Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by Rival, Oct 1, 2022.
Just to play devil's advocate here: A magazine based jam?
Typically related to poor quality magazines or improperly seated mags. Neither should be a problem if you have a tested setup with a fixed magazine.
If the weapon is for you, then you have to determine what you can do well with. If you're capable of receiving a fair amount of training and putting to practice what you learn effectively and you're a fully able-bodied man, then you could practically use a 12 ga. to good effect. Ammo selection will be important, as will the aforementioned training. In the LA area, I highly recommend ITTS -- whether for handgun, carbine (AR/Mini-14), or combat shotgun. Take the classes, and then decide. You can use their rentals, just reserve one ahead of time because I don't know how many they have. Most people take their own guns, but using their rental during a one-day class would be an ideal way to try each with a very practical means to evaluate them for yourself. The best deal would be to take their Weapons Trio class. It's Carbine, Handgun, and Shotgun -- all in one day.
It might not be offered soon since it's not on their calendar. But if you call them and they confirm unavailability, then just sign up for separate shotgun and carbine classes on different weekends. Carbine is weekend of October 22-23, and Shotgun is November 5-6.
In CA if you put a fixed mag over 10 rounds you create a CA "assault weapon"
They're all tricked out to work better than they did when I bought them. My latest acquisition for the 870 is a set of ghost ring sights (Scattergun Technologies) sold by Wilson Combat.
Bottom line is, use what works for you. It might not work for someone else.
When a malfunction occurs with a juggernaut system the bolt carrier is at least part way inside the buffer tube.
This means you can't just crack open the rifle with the rear pin and expect anything meaningful to happen.
I think you missed the part where he said 10rd magazine.
Kills the idea of capacity greater than 10 rounds then.
Unless you go featureless with a standard mag release.
Kinda gives you an idea of how bad/stupid the laws are...
It was a simple question or option the OP hadn't thought of. . While I would definitely pick a 1301 over an AR if in the same boat.
However, I live in a free state so what I choose for HD is not relevant.
What would a "featureless" CA compliant AR look like that would allow a 30 round removable magazine?
Were I in your location, and I wanted a long gun for HD, I would select a 12 gauge pump shotgun over a CA-compliant AR-style rifle.
Loaded with 00 or #4 buckshot, a shotgun is devastatingly effective in the HD mission. With an 18 1/2" barrel and a shortened buttstock, it is reasonably light and handy. With a velco sidesaddle and a 5+1 tube, it carries plenty of ammo. Install a TL Racker forearm for $110, and it has a terrific gun-mounted light, which is essential for the HD role.
Be sure to get good training. Stick to the Mossberg 88/500/590 or Remington 870 models. Pattern different buckshot loads in your specific gun and stick with ammo that best works in your situation. Practice a lot, both dry and at the range with live ammo. Plan on storing it "cruiser ready". Secure your shotgun against unauthorized access using a CA-approved device.
There are threads on THR that explain each of these recommendations.
But I repeat: training is a must!
Once you know how to use it, a quality, properly-loaded shotgun is an effective tool for HD in your environment.
You appear to have some posted with that pic.
It has to do with semi automatic action combined with "features" that would constitute a CA AW.
CA specifically calls out fixed mag semis with over 10 rounds as AWs.
It's dumb and you see non compliance all over the place here.
Any combination of two is the break over point. in my case I configure (only one evil feature):
Grip fin (not a pistol grip)
Muzzle brake (flash hiders are "evil")
Standard Mag release
My two cents, worth what you paid for it.
I like the bullpups because of how compact they are and how quickly I can bring them into the ready position.
That was my failed attempt at humor and not meant as any sort of dig at you. Your posts are always worth a read. California has so many laws and restrictions in different areas I am not even 100% sure whats allowed there anymore.
When people say Home security I tend to think Inside the house. For me thats handgun or Shotgun (kids and wife in the house). Over penetration being an issue. Something like SHTF I would be looking more to Mid Range rifles and carbines.
I tend to tell people to keep a set of hearing protection near their home security firearms. Hopefully someday suppresors will be less of a hassle and your average gun owner can have his/her home protection without damaging their hearing should they ever need to use it.
The advantages (over a shotgun) of a properly configured featureless AR are the same as a regular one.
I disagree. The primary advantage of a shotgun is 9 .32 caliber holes per trigger pull. Shotguns and rifles need the same amount of aiming at indoor distances.
Not to mention the spread isn't as wide as many think it is at fairly close range, about a 4-5" spread at 10 feet up to maybe 9-10" at 20 feet. After that the spread is such that an intruder might be wounded but probably not incapacitated.
If it's choked then the pattern is going to be even tighter over the same distance.
That's another myth. Over penetration will happen with basically all buck shot especially out of a 12 gauge. Even the lightest bird shot load will result in some over penetration but not much out of a 12 gauge, none out of a 20 gauge. The lightest bird shot load will get the job done in close quarters.
There are more than enough YouTube videos that demonstrate this.
Also, it's nice to have nine loads on tap... .
Consider an MP5 30 -- rounds of 9mm in like 3 seconds. My BP12 can deliver 10 rounds of Federal 000 10 pellet buckshot in well under 10 seconds. That is 100 0.36 lead balls compared to 30 124 gr 0.355 9mm rounds. I'm pretty sure I can fire of 10 rounds of 3" 000 buckshot before 90 rounds of 9mm can be fired form an MP5 with two mag changes. Speed is not the only thing of course.
Consider with 3 shot bursts, the MP5 gets 10 bursts per mag, I get 10 10-pellet bursts per 10 round mag with the BP12. The same applies to my Saiga12, which has a 20 round drum, but the handling an ergonomics of the BP12 blows away the Saiga.
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