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Forget the Republicans.

Discussion in 'Legal' started by cbsbyte, Jun 14, 2007.

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  1. cbsbyte

    cbsbyte Member

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    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB118177312675434460.html?mod=blogs

    I hate to say it but it looks like the Republican ship has finally sunk. The American people have finally come to their senses, and realized the wrong direction this country has been heading in since 2000. Even Fred Thompson trails Obama in head to head match ups. In a Democrat will win the election in 2008. So write in who you want to win, since it really will not matter in the end.
     
  2. camslam

    camslam Member

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    What is needed is a complete overhaul. It doesn't matter if you are a republican or democrat, I would say there isn't even 10% of congressmen that have our countries best interests as their #1 priority. Most of these bums just want to get re-elected.

    I would love to throw them all out, but since that isn't going to happen, just continue being prepared for the day when people have had enough.
     
  3. Matt King

    Matt King Member

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    Ron Paul. He is what the GOP should really look like. I really hope, albeit a bit unrealistically, that Ron Paul will win the election. How ever his campaign has one major flaw. While he has a wide range of support across the political spectrum, within the GOP his support base is very narrow. While I do think that he could give all of the other candidates a run for their money in a general election, I seriously doubt that he will be able to make it out of the primaries.
     
  4. Phetro

    Phetro Member

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    Mmm hmmm. And the uh, "democrats" are going to make everything all better, just like a fairy tale. Isn't that what you're implying?
     
  5. Frog48

    Frog48 Member

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    The Republican party has been hijacked by the "Neo-Con" and "Christian Conservative" factions. If they're flushed out and the party returns to traditional conservative ideology, I believe the party would regain strength.
     
  6. Mannix

    Mannix Member

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    I disagree. It's still much too early to tell. Thompson hasn't even officially announced his candidacy. Once that happens, I think he has a decent chance to pull ahead of Giuliani, and even the Dems. I'm voting Paul for sure, at least in the primaries, but I could be tempted to vote Thompson if he's on the ballot.
     
  7. Prince Yamato

    Prince Yamato Member

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    Spout the same, "democrats will win" right before the general election, and watch the tide of Republican votes surge.
     
  8. cbsbyte

    cbsbyte Member

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    What I am implying is that this country has always been some where in the middle politically, when it goes to far in one direction the voters swing back the country in the other direction. Now that the Republicans have had there time in office it is now time for the Democrats. The republicans can not rule forever, and it is now time for them to go back to a minority party for some time, at least to the next Reagan which might take awhile.
     
  9. ArmedBear

    ArmedBear Member

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    What about the Democrats' "direction" is better?

    What, exactly, do the Democrats offer us?

    Gun bans as an answer to crime, global warming hysteria, higher taxes without regard to consequences, a Federal takeover of medicine, same pork, government planning as an answer to every imagined problem, Federal control dressed up as "liberty"?

    No, this is not a defense of the GOP.

    For those with an IQ below 75, saying "the Democrats suck!" is not the same as saying "the Republicans are the answer."

    Sadly, many voters DO seem to believe this, and swap sides periodically, believing that the problem is in one party or the other, not in our whole political system.

    But lest anyone think this is an argument for the Libertarian Party, it's not.

    It's actually an argument for a divided government. Get a diverse bunch of self-serving idiots in office, not a monolithic body of self-serving idiots. Those are really our only two choices.

    Those who complain about our political divisions don't realize that a divided DC is the best thing for the average American. God help us when DC gets together and does something "bipartisan". That's the worst.

    True enough. I am concerned, though, about a Federal government dominated by one party across the board, especially when that party's leadership is far from centrist.
     
  10. tcgeol

    tcgeol Member

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    I'm not a fan of "neo-cons", although most people who use this term don't really know what it means, but you apparently really don't understand how many "Christian Conservatives" there are. If your goal is to kill the Republican party, the best way to do it is to kick us out. You don't have to agree with them on every issue, but you better learn to like having a Democrat president and congress if you get rid of us.

    It is just too early to really know what might happen in the election. We aren't even to the point where we know who the top candidates might be, although unfortunately, Duncan Hunter and Tom Tancredo probably won't be among them. For those who say there is no difference between the Democrats and the Republicans running, though, take a look at the field. If you limit yourselves to Giuliani and Romney, you might be right. Every other candidate running, though, is pro-gun, or at least is compared to every Democrat running, excepting possibly Richardson.
     
  11. MrRezister

    MrRezister Member

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    If '06 was as heavily influenced by the public's dissatisfaction with the war as the Dems claim, then the Republicans are sunk regardless. They only have one anti-war candidate to run, and they are burying him as quickly as they can.

    I'm voting with Paul all the way as of right now. I would be interested to see if he could pull off a Lieberman-style attack from offsides.
     
  12. ArmedBear

    ArmedBear Member

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    Dissatisfaction with the war is not monolithic, either. There are...

    1. People who are just plain anti-war, no matter what. It's hard to see Code Pink, or even their far more numerous and more moderate supporters being "satisfied" with a war.
    2. People who want to win the war, and who don't see the current Federal government really trying to win. Note that this WaPo piece was publicized by Michael Savage, who is not anti-war, but, along with many of his callers, is angry with the way we're conducting the war. http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/06/08/AR2007060802405.html
    3. People who are ambivalent, but could be swayed either way depending on what they see/hear about why we're fighting, and how. They don't like what they see/hear.
    4. People who think we should spend the money on more handouts for people in the United States, not on a war. They may or may not fit #1.
    5. Democrats who oppose any major action by Republicans, no matter what it is, war, economic policy, whatever. (Same thing exists on the other side. "No nation building!" in 2000 really meant, "No nation building by the Democrats!" as we soon found out.)
    6. Globalists of many stripes who, while they might support a UN military action, oppose military actions by the US. There are Republicans and Democrats, Libertarians and Greens, marxists and multinational executives in this group.

    Note that a candidate who appealed to #2 and #3 would be most unappealing to #1 and #4. #5 is all about partisanship, and the #5'ers are on one side or another in every election and probably balance each other out. #6 people form alliances with the others. They're the wildcards. One way or another, though, "dissatisfaction with the war" does not necessarily lead to only one kind of vote.

    I think that the 2008 election is not over yet. It'll be a helluva ride between now and then.

    These polls about "if Guiliani ran against Obama, who would you vote for?" at this stage, are just entertainment for the idly curious. The real campaign will start next Spring. It will be interesting.
     
  13. sarge83

    sarge83 Member

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    I am a conservative who has voted mostly republican since I was able to vote nearly 25 yrs. ago. The GOP is headed down the same road as the Democratic party, elitist and arrogant, self-serving politicians to the core, only worried about their next election.

    Many in the GOP say, you have to work within the party to change it, well the RINO's clearly control the party and the conservatives do all the work and pay the bills. In many ways we are like the black vote in the democratic party. For yrs. I would agree, change from within, but after the immigration debacle I don't think it's worth saving. I have many conservative friends, people that voted for Ike and Goldwater who are sitting out the next election and believe that only a good dose of Hillary will get the countries attention. We had to have Jimmy Carter in order to get Reagan.

    We put up with one immigration bill fiasco after another, no child left behind, spending like crack whores, the medicare prescription socialist scheme to buy votes and lastly the latest immigration bill that won't die.

    The current up-yours by the President and the GOP senators and them telling us we are bigots and un-American over the amnesty bill is a "bridge too far". I am voting third party or not at all.
     
  14. BobCav

    BobCav Member

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    IMHO, the Democrats are far too Socialist for my taste and the Republicans are far too Capitalist as well. There's no happy medium or even balance anymore. It's all one extreme or the other and that makes for a BIPOLAR NATIONAL IDENTITY.

    It's as though the Dems are in the pockets of those who would wish greater government control and the Repubs are in the pockets of those who wish for more corporate control and I can't stand for either.

    I'm starting to agree with a friend of mine who used to be on Reagan's staff......

    America is dead.

    I may very well write in "NONE OF THE ABOVE"
     
  15. ArmedBear

    ArmedBear Member

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    That's not ALL the Senators, by a long shot!

    If I have a chance, I'll vote for whoever DIDN'T do that, and against who did.

    Does it make sense to punish Jim DeMint for what John McCain does?

    It works better if you show politicians that they will be rewarded or punished, depending on what they stand for, individually. Doesn't it?
     
  16. jpk1md

    jpk1md Member

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    Personally I have hope for Fred Thompson and his ability to energize voters and the party.

    With the election being so far out and the Dems being pulled more and more to the extreme left by the Moveon.org folks there is still plenty of time for the party to implode....Barack has little substance, Billary has been involved in a host of scandels and her position shifts more frequently than the wind changes direction......

    FT is solid on the core issues that I care about...I think a large number of people will find comfort in the fact that you know where he stands on any given issue while the talking heads waffle back and forth.

    Run Fred Run.
     
  17. cbsbyte

    cbsbyte Member

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    Funny you say that, in the latest polls he is polling way behind Obama. I guess maybe not enough voters know about him or people could careless about him.
     
  18. Chad

    Chad Member

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    If America dies, the cause will certainly be apathy.
    Everything this country is or will be we have allowed to come to pass.
     
  19. ArmedBear

    ArmedBear Member

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    True.

    Furthermore, few of us run for office, volunteer to work on a campaign, are members of a local political party affiliate, etc.

    We just bitch that "they" don't present us with good candidates every few years, and talk about punishing "them" by not voting.

    Now THAT'S bound to work.:rolleyes:
     
  20. MJZZZ

    MJZZZ Member

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    The issue of one party or the other being better doesn't matter. Until our elected officials start basing their votes on what is better for the country instead of what will better line their pockets, our country is in for a bad time. I'm truly ashamed to see the voting records and the lists of pork barrel projects our elected leaders are wasting our taxdollars on. Most politicians see getting elected as a way to enrich their families and donors, and until that stops it will be business as usual for both parties. Mike
     
  21. DomMega

    DomMega Member

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    Its unfortunate but I think the voting in this country is rigged. How the hell did Bush even get into office? He was tied up with Al Gore in the closest race for the White House this country has ever seen. He miraculously won Florida when everyone said he didn't and oh, look, his brother is the governor, how convenient. He's helped little by little to destroy everything this country stands for and the next candidate has a lot of cleaning up to do.

    Ron Paul is the only candidate that makes sense to vote for. It was funny what Bill Mahr said when he had him on his show.

    "You're my new hero. I think anyone that doesn't vote for you has one major problem and thats that they're stupid."

    Haha. I think the reason the Republicans have been having so many problems lately is because the ones that call themselves Republicans are the furthest thing from that. Empty patriots that don't stand for anything except making their wallets fatter. I've listened to both sides and I seriously believe that Ron Paul is the only means we have to reversing what this country and its leaders have done to itself. If we don't get these borders closed up and the benefits the illegals have in coming here, we're pretty much doomed. Ron Paul will take care of that for us among a multitude of other things.

    Again, its real easy to point the finger when we do nothing ourselves to be proactive but instead just blame the politicians for all our whoas. Change can be had but you have to take that first step yourself in trying to attain it. America is dying and we the people need to step up to the plate and start some serious reform. It amazes me that Bush hasn't been impeached yet but thats probably because nobody cares enough to make any noise.
     
  22. XD Fan

    XD Fan Member

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    This has all been done before. The Republicans look all powerful, then they wan and the democrats come to power for a while. It has been happening regularly since Reconstruction and before. The Republicans will be back at some point, and then they will weaken again. The Republican ship is not sunk nor is the Democratic ship.

    Sometimes I think it is the people that are fickle, not the politicians. I do not understand how a person can vote for one guy in an election, and then in the next election vote for someone with exactly the opposite values.
     
  23. RNB65

    RNB65 Member

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    Election is still 17 months away. That's an eternity in Washington. The entire political landscape will be changed by then.
     
  24. Lone_Gunman

    Lone_Gunman Member

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    I think the Christian conservatives have already lost a lot a power to the Neo-Conservatives.

    Of course, the Christian conservatives have not yet realized they have been abandoned by the Republican party, mainly because they have ingrained in their brains that the Democrats are pure evil, and anyone opposing Democrats must therefore be good.

    But the truth is, the Republicans have not done anything for the Christian conservatives except give them lip service since Bush has taken office. Bush campaigned hard about a Constitutional amendment to ban gay marriage, but once he won the election he of course did not make any attempt to do that. He also campaigned hard on limiting abortion, but nothing has happened with that either, except the Partial birth abortion ban that was passed, and then subsequently struck down as unconstitutional by the Republican controlled Supreme Court.

    The Christian conservatives have been abandoned by the Neo-Cons. The only thing that matters to the Neo-Conservative controlled Republican party is spending, corporate profits, and economic world domination brought about by fighting foreign wars.

    Many people are hoping that Fred Thompson will become some type of Conservative savior of the Republican party. Clearly, though, Fred represents the status quo of neo-conservative politics. He supports Campaign Finance Reform, Medicare Reform (ie, free drugs for old people), and the Patriot Act. None of these things falls into the realm of traditional conservatism. They are all part of the the Neo-conservative philosophy.
     
  25. Chad

    Chad Member

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    MJZZZ:
    For some reason I recently read the entire list of all the legislation introduced in the House and Senate this session.

    It's enough to make me cry, or puke, or both...

    Between the socialist garbage, the pork and the nanny/tyrant wishes there was maybe 2% decent legislation.

    Granted most of this doesn't get anywhere, but I couldn't help but think "we elected these people? Why?!"

    Don't for a minute depend on the politicians making it better...that will never happen.
    It's up to us to make it better...even if it does seem like it's too late.
     
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