Finland Troops use AK?!

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Had just scanned the article on SGN, and it shows. I need to go back and read it completely.

Thanks for the information, Igor
 
8balls, then I guess you'd know better about the TAK. I stand corrected.

I've seen IIRC three different optics on the TAK-85s I've had the opportunity with. What are your experiences?
 
Now, what I really want to know, is when will they be surplused out and imported to the US? And where do I sign up to be on the waiting list to get one?

The trigger job they did sounds really interesting, too. IIRC, the article mentioned that they're sold commercially in Finland. Are there any plans to export that type of trigger group to the US? I'd love to give one a try in my M39.
 
Langenator, there was a dealer at the Puyallup WAC show last year had a nice Valmet -- only about 2K.

As an American with a Finnish mother (born and raised in Turku), I had noted with some amusement the confusion over the mid-20th century Finnish history (my grandma Aune and grandpa Toivo made sure when I was little that I knew the history of Talvisota and Jatkosota).

Sisu!
 
Langenator, you might want to post a question on Toiminta-ampujat

That's the In English section of a very decent Finnish forum with the best knowledge there is. They're sponsored by several registered dealers who frequent the discussion too, so you're likely to get direct answers as to availability.

Old dog, respect to Aune and Toivo! :cool: Just like my grandma... he used to tell about the times "when they sleighed downhill on frozen Russians"... :D

My grandpa never made it through the last one. He was "special ops" of the time, a border troops lieutenant in charge of platoon-size "patrols" behind enemy lines. From what I've heard he must've been a bit of a bad @55.
 
Igor-cool, thanks! I hope to be the first kid on my block with a TAK-85!

And Old Dog, if I had $2k to spare, I would have been having some serious discussions with the guy who had the G43 and the M1941 Johnson. And the other guy with the Johnson. Well, there's a lotto drawing tonight...
 
"8balls, then I guess you'd know better about the TAK. I stand corrected.

I've seen IIRC three different optics on the TAK-85s I've had the opportunity with. What are your experiences?"

There are two possible optics:
1: Smith&Bender 4xsomething
The crappier scope, I really did not like that.

2: Zeiss Diavari 6Xsomething:
Better option, it was hard to shoot long distances (600 & over) with S&B, but with it was quite easy with Zeiss. Zeiss was also i perfect working order after 20 something years of service. And i liked the cross hair.

Me, TAK85 & Zeiss Diavari: :rolleyes:
IMG_0719.jpg
 
Wow what a great thread, Simo Hayha is one of my personal hero's. I have been trying to find an M-28 to add to my collection, they dont seem to be that plentiful any more. Thanks for the fascinating info.:D
 
I have great respect for the Finns, but sadly they were in the Soviet 'zone' after WWII ended. There is a term, 'Finlandization' for this.

I used to be a reenactor of the Continuation War back before I joined the Army, so I got to learn a lot of the history. Matterheim wasnt exactly Pro-Hitler, but he did appreciate the help while the rest of the so called free world completely abandoned Finland, which was in real danger of being occupied in 1944. Ryti was more pro-German, and he suffered for this at the show trials given post war. Without Germany, Finland may have suffered the fate of the Baltic states as another Soviet Republic.

EDIT: Whoa crap this is a zombie thread. Heh, didnt notice.
 
I have great respect for the Finns, but sadly they were in the Soviet 'zone' after WWII ended. There is a term, 'Finlandization' for this.
I respectfully disagree. The term Finlandization refers to the political situation of a sovereign nation that has to tiptoe around a powerful and potentially hostile neighbor. This is not the same as the type of domination the Soviets held over Poland, Czechoslovakia, Hungary, East Germany, et al. The relations between Finland and the Soviet Union were established by treaty following the Continuation War, well before the end of WWII. The virtual Soviet annexation of Eastern Europe at the end of WWII did not include Finland, which retained its parliamentary democracy and capitalist economy. However, Finland walked a fine line throughout the Cold War to avoid provoking the Soviets. It has been described as "bowing to the East without mooning the West."
 
Max, you have it exactly about the times in Leningrad... the "vodka tourism" has since moved a bit towards the nowadays free Estonia...
Yeah, I've seen them. These fellows are called Poro (but as usual, low types are noticed, and not in a good way). Every mother wants his son to be tuomari tai juristi, but instead get juomari ja turisti. Just like our low class - being drunk and stupid, care only about the cheap booze. Respectful and normal types doesn't show out that often..

I still like it when 8 ball said, 'carried 20k rounds to my dorm..." If I were a gun, I would marry him.
IIRC law limited the amount of ammo on 20 or so K per apartement.

Finnish army and the will&readiness to defend themselves at all costs against whomever is something we here look up to (we have our problems of motivation and hardware), and are sad that even if we fought and beated both German and Red Army during the independence war, our polichickens-leaders chose to give up without a fight and join the happy family of CCCP (siberi sead situvad reas, as it's known) during the WWII. You know, a lot of people are saying that if we had followed the finnish example we would have kept our freedom.

Oh, it's Häyhä, not Hayha
 
And I know that we have more guns/person than americans. Gunpermits are quite easy to get if you need a gun. For example, im not LEO, though im army reserve (like 83% finnish males). I got my first guns when I was 15. (Silenced CZ kadet .22) Got my ak-103 when I was 16 and now I live on campus. I got silenced glock and plenty of other hardware in my desk drawer. And its all perfectly legal. Just 6 months ago I stored some ammo for school IPSC club and we carried over 20k rounds to my dorm room through local daycare centers play ground. No one said a word.

Yeah Finland and Switzerland would probably be the counties I would most like to live in if I had to leave the US.

High standards of living, low crime, long life expectancies, respect for human rights, and non restrictive firearms laws.

Only thing would be those winters. Burrr.
 
I like all the speculation, but the answer is much simpler. Finland was under Soviet influence during the Cold War even though Soviet troops didn't occupy her like Poland, East Germany, etc. It makes sense they would use the arms most available them them.

Also, Finland never joined NATO, not then or even now. A huge reason to switch to 5.56 rifles is NATO membership (look at Bulgaria for example). Due to Finland's non-NATO status, it makes sense to use Russian arms.
 
I'm not sure I'd want to suggest in person to -any- Finnish veteran of the Winter War that they surrendered. I was fortunate enough to meet (and buy a drink or three for) a friends great-grandfather on his last round of visits before he passed. He was shy his right hand courtesy of a nameless Russian and that day I truly wished we spoke the same language.

If there was ever a people that demonstrated the value of a militia and a well assembled and determined resistance, it's the Finns. Right up there with the Spartans in my book.
 
Having had the opportunity to play around with a Valmet M-62S back in my youth (late80s-early90s), I have to say that the Finnish AKs are far superior to any of the Chinese, Egyptian and Eastern Bloc AKs on the market and, at the time, the only thing that come close were the Isreali made Galils.
 
I think I see in one photo a conscript using an AK-47 or AK-74. Kinda Ironic since Russia really tried to screw up Finland during WW2 when the world was a bit distracted with the Axis powers.

Not as ironic as using improved Mosin-Nagants to fight the Soveits during the Winter War. And not half as Ironic as Haganah using surplus Mausers in 1948.
 
Other thing to keep in mind, as far as Finland and weapons selection goes, is that pre-WW1 Finland was a part of the Russian Empire and so the Moisin-Nagants being in their arsenal made perfect sense. Mannerheim, himself, had been an Imperial Russian officer for most of his career (and a politically well connected one) before the Bolsheviks prompted a career change for him.
 
Ratzinger_p38 he did appreciate the help while the rest of the so called free world completely abandoned Finland, which was in real danger of being occupied in 1944.

True...which is exactly what we did also with the appeasers of Chamberlain's ilk to Czechoslovakia a few years previous (and some of the worlds best arms and arms factorys...Brno and CZ are still some of the best weapons to be found in the world along with their then some of the best armor of the world.) which was one of the most democratic countries and presidents...and west friendly countries of the time. But that is probably better discussed in a separate thread.

toivo: However, Finland walked a fine line throughout the Cold War to avoid provoking the Soviets. It has been described as "bowing to the East without mooning the West."

This just totally made me laugh out loud! :D

buck00 : Also, Finland never joined NATO, not then or even now.

Not so sure that in the long run that the weren't the wisest of us all. :scrutiny:
 
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