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"Framing" gun control debates in liberal terms shuts down leftists. Examples inside.

Discussion in 'Activism Discussion and Planning' started by jlbraun, Aug 20, 2007.

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  1. jlbraun

    jlbraun Member

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    "Gun owners are infantile and paranoid."
    Response: "Why are you being intolerant of those that make different life choices than you?"

    "There should be a 5000% tax on ammunition, and pistol permits should cost $5000."
    Response: "Isn't that classist? Only rich people should be able to use guns?"

    "Women shouldn't own guns for self-defense, they'll just get the gun taken away."
    Response: "Isn't that sexist and discriminatory towards women?"

    "Gun owners should have to pass a test in order to own a gun."
    Response: "Isn't that the equivalent to requiring a literacy test in order to vote? Doesn't that disenfranchise minorities?"
     
  2. IA_farmboy

    IA_farmboy Member

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    My response: That is a very prejudicial and ignorant statement.
     
  3. jlbraun

    jlbraun Member

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    Don't use "ignorant". Use "intolerant" or "bigoted". This turns their own language against them.
     
  4. Rainsford

    Rainsford Member

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    Minority = illiterate?

    In this situation does "minority" imply ethnicity, or is it referring to the minority of people who are incapable of completing such a test?
     
  5. IA_farmboy

    IA_farmboy Member

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    Why not use the word "ignorant"? Would "uninformed" be more appropriate?
    What many gun grabbers don't seem to realize is that gun owners come in many shapes, sizes and colors. Calling them all "infantile" certainly shows ignorance of what gun owners are like.

    IMHO, "intolerant" and "bigoted" are just variations on the "prejudicial" theme. I'd just be repeating myself.
     
  6. igor

    igor Member

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    "Bigoted" and "intolerant" are the language of the other side. Using their language to answer gives better bite to the message. It is highly recommendable to do so!
     
  7. iiibdsiil

    iiibdsiil Member

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    Just ask the next one that says guns should be banned if he wants to fight for it :evil:
     
  8. Hawk

    Hawk Member

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    I've found that many U.S. antis will lose enthusiasm for the Australian model when they learn that the turn-in:

    1. Involved compensation to the owners.

    2. Was financed by raiding their Medicare funding.
     
  9. jlbraun

    jlbraun Member

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    @Rainsford

    The original purpose of "literacy tests" was to selectively "test" minority voters with languages they couldn't read. Goes the old saw:

    Do *not* use "ignorant" and "uninformed". Those are words spoken from a position of knowledge and information - ie. the upper class. Instead, you have to use words that emphasize the struggle of the lower class, and castigate them for not being responsive to the struggles of the lower classes, minorities, workers, and oppressed women - so you should use "intolerant" and "bigoted", as well as "anti-progressive", "anti-democratic", and "archaic" - as well as "sexist".
     
  10. velojym

    velojym Member

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    The left is fond of phrasing things to reflect perceived inadequacies in ethnic minorities. They really believe nobody would hire blacks without 'affirmative action' (they must really think black folks are inferior), and that other brown people are incapable of learning english.
    Naturally, they'll claim their opposition is racist... but are we?
     
  11. MattB000

    MattB000 Member

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    I agree we need some things that are more tailored towards each individual argument. It seems as if both sides have formed a series of scripted answers that result in most debates winding up like a game of tic-tac-toe. For what it is worth, here is my two cents...

    This isn't likely to work. It's a set, waiting for them to spike. "I'm intolerant becase of ___(insert favorite anti rehtoric here___)"

    I like this one.

    This one is good as well, however, I've never actually heard anyone say that.

    This definetly needs to be reworded. :eek: I think I can see how you got there (minorities aren't provided with as good of education throught no fault of thier own), but as you can see above, it opens you up to attack.
     
  12. fletcher

    fletcher Member

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    I think this is a play on the same kind of junk liberals complain about whenever some sort of restriction is placed on voting or what have you. No matter what it is, it is somehow "disenfranchising minorities".
     
  13. jlbraun

    jlbraun Member

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    Correct, but a lot of antis think that "they'll just take the gun away from you" is actually a new argument.

    How about just:
     
  14. velojym

    velojym Member

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    It does, but it's one of their own arguments being thrown back in their faces.
    Liberals love to claim that brown people can never catch up to the less-brown. And, the lazier folks who fit the category will keep tossing votes in their direction so long as the checks keep rollin' in.
     
  15. illspirit

    illspirit Member

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    "Only the government should have guns!"
    Response: "So you think Bush should have total power over us? And you probably thought he was bad before.."

    Which they'll probably counter with: "But guns are useless against tanks and stuff!"
    Response: "So you're saying our victory in Iraq is imminent then? After all, the insurgents only have small arms and crude, home-made bombs."
     
  16. S.P.E.C.T.R.E.

    S.P.E.C.T.R.E. Member

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    I really like this tactic. Spouting their PC babble back into their faces has a certain satisfying justice to it. How can they argue with their own type of logic?
     
  17. jlbraun

    jlbraun Member

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    Actually, I'm a liberal Buddhist and sometime registered Democrat who is OK with single-payer preventative healthcare, against the war in Iraq, and am generally a hippie - and gun control really is racist, classist, sexist, and statist when you look at it.
     
  18. mgregg85

    mgregg85 Member

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    I like it when the gun control nuts say that 2A rights only apply to muskets. If thats the case then 1A rights would only apply to old manual printing presses and quill pens. If the government moves to ban modern guns then I feel the internet and modern newspapers/television should go as well.

    "The founding fathers never intended for anyone to be able to own an 'assault rifle' with a 30 round magazine. Their idea of arms was an old flintlock musket"
    Therefore...
    "The founding fathers never intended for anyone to be able to instantly communicate. Their idea of fast communication was Paul Revere looking at lanterns"
     
  19. GlowinPontiac

    GlowinPontiac Member

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    This is one of my favorite responses when talking with an anti. they shut up pretty quick when you talk about banning their blackberry and email.
     
  20. Warren

    Warren Member

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    Anti "gun owners are____"

    Gunnie (loudly) "Wait! did you just say black folk are too stupid to vote!?!?"

    Anti "What!?!? No!!"

    Gunnie "Oh, I know I heard you say something bigoted and hateful, I just could not make out what it was."
     
  21. Crunker1337

    Crunker1337 Member

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    "You don't need guns when you have the police."
    Bullets travel much faster than even the most dedicated police officer.

    "Guns aren't useful for defensive reasons."
    Then why do police officers and soldiers carry them?

    "Guns should always have some kind of safety device."
    If a gun is kept out of access from children, what's the point?

    "You should have to be (enter age here) to buy a gun."
    Age doesn't necessarily equal responsibility.

    "Why do you need a gun?"
    It's a free country; I don't need to justify my life decisions to anyone.

    "Why do you need an assault weapon?"
    It's a free country; I don't need to justify my life decisions to anyone.

    "Guns are way too complicated for normal people to use."
    Illogical. Firearms without added accessories have up to three controls, whereas a car has in excess of 25 controls.

    "Guns are for cops and the military only."
    The Bill of Rights was intended for protection against such corruptible groups.
     
  22. Mot45acp

    Mot45acp Member

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    "There should be a 5000% tax on ammunition, and pistol permits should cost $5000."
    Response: "Isn't that classist? Only rich people should be able to use guns?"

    Add "I thought you were for the little man/average Joe"
     
  23. Zundfolge

    Zundfolge Member

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    anti's respons: Oh I AM for the little man/average Joe ... anything to keep these evil death machines out of his home will save the life of Joe, his wife (because we all know one night he's gonna come home too drunk, start smacking her around and just shoot her instead) and his children (who are able to activate firearms just by giggling ... we all know guns WANT to kill children).
     
  24. Blackbeard

    Blackbeard Member

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    "You don't need guns when you have the police."
    There aren't any cops in Blacksburg, Virginia?

    "Do you really need an assault weapon?"
    Not yet.

    "Guns are way too complicated for normal people to use."
    Point, squeeze, bang. Pretty simple.
     
  25. DiN_BLiX

    DiN_BLiX Member

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    Which makes you... MORE DEADLY THAN ANYTHING IN MY COLLECTION! lol

    p.s. your not a liberal, youre a slighty confused libertarian.
     
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