Everglades Ammunition 115gr 9mm?

[markr6754]

Anyone here have any experience with Everglades Ammunition and their 115gr 9mm Concave Base FMJ bullets?

I saw a good deal (to me) for their 4000 round clearance, and as I have thousands of empty 9mm shells, I thought I'd buy thousands of bullets to become a serious matchmaker.

I'm going purely off the website photos, but the bullets "look" quite nice, and I am only using these for plinking. Now that my son has a new Kahr CM9 we're likely to run through double the ammo I've been burning, as well as what I get my wife to shoot as I test softer loads for her (haven't forgotten that I need to order 147gr to test).

I hope that these are everything I'm looking for...I don't think I can find a true jacketed 9mm for less than (or equal to) $0.06725 per round.

 

[ray15]

They are the best FMJ deal I know of. I have not tried the 115gr., but have used many of the 124gr. version. They are sized a bit smaller in diameter than most (mine measure 0.3545"), but other than requiring a bit more charge I saw no problems with this. Accuracy is very good in my guns.

I also like the in-house RMR FMJs. They aren't quite as cheap as the Everglades Concave Base but it's pretty close.

 

[Jack B.]

They usually get their bullets from established bullet manufacturers. Good company. I have bought may bullets from them . No complaints.

 

[LiveLife]

They are sized a bit smaller in diameter than most (mine measure 0.3545")

As we have discussed in previous threads, there are problems with using smaller than .355" diameter bullets two of which are neck tension and bullet setback. Other problem is accuracy with factory barrels with larger than .356" groove diameter.

I would verify the bullet diameter before placing an order and if sizing is less than .355", I would pass.

I don't think I can find a true jacketed 9mm for less than (or equal to) $0.06725 per round.

RMR recently sold their in-house 115 gr FMJ seconds with 8% off for $64.40/1000 with 4000 quantity purchase - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...ponents-on-sale.707473/page-166#post-10900137

And 124 gr FMJ seconds for $67.16/1000 with 3000 quantity purchase.

Currently 115 gr FMJ is $71.25/1000 ($285/4000 with 5% THR discount).

I am only using these for plinking ... son has a new Kahr CM9 we're likely to run through double the ammo I've been burning

If you are looking for inexpensive yet accurate practice/plinking loads, I am using RMR 115 gr FMJ with 4.0-4.2 gr Promo. Graf & Sons recently sold 8 lbs of Promo for $112 with free HazMat and shipping - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...ponents-on-sale.707473/page-166#post-10908132

4.0-4.2 gr Promo load produces mild recoil from M&P Shield. 3.9-4.0 gr Promo will produce light recoil but check to see if this load will reliably cycle the slide of your pistols. 4.3-4.5 gr Promo will produce recoil comparable to Winchester white box.

as well as what I get my wife to shoot as I test softer loads for her (haven't forgotten that I need to order 147gr to test).

I did comparison test for light to mild recoil and accuracy with 147 gr bullet on this thread - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...est-recoil-in-9mm.837940/page-2#post-10858467

 

[ray15]

As we have discussed in previous threads, there are problems with using smaller than .355" diameter bullets two of which are neck tension and bullet setback. Other problem is accuracy with factory barrels with larger than .356" groove diameter.

All generalness aside, I've tested them and there is no particular problem with neck tension nor accuracy. They are still well within SAAMI specs and function fine. As always one needs be prepared to whip out a smaller case sizing die if neck tension is an issue, but should it be it's rather more likely to be caused by variation in the case wall thickness, as variance there dwarfs the half-thou we are talking about.

 

[Average Joe]

I just bought 2k of them, they shoot very well, whenever they have a sale, I jump on them.....

 

[LiveLife]

more likely to be caused by variation in the case wall thickness

I agree but I took OP's "thousands of empty 9mm shells" to be mixed range brass with variation in case wall thickness.

I have thousands of empty 9mm shells

I guess I could order some and do more "myth busting". You never know, I have been known to be wrong ...

 

[higgite]

I hope that these are everything I'm looking for...I don't think I can find a true jacketed 9mm for less than (or equal to) $0.06725 per round.

RMR recently sold their in-house 115 gr FMJ seconds with 8% off for $64.40/1000 with 4000 quantity purchase - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...ponents-on-sale.707473/page-166#post-10900137

Is that an apples to apples comparison? Are the Everglades bullets seconds like the RMR bullets?

 

[LiveLife]

Is that an apples to apples comparison? Are the Everglades bullets seconds like the RMR bullets?

I was responding to ray15's post that they are sized smaller.

They are sized a bit smaller in diameter than most (mine measure 0.3545")

If Everglades 115 gr FMJ are indeed sized smaller, I would prefer to buy even seconds from RMR as they will be sized at least .355" (they typically run around .3555") and I do not have bullet setback issue when using with mixed range brass - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...he-autoloader-9mm.829171/page-2#post-10695298

The FC/.FC./WIN dummy rounds were loaded from 9mm magazine in Glock 22 with KKM 9mm barrel and slide was released without riding it 3 times. There was no bullet setback measured after chambering the rounds 3 times from the magazine. (FYI, all above RMR RN/FN/JHP rounds with WIN brass were chambered 3 times without bullet setback).

 

[markr6754]

I agree but I took OP's "thousands of empty 9mm shells" to be mixed range brass with variation in case wall thickness.

In a sense, yes, it starts mixed...but 98% of it is my own spent factory ammo. My son and I started saving brass in the 90s knowing that “one day” we would get into reloading. Twenty some years later, and here we are. While I dump all my 9s into containers, they are sorted by once fired, once reloaded, twice reloaded. That’s as far as I’ve gotten. Still have several thousand once fired. After wet tumbling I sort by headstamp into Berry’s 100 round boxes, then prime 400-500. I’m not really anal about it...but I’m getting there. Since I’m still developing a skill, I want to remove as many variables as possible.

 

[ray15]

... I do not have bullet setback issue when using with mixed range brass

And he won't either using the Everglades FMJs.

 

[Hokie_PhD]

Everglades is my second choice in vendors for bullets.
My first choice is RMR as Jake is a member here and offers us a discount. So that gives him the nod.
So I check out his site and Everglades. I calculate the discount and unless Everglades is cheaper I go with RMR.

That said, I've been extremely happy with both and recommend both.
As others have said they seem to offer good bullets at very good prices hence why I've bought from them and will again in the future.

 

[Walkalong]

I have not shot either bullet, but would lean towards the RMR TrFP because of less exposed lead and a nice square base. They have gained a nice rep here as well.

Just blasting? Doesn't really matter, buy the cheapest bullet you can find.

 

[LiveLife]

I guess I could order some and do more "myth busting". You never know, I have been known to be wrong ...

OK, ordered the 115 gr FMJ concave base bullets - http://www.evergladesammo.com/bullets/handgun-bullets/ac-9mm-115gr-fmj-bullets-340.html

Unlike their other 9mm bullets advertised as sized .355", these don't mention sizing and only say "SAAMI Spec 9mm Diameter". Here's 115 gr FMJ with flat base showing .355" sizing - http://www.evergladesammo.com/bullets/handgun-bullets/9mm-115gr-bullets.html

Will post bullet diameter and any measurable setback after bullets arrive.

 

[markr6754]

Everglades is my second choice in vendors for bullets.
My first choice is RMR as Jake is a member here and offers us a discount. So that gives him the nod.

I keep forgetting the THR discount. I was considering RMR until I received an email from Everglades and checked out the bullets I bought. I also prefer a fully jacketed bullet over the concave base, or at least fully plated. The bulk of my plinking rounds have been Berry’s that I got through the Bullets.com going out of business sale. Lucky for me that they closed shop just as I started reloading, so dies, shell holders, powder, primers, bullets, ammo, assorted tools...I really loaded up (pardon the pun).
RMR is on my radar for future purchases, and I’ll try to remember the 5% discount as I make price comparisons. It was the free shipping the sold me on Everglades...plus the shorter distance from Florida to Ohio.

 

[ray15]

Nearly all bullets marketed as 'full metal jacket', including those sold by RMR and Everglades, have exposed bases. There are a few jacketed bullets advertised as 'complete metal jacket' that generally use a disc enclosed by the bottom of the jacket that seals off the lead base. Montana Gold makes such bullets, but they are pricey. One typically needs to go to a jacketed soft point, hollowpoint or plated bullet to get complete enclosure of the base.

With any 9mm bullet and a given case sizing die you are going to get maximum case mouth tension with WIN brass as it has the thickest walls, and we are sizing the outer diameter of the case. I keep a Lee undersize sizing die handy should I desire more case mouth tension for any reason, but did not have to use it with the Everglades, which are only very slightly smaller in diameter than average. Since you have a hoard of brass I'd pick out sizable working population of WIN and use that, but I got good results with thinner types like Blazer also.

RMR also has free shipping, so they are very close in price to Everglades with the THR discount. RMR makes a very fine product, especially for the price. But the Everglades recessed-base FMJs are also a high-quality option, nit-picking aside. I think you will be well pleased with their performance. If you do try the RMR bullets, note they typically measure 0.3555" in diameter, and may require a slight reduction in charge from published FMJ load data just as the Everglades may require a slight increase.

 

[thomas15]

Just blasting? Doesn't really matter, buy the cheapest bullet you can find

Well said.

 

[Dudedog]

RMR MPR JHPs are a good price and no exposed lead at the base. (I had lead issues in the past so a concern for me, don't want to go down that road again, traced to the indoor range where I used to shoot)
The MPR JHPS are a few more $ but can do double duty in case of a Zombie attack.
They shoot very well for me. (if I do my part)

 

[hdwhit]

markr6754 asked:
Anyone here have any experience with Everglades Ammunition and their 115gr 9mm Concave Base FMJ bullets?

Lots of experience with Everglades. First class service. Went WAY out of their way to take care of a shipment that was damaged by the shipper. I'd give them three thumbs up, but then you might think I was a Martian.

No experience with their FMJ bullets, but I have bought a lot of their 9mm Hollow Points at various times over the years and they're 80% of what I load into 9mm rounds.

 

[Walkalong]

Ordered 1K of the RMR Truncated Cone Flat Point Matchwinner.

My "3" button is acting up and I screwed up my address, so I hope it gets shipped to me and not someone down the street. *Sigh* They'll likely catch it though. I emailed them.

Looking forward to trying them in both plinker and full load applications.

 

[ray15]

Ordered 1K of the RMR Truncated Cone Flat Point Matchwinner.

I'm waiting for the tracking to go live on the 2K I ordered last weekend. There's plenty of room for both in my inventory.

 

[LiveLife]

OK, ordered the 115 gr FMJ concave base bullets - http://www.evergladesammo.com/bullets/handgun-bullets/ac-9mm-115gr-fmj-bullets-340.html

Will post bullet diameter and any measurable setback after bullets arrive.

I received the bullets and they are indeed sized smaller than .355". 10 random bullets I measured averaged .354" with some sized slightly larger and some sized slightly smaller. BTW, my calipers were verified with .355" pin gage before measurements were taken.

I also conducted bullet setback tests with bullets loaded to 1.130" and posted the results on "Myth Busting Neck Tension and Bullet Setback" thread - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...nd-bullet-setback.830072/page-4#post-10926900

I am only using these for plinking.

While there was measurable bullet setback with some headstamp brass, these may be OK for low cost plinkers (or you could sort brass by headstamp that did not produce much or no bullet setback). As to sizing of bullets affecting accuracy, that would likely depend on the groove diameter of the barrel and other reloading variables.

Everglades do sell other 115 gr FMJ bullets sized .355". Here's 115 gr FMJ with flat base showing .355" sizing - http://www.evergladesammo.com/bullets/handgun-bullets/9mm-115gr-bullets.html

 

[George P]

They are the best FMJ deal I know of. I have not tried the 115gr., but have used many of the 124gr. version. They are sized a bit smaller in diameter than most (mine measure 0.3545"), but other than requiring a bit more charge I saw no problems with this. Accuracy is very good in my guns.

I also like the in-house RMR FMJs. They aren't quite as cheap as the Everglades Concave Base but it's pretty close.

I am still getting my LNL tweaked, but of the rounds I just loaded with Titegroup and those bullets, performance was very good as was the accuracy. Since I am in FL, I pay sales tax, but their pricing is very good.