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Get nationwide concealed carry rights

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by LAR-15, Dec 15, 2005.

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  1. LAR-15

    LAR-15 Member

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    WHEN TO CALL:

    Anytime you can


    WHO TO CALL:


    Honorable Howard Coble
    2468 Rayburn House Office Building
    Washington, DC 20515-3306
    (202) 225-3065

    Rep Coble decides if this bill is brought for a vote. He is chairman of the subcomittee on crime, terrorism and homeland security.

    Republican members:

    Hon. Coble
    Chairman
    (R) North Carolina, 6th

    Hon. Lungren
    (R) California, 3rd

    Hon. Green
    (R) Wisconsin, 8th

    Hon. Feeney
    (R) Florida, 24th

    Hon. Chabot
    (R) Ohio, 1st

    Hon. Keller
    (R) Florida, 8th

    Hon. Flake
    (R) Arizona, 6th

    Hon. Pence
    (R) Indiana, 6th

    Hon. Forbes
    (R) Virginia, 4th

    Hon. Gohmert
    (R) Texas, 1st

    Secure Access To Firearms Enhancement Act of 2005
     
  2. Standing Wolf

    Standing Wolf Member in memoriam

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    No, thanks. I don't want the federal government within five miles of my holster. Its attitude toward our Second Amendment civil rights has been nearly as bad as New Jersey's.
     
  3. neoncowboy

    neoncowboy Member

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    +1

    The feds regulating concealed carry would lead to the end of legal concealed carry...not to mention the damage they could do with a central national database of permit holders/applicants.
     
  4. Scott F

    Scott F Member

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    May I am a little dense but I can not see what is wrong with this law. Please straighten me out.
     
  5. AirForceShooter

    AirForceShooter Member

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    I have the same problem as Scott F.
    The Safe Act HR 1243 says nothing more than states will be required to recognize other States CCW's. In effect national recprocity. Something you would think the Constitution would require already. You know, just like the drivers license stuff.
    What I want to know, is there a similiar Resoultion in the Senate?

    AFS
     
  6. Manedwolf

    Manedwolf member

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    Had you read it? It seems to me like it's just an enforcement of Full Faith and Credit, which is SUPPOSED to be the case, as it is with drivers' licenses.
     
  7. SomeKid

    SomeKid Member

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    Does it cover D.C., and federal properties?

    How will off-limit zones be handled?
     
  8. Scott F

    Scott F Member

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    Off limit zones will be handled by the state. That is the state you are in while carrying. Just like driving. We obey driving laws of each state we travel through, or at least we are supposed to obey the driving laws. :)

    I just have not seen any reason to be against this law. I could leave my home and drive to my mom's home in NC and back by my youngest son's home in San Diego without having to remove my handgun. Well, except for the shower, that would be a long trip without a shower. Yet I keep seeing posts saying "No way!" without a stated reason.

    I am not being a smart a$$ for once, I really want to know why so many are against it.
     
  9. gunsmith

    gunsmith member

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    they're against your title

    the title of your thread is unintentionaly misleading.
    The bill is for national reciprocity and not a federal license.
    I suspect most are responding to your title .
    a federal license would be a terrible idea and would restrict my rights
    i.e in NV I can go to a bar and pack (& I do for music events, but I don't drink) but you may not do that in AZ & I doubt the fedgov would go for that.
    but I suspect reciprocity is an idea we could all get behind...whattya say Standing Wolf?
    (if SW gets behind it it'll pass without a hitch)
     
  10. Henry Bowman

    Henry Bowman Senior Member

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    Drivers' licenses are not honored nationally because of "full faith and credit." The states have agreed with one another to give reciprocity for drivers' licenses. That is, when KY sees my OH driver's license, they give full faith and credit for what it is -- an officially issued Ohio DL. Me being allowed to use it to drive on KY public roads is because of mutual reciprocity agreements.
     
  11. LaVere

    LaVere Member

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    Anyplace anytime anywhere PERIOD

    Michigan already reconizes all 50 states. But only 31 state reconizes Michigan.
    I think total reciprocity is needed. But some standard in law are need too.
    From Michigan just to Ohio I cant figure it out, in a car.

    How about If you are a US citizen you can carry any way, any place, any time providing you don't have a violent felony convitction. Example Tax evasion felony dosen't prohibit carrying.
    No fees just buy and carry.
    Thats it period
     
  12. Scott F

    Scott F Member

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    I like your idea but I do not see that happening. There is little or no chance of that but this does have a chance. There are places to check the laws before you travel. Pcaking.org is a good one.


    No one has been able to tell me why this is a bad law.
     
  13. Standing Wolf

    Standing Wolf Member in memoriam

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    Hello, Manedwolf!

    You wrote:

    That's a great theory; unfortunately, I don't trust the federal government just to let it go at that. I trust the federal government to start there, perhaps, but then suddenly decide it needs to define some standards, establish some minimum requirements, negotiate a few common sense compromises, take some long overdue action for the sake of the children, and eventually decide carrying concealed weapons is strictly reserved for F., B., and I. agents.

    The great white father is a liar. He cheats. He steals. He can stay the @#$%^&! away from my holster!
     
  14. JohnKSa

    JohnKSa Member

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    Agree. I'd rather have the feds stay out of this issue.

    I'd rather have them stay out of most issues for that matter.

    Right now there are no federal laws about concealed carry that I am aware of. If the government "grants" a right by law, they will be certain to regulate that right too. We don't need that.
     
  15. taliv

    taliv Moderator

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    i haven't read it, but am extremely skeptical.

    Just because I have a TN driver's license doesn't mean I can make U turns in OH. A TN handgun permit won't let me carry in a bank in a state that bans it.

    If the feds tried to push a common set of rules, no one would be happy.

    as far as i'm concerned, states should make their own laws however the residents want. there shouldn't be a single federal gun law.

    even if it results in a practical improvement, federal intervention is the sort of 'end justifies the means' flawed philosophy i can't bring myself to support.
     
  16. Scott F

    Scott F Member

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    This is not a federal gun law. This is a law that says if you can carry concealed in your home state you can carry concealed in all fifty states. I fail to see how we can loose here. You live in ABC state and you ate going to XYZ state. You go to packing.org, read an overview of their laws and make the trip with your gun on your hip. How hard can it be? I live in Oregon, I can carry in schools and bars. I want o go to Washington, I remember not to carry in schools or bars. I do not have and IQ of 200 but I think I can remember not to go into a school or a bar when I am in Washington.

    But some would rather stand on their rights and not carry because the states you want to travel through do not honor your states permits. I guess many of you think this is better. I don’t. I can spend a lot of money and get permits for thirty four states but if I am driving across country I still can’t cross Kansas or Illinois under current laws. I can not carry if I visit my son in California. How is this good?

    Again, please help me understand where this is a bad law. I just can not see it.

    Oh yes, before anyone forms a hard and fast opinion on this, read the law for yourself and do not let others tell you what it says. :)
     
  17. Berek

    Berek Member

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    For starters, I agree that there should be reciprocity, the problem is that some states do not require permits to own while others do. In a situation like that, where is the solice that the person coming to my state isn't going to strip that smokewagon because we deny because of one thing or other while another does not?

    In other words, to get reciprocity, restrictions would have to be increased in some states, decreased in others or both. Now, for current permit holders, there should be a grandfather clause, but I can see them getting upset when someone is denied for something that they themselves may have done but was allowed.

    In closing, while I agree there should be standardized regulations regarding ownership, which states are going to be forced to reduced there regulations and which will have to become stricker and, in the end, who pays the price?

    Just my $0.02...
     
  18. Hawkmoon

    Hawkmoon Member

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    Why would restrictions have to change in any state? I don't understand.

    My state has certain rules pertaining to drivers licenses. To get a drivers license, a person in my state has to jump through the appropriate hoops, and once they have the license it is recognized in all 49 of the other states. But in Wyoming I follow Wyoming's rules of operation, in California I follow California's rules, etc. The rules to obtain a license may be looser in Wyoming and stricter in California, but they both honor my driver's license and none of the states modify their requirements.

    Why is a CCW any different? My state doesn't require a concealed handgun to be caried in plain sight when driving. Ohio does. So what? If driving through Ohio I would have to carry the gun in plain sight, whether I have an Ohio CCW, a Montana CCW, a Florida CCW, or even if I'm from Vermont and I am not required toi have any CCW at all.

    I just don't see a problem with this.
     
  19. Berek

    Berek Member

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    The problem is that, with driving a car, the majority of the requirements (almost all...) are the same, regardless of state. With pistol permits (let alone CCW) it's not. I can move to a state that allows me to own a handgun as long as I wait or pass the standard NICS check. In NY, you have to have a pistol permit and each county has its own requirements. As an example, In Cattaraugus County, NY, I do not need to take a pistol training course. If I cross the county line to Erie County, NY, I do. Catt County appears to have no problem issuing a CCW to anyone able to have a general pistol permit, where Erie County, you must show just cause.

    With this in mind, How do I know you aren't someone who snapped, moved to another state because the requirements are easier and are now coming to NY to go nuts? How do I know that you aren't going to snap and use the new Florida ruling because you felt threatened simply because you wanted to take the metro rail and someone got too close to you? That ruling doesn't apply here, but would be used as your defense because, well, "all states should recognize whatever laws you have to follow or will allow your defense in your state even is the same laws aren't here." (You may not think that you would use a law/ruling from your state as a defense, but I heard this come up in conversation recently)

    Bottom line, I feel that if I have to jump through these hoops in my state, you should have similar in yours to be able to carry in mine. It allows for the peace of mind for the general public.

    Or should we reduce the requirements across NY state (including NYC) and come to your state? How safe would you feel? How safe would your community feel? You as an individual may not have a problem, but you and I aren't the only ones on this planet. If the population was limited to responsible ppl, life would be simple. But it's not. And I have seen many ppl that do something at the range that show they should not have guns or should at least go through a training course, but that wasn't a requirement for them to own guns.

    BTW, a pistol permit is required for all carries and ownership here in NY state, not just NYC, but the whole state.

    But I ramble. Next?
     
  20. ingram

    ingram Member

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    Involving the Feds is asking for troubles later.

    Just get permits in neighboring states if you can. It may be a hassle but it would be worth it. Allow the feds to regulate this now, and you are setting a precedent for a time when dems may run the country.

    It would be nice for me if permits were recognized in all states, but the people in states with higher restrictions would be cheated. Life isn't fair, but I would prefer it if you had to pass the certain state's regulations to carry in that state.

    I just can't see how this law could lead to anything good. Sure, it may make interstate travel easier for some of us, but the consequences outweigh the gain. The differences in state CCW regulation would not permit this law to remain unaltered for long, as the states with stricter regulations are sure to complain (which they have good right to).

    +1 to the Feds staying away from people's CCW permits
     
  21. cz75bdneos22

    cz75bdneos22 Member

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    No, thanks....i disagree..YMMV:banghead:
     
  22. gunsmith

    gunsmith member

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    Scott! how dare you!

    :neener:
    You mean ...don't go off half cocked, you want me to actually read and think!?
    What are you trying to do!? ...your trying to have an intelligent conversation...I knew it!
    You must be one of those evil right wingers..huh?!:D
     
  23. Hawkmoon

    Hawkmoon Member

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    So then (a) you obviously would not feel comfortable living in Vermont or Alaska, and (b) you apparently don't subscribe to the view that all CCW laws are fundamentally Constitutionally invalid.

    Your argument doesn't work. Last I knew, drivers' training requirements varied widely from state to state. Yet you don't seem too concerned that somebody who has had little or no drivers' training can drive a 2-ton projectile through your neighborhood on the basis of a license issued in another state. I can't see any reason it should work differently for CCW. We're talking carry here, not purchase. NICS checks or not, as I understand it it is still illegal to purchase a handgun out of state. (I'm not saying I agree that it should be, simply that it is.) This is not something to allow the Boston gang-bangers to buy their arsenals in Maine and New Hampshire, this is to allow citizens the right to self-defense in other states.

    Why is this a bad thing?
     
  24. gunsmith

    gunsmith member

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    Berek

    That guy who went nuts on the train that time did not have a ccw,he only owned a handgun. A pretty easy thing to do if you don't reside in the peoples republic of new york.
    NY is an excellent place to "go nuts" you can kill as many as you like before you need to reload and then have someone tackle you. (No one can resist in NY because ccw's are so rare) NY gun control works great for criminals, it's the only place in America I have gotten guns stuck in my face by thugs taking my money.
    Here in Reno if some idiot decided to "go nuts" a ccw holder would finish him off quick.
     
  25. gunsmith

    gunsmith member

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    Berek

    Berek-you mean the stand your ground law? If you do then your getting your info from the bradybunch.
     
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