Friend pulled a gun yesterday

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Legally, he might be in some trouble

Morally, I agree with what he did, though. You have a right to defend yourself and your loved ones.
 
when he pulled the gun on the guy, did he have the sense to stop?

And, I know this is a horrible thing to say, but there have been a lot of really in-your-face kind of women show up this past decade. I have never touched a woman in defense, but it seems like they really want you to.

Either I'm seeing more or society is getting really bad, when even the women folk are picking fights.
 
"lot of you people are forgetting that he PUSHED a woman down"

Warrants an ass-whooping, not a bullet.
You ex-marine friend is coming off as sort of a pansy.

So tying up with a man twice his size and potentially being severely hurt/killed would solve his problem eh?:rolleyes:

Pepper spray would have been the best answer here. Of course that doesnt do him any good now. Tell him to lawyer up, and try to have the charges reduced.
 
You won't be able to judge the situation and progressively alter the level of force you feel is necessary.

Yep, that's why it's my judgement call. If I thought the engagement could end like that *at all* I would draw. If I didn't think I was gonna get hurt and let him come at me and then he kills me, well, that's a bad judgement call on my part. Sucks that it has to be that way. Oh, BTW, I agree with defending loved ones and "damn the torpedoes" I will draw if someone pushes my girl to the ground. Legally though, your buddy will have a battle on his hands.
 
Yeesh.

I don't know what I would have done. Assuming the facts presented with me are correct and with knowledge that one punch could potentially kill me or at least cause permanent damage, I would have drawn. Definitely would have hosed the guy with OC after telling him 3 times to stop his advance.

My roommate works for a company that works with people who are mostly disabled because of a physical attack they have endured in their past. Serious bodily injury is a requisite here, but having to prove it against a man armed with only his fists, well that's the problem. What if a juror believes him to be a "pansy" as one man here says? A good lawyer could argue it I believe.
 
Just a WEE bit of overstatement, there.

Yeah, Yeman recently introduced a series of reforms so I probably shouldn't have compared them with the Texicans.

Honestly, if I was looking at a serious felony down there I'd probably put my own lights out while I still had the chance. They dish out a lot of very hard time in that state. To me, death would be better than years in a Texas hole, though obviously that's a personal choice you have to make yourself.
 
What are you talking about? It's illegal to possess a firearm in Texas now?

The guy does not have a permit to carry concealed. Open carry in Texas is illegal. He was on a dock in a public place.

That means for him to have the handgun readily available is questionable. If he was carrying it concealed on his person on public property then yes that is against the law.

He pulled out an illegaly carried and concealed handgun on someone that was not armed in a public place. I say at the bare minimum he will end up with weapon charges.
If he is unlucky he will also end up as a violent felon for assault with a deadly weapon.

Whether I agree with that or not does not change the fact that the law is against him.
 
But possession isn't illegal. And I don't think we know where he pulled it from. Beyond that, there's nothing said about a weapon's charge. I don't know why people keep speculating about it. If he's facing A w/ DW a theoretical weapons charge is the least of his problems.
 
I'm imagining the big, angry guy walking toward the marine to give him a piece of his mind. The girlfriend defiantly stands in his way trying to "protect" the marine. The big guy steps left, the girl steps left, he steps right, she steps right, he then grabs her shoulder and "moves" the fiesty girl out of the way because she's pissing him off.

Marine pulls a gun, and the rest is history.

The bigguy didn't necessarily "assault" the girl IMO. I doubt she was just standing there calmly and he runs up and clotheslines her out of the blue. She was attempting to prevent a big angry man from walking where he wanted to walk, and got pushed down. I'd be super pissed if I saw someone push my girlfriend, that's for sure, but she got herself involved in an obvious potential confrontation by being a front-line defender, so she ended up taking a seat.

I think the marine is gonna get charged with probably a lesser offense, but I don't think he was justified. Sucks, but in the case that angry guy is coming toward him and marineguy feels THAT threatened, he should have jumped in the truck and locked the door. The girlfriend could then come over and hopefully get in the truck also. If angryguy grabbed her and tried to prevent her from getting in, then I guess that would be the time to pull the gun.
 
Okay, I missed something somewhere along the way. I thought he was carrying on his person. My apology for the errant statement. He had the firearm in his vehicle, which in Texas, yes is legal. At least the last time I hunted there is was legal, and per a PM I just received, it has been clarified for me, it remains legal.

So, your friend tried to retreat, tried to defuse the situation. The true perp attacked the woman, and threatened him. He finally drew after the guy came at him to attack. I don't see the criminal action here on your friend's part...he defended himself and his lady friend. I would have done precisely the same.
 
The bigguy didn't necessarily "assault" the girl IMO. I doubt she was just standing there calmly and he runs up and clotheslines her out of the blue. She was attempting to prevent a big angry man from walking where he wanted to walk, and got pushed down. I'd be super pissed if I saw someone push my girlfriend, that's for sure, but she got herself involved in an obvious potential confrontation by being a front-line defender, so she ended up taking a seat

Then walk around her, stud. Putting hands on someone who is "in your way" is wrong.
 
I think there is a lot of speculation going on about what is a hearsay account. Small details of facts can make a big difference in evaluating the situation. I'd like to wait and get an official account and some specific charges.

Please keep us updated.

K
 
IANAL, but my $.02: If this comes to court, he & his lawyer might not want a version of the story from the girlfriend online. Just something to think about...
 
Then walk around her, stud. Putting hands on someone who is "in your way" is wrong.

LOL I'm not saying *I* would have grabbed her, I'm just saying that's what happened. She tried to prevent a big angry guy from walking where he wanted to walk, and he didn't like it. Maybe he did try and walk around her, who knows. It wouldn't be hard to keep stepping in front of someone and blocking their path - eventually I would think they would get mad at me and push me out of the way.

I wonder what you can legally do there, anyway. If you're walking down the sidewalk and aren't being angryguy, and someone steps in front of you to keep you from walking further, what are you allowed to do? You're not being assaulted, necessarily, but he is preventing you from going where you want to go. You try and cross the street to continue, but he'll only allow you to move laterally, and simply won't let you down the street. Are you allowed to push your way past him? What if he falls on his butt?
 
There are way to many unknown variables in this story to make any real observations without speculating wildly...

There was an assault initially on a woman, there was obvious disparity of force...that works for him

(Note: to those that say simply pushing a woman (or anyone for that matter) isn't deadly force, I am sure there are multiple perpetrators in our prisons right now who thought the same thing when they pushed their GF/Wife in anger and oops, they hit their head, they broke an arm, etc.)

The perpetrator/victim chased them down...that definitely works in his case as well.

Not really sure why everyone keeps saying he should have used OC, wouldn't that be construed as escalation, if it was truly an ongoing argument?

The same thing happened to my brother, almost exactly without the assault on the GF, he was attacked by multiple youths on VA Beach, he pulled a gun, they ran and then called the police first...go figure. He isn't in jail, he wasn't convicted of a felony, it was dropped to simple assault. Mostly the reason he was charged with anything, was that not being the brightest or sharpest tool in the box, he ran his mouth on and on to the arresting officers....

I am unsure of his duty to retreat in Texas, in Florida we don't have a duty to retreat.

Also, some are arguing that if you escalate a confrontation in anyway you deserve the consequences, so if you flip a guy off in traffic, he has legal license to assault you and you can't claim self-defense, that sounds like a dubious legal theory to me.

I'll bet you a box of donuts the charge is dropped to misdemeanor assault in a plea bargain or that the witness finds another place to be the day of the court date, when he realizes that he can still be sued civilly....
 
If someone tried to get within arms reach, angry at me, shouting, I would draw on them. Its a no brainer, assuming I couldn't flee of course, which I would not because I believe it is my right to be assaulted and chased around but because of our fantastic legal system. Nobody knows exactly how everything played out in this case but it helps you think about what you would do in simular situations.
 
eltorrent, you will simply have to turn around and walk the other way...

Pushing the person is what they obviously want you to do, so that they will have the moral upper hand, because no matter the provocation you will be the person that did the assaulting... Sounds like the plot for an after school special, lol...
 
What is clearly missing is the charge was for ADW. not brandishing. The other guy obviously called 911 and said your friend pointed a gun at him. he probably did after the altercation with his girlfriend.

Ironic that if he shot and killed him and the body was laying next to his truck the cops would have seen that the other guy approached him and there would be only witnesses that he approached him, pushed his girlfriend out of the way, (Assult), and he defended himself because he was in fear for his life. No phone call to police other than your friend's 911.
 
All I can say is no matter ther size, you CANNOT drawn on a unarmed person unless your life is in danger period. Being big and ******* does not constute death threat and the pushing down other the girlfriend would have made the devil come out of me. BUT, he had a cancealed weapon without a permit and drew when he did not have to. Being a ex marine he could have more than likely kicked his ass and put the gun away.
 
"If someone tried to get within arms reach, angry at me, shouting, I would draw on them"

Are you serious?

LOL I think he is.

It would seem that arguments scare the heck out of some people.
 
Aren't ex-marines supposed to be at least moderately skilled in H2H combat? Was he incapacitated in some way? Aged? "Twice his size" is one thing, but was there a genuine disparity of force?

I don't know. Every time I read one of these "what would you have done" scenarios, I wonder about the other half of the story. Sometimes it seems to boil down to who birded whom first.

Was the girlfriend still in perceived danger at the time he got to the gun in the truck?

I wonder why you didn't wait until after the lunch to post. Any other additions to the story now?
 
Not gonna wade through 4 pages, sorry but it's late.

The reason he's not being charged with posession is that he had it in the truck, not on him. The TX law about guns in vehicles is currently ambiguous (the fix goes into effect in Sept.) and the fact that they chose not to try to charge him on that count is what I'd expect from reasonable LEO and a reasonable DA.

If he got to his truck he should have gotten into it and left.

Pretty plain what happened and why he's in trouble.

He's being charged because he went to his truck, got his gun and assaulted the guy with it.

LE responded as they should have. Two guys exchanged words and one went to his truck, retrieved a firearm and used it to threaten the other. Pretty straightforward.

Ironically, in this case he would have been better off if he HAD been carrying it on him in violation of the law. Then he could argue that he felt threatened and had no choice but to draw. As it is he retreated to his vehicle and then rather than leave chose instead to retrieve a gun and escalate the confrontation.

You need to edit the first post to reflect the fact that he didn't DRAW, he went to his truck to get the gun. That makes a big difference.
 
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