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FMJ ammo ban on your range?

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by Professor Gun, Jul 9, 2008.

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  1. Professor Gun

    Professor Gun Member

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    At one of the local shooting clubs I belong to there is a ban on use of FMJ ammunition that has been in place at least 20 years. Few members were aware of this and recently it was suggested that the ban be removed as a way of bringing up to date the bylaws because a large number of members use FMJ ammo without any problems, the rule has not been enforced, and with the growing popularity of Three Gun matches at the club FMJ ammo is used more by competitors.

    The Board of Directors voted to keep the ban because of concern about ricochets by someone shooting at cans on the ground. It is important to note here that it is against the rules to shoot at anything on the ground; shooting must be on targets on approved target stands in front of dirt berms that are about 20 feet high and this rule is enforced. Targets for USPSA and Three Gun matches are placed so that there is a large berm behind them as a bullet stop.

    When advised that keeping the ban would mean canceling Three Gun matches at the club (which bring in revenue), the Board then voted to allow use of FMJ ammo only for USPSA and Three Gun matches.

    Anyone have an opinion on this?
     
  2. divemedic

    divemedic Member

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    Personally, I use frangible practice ammo whenever possible. I know everyone here has heard a bullet or two whizzing overhead before, at least if your ranges are set up anything like mine.
     
  3. justin 561

    justin 561 Member

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    I personally use FMJ mostly because the surplus ammo I buy is FMJ. Seems kind of weird they would not allow you to use it. Do they only allow you to fire frangible practice ammo?
     
  4. Professor Gun

    Professor Gun Member

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    They do not specify frangible ammo. You can use any kind of bullet except FMJ. The range is surrounded by hills and the shooting areas are surrounded by dirt berms approximately 20 feet high.
     
  5. Mr White

    Mr White Member

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    If they don't enforce it, I wouldn't be too concerned about it. It's probably just a CYA thing in case something ever does happen.

    My range requires eye and ear protection but I never wear eye protection. If I ever shoot my eye out kid, they're off the hook because they have the rule in place and posted and I chose to ignore it.
     
  6. kingpin008

    kingpin008 Member

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    If the rule has been in place for 20 years, and it's not enforced, why worry about it?
     
  7. Robusto

    Robusto Member

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    Actually....

    My range will not let you use lead because it's an indoor range and they have somewhat poor ventilation. FMJ is actually encouraged.
     
  8. zxcvbob

    zxcvbob Member

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    At my indoor range, lead (and thin copper plated) is the only thing allowed.
     
  9. orionengnr

    orionengnr Member

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    Several local ranges ban FMJ rifle ammo. They say that ricochets are reduced by the use of soft point or hollow point ammo (given the tiny hollow point or very small soft point, I'm not sure if this is actually true). Neither HP nor SP is as cheap or reaily available as FMJ ammo, so I spend very little time at these ranges.
     
  10. everallm

    everallm Member

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    Since Hollow Point absolutely requires a fluid to expand (EFMJ aside), I fail to see how HP and FMJ ricochets can be any different.
     
  11. Rmart30

    Rmart30 Member

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    if they dont enforce it Id shoot what I wanted to and not worry about it.
     
  12. TexasRifleman

    TexasRifleman Moderator Emeritus

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    Maybe they should create a rule forbidding using garbage as targets, then allow FMJ.

    My range allows FMJ but we don't allow trash as targets.

    Problem solved.
     
  13. Robusto

    Robusto Member

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    What type of back stop do you have

    At my range, it's that shredded tire stuff (not technical... I know), but we can shoot rifles too.
     
  14. makarovnik

    makarovnik Member

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    Is this a joke? Do they have signs posted? I'd do it anyway. I'm calling B.S. on this one.
     
  15. zxcvbob

    zxcvbob Member

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    A big piece of steel armor, angled down towards a sand pit. And heavy rubber "Mud flaps" (they're awfully shot up though) hanging down between the target hangers and the steel backstop.
     
  16. MedWheeler

    MedWheeler Member

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    The local range here (the only one in the county) doesn't have a FMJ ban, but they did recently enact a ban against any ammo not purchased from them. Been real quiet in there since.
     
  17. jaholder1971

    jaholder1971 Member

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    Sounds pretty lame. If the range is having bounceback or riccochet trouble then you've got engineering issues.

    Even SP and JHP ammo will do the same thing.
     
  18. kingpin008

    kingpin008 Member

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    Who told you that? I've seen HP's expand just fine when shot into non-fluid targets.
     
  19. KiltedClaymore

    KiltedClaymore Member

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    agreed. they expand very well in phone books
     
  20. jakemccoy

    jakemccoy Member

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    I've never heard of such, weird.
     
  21. Moonclip

    Moonclip Member

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    My local indoor range does not allow lead non jacketed bullets. I knew of a range that only allowed lead bullets, certain calibers and low power loads due to noise complaints.
     
  22. everallm

    everallm Member

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    Kingpin, Kiltedclaymore, Jakemccoy

    You are confusing Expansion with Deforming.

    Any bullet can, if traveling fast enough, when it hits a solid object deform from it's original shape and will frequently show some flattening or mushrooming on the striking surface.

    HP's are designed specifically to expand in a controlled manner, through hydrostatic pressure. This occurs when the cavity is filled with a fluid, which flesh acts as at high velocity, causing the classic large, even, petalled mushrooming.

    This is why you hear that FMJ's are not regarded as particularly good defensive ammunition as the will usually "through and through" with little to no expansion. They may have slight deformation but they will have not expanded effectively.

    This is also why as part of some ballistic gel testing the targets have denim, leather etc material placed on the striking surface. This is used, amongst other things, to check how effectively HP's expand if the cavity gets plugged, partially or wholly by the material.
     
  23. Flame Red

    Flame Red Member

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    Please don't give the draconian range I belong to any ideas!
     
  24. Phil DeGraves

    Phil DeGraves Member

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    One of the indoor ranges I shoot at will not allow the use of FMJ rounds because it can tear up the somewhat soft steel backstop. On the other hand, another range I shoot at requires TMJ with lead free primers to reduce airborne lead. They both had good reasons and I respect their decisions. I shoot anything I want in my backyard.
     
  25. jjbduke2004

    jjbduke2004 Member

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    The Nassau County (NY) Rifle & Pistol Range in Uniondale has always had a ban on FMJ for rifles, but not pistols. The range is 25 yards indoors. When the range master logs you in, he asks you to list the calibers you're using. If he hears 7.62x39, 5.56, .30-'06, etc. he will ask to see your ammo. If you say .30-30, he will not bother you as he will assume soft point ammo.
     
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