Discussion in 'Handguns: Autoloaders' started by Mathew Pixley, Mar 20, 2019.
Do you have all of the stock parts? Mainly the trigger, fire control group.
If so put it back to stock and change one thing at a time until if becomes unreliable and that component is a problem one.
If you are using handloads, first thing I would do is try factory ammunition, if that solves the problem, all the aftermarket parts are not the cause.
zev firing pin assembly with a heavy spring, complete pyramid trigger kit.
Replace these with factory parts.
After taking the slide off, I pushed in the striker pin block (round button on underside of slide) and tilt the muzzle up. Striker should poke through the breechwall rectangle opening fully but if it does not poke through fully, you may have obstruction in the striker tube (caked on fouling) and/or fouling build up at the tip of striker pin.
Remove the striker pin assembly and inspect the tip for fouling build up. If tip lacks fouling build up, next inspect the striker pin tube/hole. If tube has a lot of fouling build up, plug the hole (white arrow) to hold solvent in the tube to clean fouling.
My problem was hard fouling build up at the bottom of striker pin tube/hole that was preventing the striker tip from poking through fully. I soaked the tube/hole with Hoppes #9 solvent and used a thin flathead screwdriver to scrape the hard packed fouling at the bottom of the tube/hole.
Once the fouling was scraped off, striker pin poked through fully and no more light primer strike.
When people change connectors, or trigger bars, or polish parts in a Glock it can change the geometry enough to create drag on the drop safety.
When that happens, you get random light primer strikes.
I’ve been to the Glockstore in SD and if you walk into that place they will tell you their Pyramid trigger kits are the greatest things you can put in or on a Glock. The gunsmith at the LGS / LGR that I belong to will tell you to avoid the Pyramid trigger kit & go with the ZEV adjustable fulcrum trigger kit, but avoid the super light 2lb striker spring that comes with the kit. And of course they sell the ZEV trigger kits in their store. I like the way this gunsmith sets up the ZEV trigger kit with a heavier striker spring, but not nearly enough to want to spend that kind of money to change any of my stock as a rock Glocks. IMHO, change the sights, polish the striker interfaces, and then (maybe) swap out the stock trigger connector for the Glock minus connector, and then leave the rest of the gun alone.
IMHO, you’ve made too many aftermarket changes to the Glock OEM setup that is super reliable. And we haven’t even talked about the ammo you’re using. With my stock Gen3 17 I’ve had one light primer strike with Win NATO 9mm ammo and I have never had a light primer strike problem using any other ammo in that gun, and I’ve shot just about every brand & type ammo through it in almost 10 yrs. that I’ve owned the gun.
Now that was an interesting and informative post.
I have had several instances (in my case, due to reloads where the OAL was good but the bullet ogive was mismatched to the barrel) where the slide winds up -mostly- in battery but is just a fraction off fully forward. In this case, the striker will drop (and the barrel is locked up) but the firing pin isn't centered on the primer and hence no bang. A too-strong striker spring coupled with a too-weak recoil spring will also give similar symptoms (and can cause case bulges due to the slide being moved rearward by the striker fall without adequate resistance from the recoil spring).
It would be useful to know what the primer looks like when the gun doesn't go bang - no dimple on the primer, an offset dimple, or a centered dimple?
If this is a new build, it sounds like there could be tolerance stacking or something just plain way out of tolerance. I'd start by seeing how far the firing pin is sticking out of the breech and go from there as previously posted.
Its a very common issue on "tuned" glocks.
Ive been down the rabbit hole before and that is the only thing that solved it for me.
On a slightly related note: am I the only person who thinks aftermarket parts and finishes only lower the value of Glocks and M&Ps?
This was in 1984. So we pooled our cash (three of us, Ontario Canada don't you know) So my Friend Phil, a Lawyer by trade, me a Professional Firearms Instructor shared Phils Offices, plus big safe.
We kept two each, of the ten, we bought sold 4. Glock 17s 9mm. As we had managed to buy 30,000 of Govmt. rejects, failed the drop test? (that is the other story!) these were the first rounds we tried. NATO IVI 32 per wee box.
A friend showed us how to tenderize the primers, by lightly crushing them with a primer seater hand tool. Just a very light crush, to spread the surface a wee bit. It worked.
My suggestion to Gaston Glock (who I had met in the Royal York Hotel in Toronto, reference a business idea I had floated. (40,000 Pistols to be stocked? No sir.) anyway, sending a 32 round box of NATO 9mm to Austria, to see what we were going on about, light primer hits! Caused a good fix, they sharpened the angle on the striker tip, fixed. But not for our failed 30.000 ammo, because they were even too hard for Sten and Sterling Sub Machine gun fired rounds. Hence they had failed the drop test.
As we had bought these for 10c a round... Canadian! We did not mind the tenderizing exercise.
But no normal NATO spec rounds failed to fire. So the sharper points worked. And still, do.
But! If you have a Glock 19, full of aftermarket parts, full of! take all of those parts, barrel/main-spring/firing pin. Everything out.
Then take your cleaning picks, bronze brushes, nylon brushes, and clean every sign of carbon away. A tiny touch of fine oil, on all metal surfaces. Buy all standard, Glock factory parts for your G19.
Out to the range, full magazine, plus 1. Aim and fire at 7M. All 16 rounds. At an IPSC target. Two hands, shot every 3 seconds.
If you are a reasonable shot, you most likely will find a 3" group. Somewhat in the centre.
Now try my add ons. First, night sights, my favourite ones TruGlo, all green dots, mount them, rear sight, a wee amount to the right, or the rounds will fall to the left. This will help in low light firing, and rapid acquisition of sights, any light.
Next, the Glock factory extended slide release (they call it a slide lock) but all the top competitors use it as a slide release, IE. Dave Sevigny. Dump the original one.
Change the lined, irritating trigger, for a smooth one.
My carry pistol, the G19 Gen4. Love the wee pyramids, make for a great grip. The bigger mag release dug into my second finger, I cut that corner off.
That curved cut in the rear of the frame, the lower part of the magazine shoot in the frame, can catch in rapid mag changes. The Buttplug, the flush fitting one, makes for an absolutely clean mag change.
Notice the 43X ten shot single stack magazine frame, does not have that half-moon cut, and mag changes are really smooth.
Hope my thoughts ring true to you Guys.
I wouldn't buy a used M&P that didn't have Apex Tactical parts installed...well, I would at a discounted price.
It all depends on if the "aftermarket parts and finishes" are what the buyer is looking for...installing parts and refinishing narrows the market you are selling to, but it raises the selling price within that market
Sometimes the performance is worth the trade offs.
When looking for a used Glock, I don’t highly value any of the add ons unless they’re the exact ones I like and even then I wouldn’t buy one unless all stock parts were included.
I don’t know if they lower the value, but they’re not a big addition.
Unless it’s stippling. That basically creates a worthless frame for resale.
I see many $1000+ Glocks listed on Armslist that never sell...I assume we aren’t alone in our thinking in the lack of added value.
In a defensive firearm reliability = performance.
I have a Glock 20 Gen III that I purchased back in 2005, when Doubletap Ammunition was still making its way through the forums and getting rave reviews. Mike McNett had sparked new life into the 10mm Auto and possibly started a revival. At the very least he proved that there was a market for full power 10mm, and that the 10mm was not dead. I purchased the Glock more out of curiosity about the 10mm Auto than a desire to own a Glock. The Glock 20 was one of the only available pistols in the cartridge at the time that didn't have a reputation for battering itself apart with full power ammo. The fact it also had almost double the competition's capacity at half the competition's price made it an easy choice. I quickly grew to love the Glock's simplicity. I purchased a decent amount of Doubletap's 180 gr Gold Dot load for defense but elected to reload practice ammo. I quickly discovered bulged cases and short case life were real issues with the slightly sloppy Glock chamber, more so than the over-hyped case support issues. I purchased a KKM Precision drop in barrel to preserve case life, and shortly after a stainless captive guide rod assembly with a 20 pound ISMI recoil spring to keep brass in the same area code. The stock 17 pound spring launched brass into low orbit. I tried a 22 pound spring on that guide rod and found that while the recoil impulse was smooth and the brass stayed noticeably closer, it increased recoil too much and could make it difficult to work slide with cold/numb and wet hands. So I settled on the 20 pound spring as being a happy medium. I eventually got along to replacing notoriously crappy plastic Glock sights with decent night sights. I settled on TrueGlo TFO and found them to be fantastic. I also picked up a $10 plastic aftermarket beavertail, which took mere seconds to install and has really saved my hands from slide bite, which can be another issue if you find yourself riding up on the Glock to control the sometimes snappy full power 10mm Auto. Around this time I installed an extended slide catch and manually filed down the magazine release. I was having trouble manipulating the slide catch with cold or gloved hands, and was having inadvertent magazine drops with gloves on (I shoot lefty because I am left-eye dominant). Finally, a member of THR, TomJ, sent me a Phantom trigger kit for it not too long ago. I never had the complaints with the Glock factory trigger that some people do and by that time had enough rounds through mine that what roughness there was from factory had long since worn away, but you can't beat free. I again appreciated the Glock's simplicity as I once again installed something aftermarket by myself, without tools, in minutes, on four square feet of kitchen counter.
That leaves not much original on the old girl. Several years ago my truck was broken into while I was in the process of moving, and four guns along with half of my worldly possessions stolen. Since then, the Glock 20 has been my shadow and my rock, and my only handgun. In that role, it has excelled, though accepting those responsibilities with a heavy heart over the loss of its smaller and younger sibling, a Glock 19 I had purchased among the guns that was stolen.
And here is the heart of the issue in this long-winded post; the Glock 19 I had elected to keep 100% stock. I would have probably put better sights on it when I upgraded sights on the 10mm, but everything else would have stayed stock. Even with the Glock 20, the upgrades came over a period of a decade, with enough time to verify proper function. I knew the components work, or to what degree they affect function. I know the tighter chamber on the KKM hangs up a little bit more, especially with flatter nose profiles, but the improved polish seems to minimize this to the point it is worth it if you want to use your brass again, for example. And I kept factory parts, so I can return it to factory original condition. So I was never at any point chasing around issues because only one thing was ever changed at any given point. This is known as a control, in scientific terms.
Buying these heavily modified "race guns" for exorbitant sums of cash and then having to chase issues around or limit yourself to a specific type of ammo was how the 1911 earned a reputation as being unreliable. It is how you take a good gun with a stellar combat reputation and turn it into a choke artist. You'll note that everyone here knows Glocks by reputation run pretty reliable from the box, so their immediate recommendation is to simply restore it to factory condition, and then replace one part at a time until you identify problem? If that isn't a possibility, then you should send it back to whoever ruined it for you and get your money's worth out of it by making them chase the problem around until it functions correctly.
Have you tried the newer M&P 2.0 pistols? I honestly haven't shot one of the original M&P's but I like the trigger on my 2.0.
Personally I only polish internal parts and keep them stock.
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