from any recoil battering that receiver will deliver without having a good solid mating with the stock. I would recommend using steel bed as the compound. I'd hate to see that nice stock get damaged from ill fit.
     
  23. mnrivrat

    mnrivrat Member

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2002
    Messages:
    5,041
    Location:
    MN
    My guess would be that the gun took a good hard hit on the original stock causing the cracks in the upper tang. Your replacement stock is nice wood but needs to be properly refit . If the gun were mind I would have the tang welded and dressed as well polished and touched up. At the same time I would have the stock properly fit before it gets destroyed by recoil.
     
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice