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Getting a ton of questions about "Assault Shotguns"

Discussion in 'Shotguns' started by berettashotgun, Jan 16, 2014.

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  1. berettashotgun

    berettashotgun Member

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    Used to shoot 10-15 rounds a week and several of my coworkers know about it. Clays/trap and the long lost ZZ-birds......
    Anyways, I continuously get questions about which new ( IMPORTED from turkey/spain/china.) shotgun would be the "best" for HD.
    I don't have a clue about the quality of some of the stuff Academy or Dick's or Cabela's or................... get the point?
    I have always used Beretta shotguns. Learned on them 40+ years ago. Still use them. Don't see me wearing out either of my 1201FP's. They kick a ton, but they sure are reliable.

    I get confused with terminology - doesn't assault mean to charge forward ~ and HD means to maintain a defensive location? What the heck is a door breacher on a HD shotgun for???

    I know when I was a kid everyone wanted a Luger pistol and a M1 carbine or M16 because they were " COOL ". Nobody wanted a 1911 -strange. Dad's already had one, we wanted exotic.
    I have since moved away from that mentality due to lack of funds.:neener:
    But it appears folks are doing the same thing with HD. Not cool IMHO.
    I guess in a long-winded way I am trying to question why anyone would want a shotgun with 10-15 do-dads hanging off their life or death weapon.
    I despise shooting a pistolgrip from the floor, don't feel the need for any sights at HD ranges, and having more than the mag full, feel like I sure need more friends on my side of the scuffle. The only thing on my shotgun extra from the factory is the shells.
    Any excuse to get a firearm is perfect to me, ANY excuse!, but a " GO-TO " shotgun from ..........WHO??? Not me.
     
  2. Coyote3855

    Coyote3855 Member

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    So what exactly is your question?
     
  3. 9mmfan

    9mmfan Member

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    Some folks just like what others have dubbed "tacticool." Some folks don't.

    I'm guessing you fall into the latter category. Different strokes.

    I wouldn't worry too much about it. I don't think anyone is going to force you to hang doo-dads off your shotgun.
     
  4. Master Blaster

    Master Blaster Member

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    Me too, The deal is some folks want to substitute doodads and large capacity rotary tubes and magazines for practice.
    The high speed low drag crowd doesn't see the usefulness of practicing shooting at moving targets or how that could apply to home defense. They do not understand the concept of shoots where you look or why you dont need SIGHTS on a shotgun..

    I am sure a few of them will be along to disagree with me shortly...
     
  5. Schwing

    Schwing Member

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    My opinion is that people are buying into the advertising. The companies that make all of these accessories are very good at making it sound like your life hangs in the balance. They give the impression that, if you don't own their gadget, that your chances of surviving an HD encounter is just not good.

    The other thing I have even been caught up in a few times is just the coolness factor. I mean, I didn't really need that shroud, pistol grip, tactical light and magazine holder for my Hi point 995. I would never even consider picking it up in an HD situation unless it was already in my hands but I still bought it all because it put a smile on my face:)
     
  6. PJSprog

    PJSprog Member

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    I recently converted my Mossberg 500 Security back to "normal" ... removed the front and back pistol grips that had been on it for 20+ years and reinstalled the factory wood. Now, I actually like it again.

    While I understand the attraction of such overly-accessorized weapons to some people, I also understand that all the gadgets and gizmos in the world won't make up for solid training.
     
  7. Fred Fuller

    Fred Fuller Moderator Emeritus

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    Take a good defensive shotgun class with it, at least a day long.

    That'll answer a lot of questions...
     
  8. Midwest

    Midwest Member

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    This one has a 12 shot cylinder, no need to hang things off the gun.


    [​IMG]
     
  9. powder

    powder member

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    Not really sure where your question is there, but I'm just finishing doing a semi-conversion on one of my old 1100 Magnums: couple years ago I snagged an ATI +4 used tube extension, a used oversized bolt handle, and most recently a 26" VR target barrel off GunBroker. It's for 3-Gun matches and for FUN.

    Looked at the FNs and Benellis, etc., but could not overlook the fact that most would do almost the same work on their new $650-1200 tacti-cool shotguns. Just direct them to YouTube and search their shotgun build-it's probably on there with a decent overview. Have fun.
     
  10. jrdolall

    jrdolall Member

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    I have a similar question. What exactly is a "tactical shotgun"? I see them everywhere advertised as "tactical". Some have virtually nothing that makes them look tactical other than maybe an extended mag tube.
     
  11. Midwest

    Midwest Member

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    Looks like there accessories to throw on it to make it look tactical.


    [​IMG]
     
  12. berettashotgun

    berettashotgun Member

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    "I guess in a long-winded way I am trying to question why anyone would want a shotgun with 10-15 do-dads hanging off their life or death weapon."
    K.I.S.S. motto applies to me. Feel the same about my trusty A2 w/20" barrel. Spent plenty of time acclimating myself to that weapon.....with a ton of instruction being barked loudly.. Maybe I do need to re-evaluate my thinking about these things, never had to actually apply a hammer to that bent nail. Hence the question.
    But I do have a mag ext on an 1187 used extensively for the no holds barred snow geese season here in OK.
    I kinda do get it about the need for some things, but holding a defensive position in your "castle" in Oklahoma is legal with the police and D/A; chasing intruders is really a shade of gray around here - flavor of the month thing.

    A point - My homeowners insurance cost a lot more with a Rottweiler than a dozen shotguns. ugh...out in the country, 7 houses on 8 square miles -really?!
    Fred Fuller- done that; in spades.
     
  13. AI&P Tactical

    AI&P Tactical Member

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    The Tacti-fool crowd does not represent the majority of shotgun owners. It is much like what Nixon coined " The Silent Majority". We don't post pictures of or shotguns as they are basic fighting shotguns and not something the Tacti-fool crowd wants to see, understands nor can appriciate. As for you understanding why the people hand all that mess on the weapons, there are several possible reasons.

    1. They did not have bicycles as a kid to put bells, penants and flags on.

    2. They have no confidence in their ability to use the weapon and are hoping all that fool mess scares the person away.

    3. The feel inferior and are try to compensate for those feelings.

    4. The don't have an AR to Junk up.

    5. They thought they were susposed to.
     
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2014
  14. rbernie
    • Contributing Member

    rbernie Member

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    Because now it has the shoulder thing that goes up! ;)
     
  15. Stevel

    Stevel Member

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    This is what my tac-i-cool shotgun looks like.
    [​IMG]

    (870 Police Mag)
     
  16. PabloJ

    PabloJ Member

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    The best HD would be Winchester Model 25 riot gun. The only thing it needs is quality light mounted to it which is easy to do on Winchester 5-shot magazine tube.
    The only thing my ATP8S has besides SureFire X300 Ultra is sling and electro-optical dot sight because I like to shoot light recoil (lower velocity) slugs out of mine.
     
  17. Hacker15E

    Hacker15E Member

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    "Assault" is the new "tactical".
     
  18. Destructo6

    Destructo6 Member

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    I have no problem with people tarting up their rifles or shotguns.

    That is, so long as they can hike a bit with them and have trained enough to be very familiar, under duress, with those accessories.

    What I've experienced is that many of the tacticool parts start to disappear with extensive field use (both due to weight and actual utility). What remains is what works for the user.
     
  19. jehu

    jehu Member

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    IMO you need a light on any HD weapon because you need to be able to identify your target before you shoot. Sights are good as well and:rolleyes: enough rds avalible to stop the threat. My HD shotgun is a Keltech KSG with a Surefire light and sights. It is short and easy to manuver with 15rds, enough for most senerios. Some say 15rds is way too much but these same people are the same ones that shove a 30rd mag in their AR in the same situation.
     
  20. W.E.G.

    W.E.G. Member

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    I've played around with the "defensive shotgun."

    I've had this old Smith and Wesson for years.

    It's third-string for home-defense behind my Glock and my AR15.

    [​IMG]

    I think the AR-15 has surpassed the 12 gauge shotgun as the superior "long gun" for home defense.

    If you still want a shotgun, the Mossberg 590A1 is very hard to beat.

    I prefer the 6-shot model, with the 18.5" barrel.
    The 9-shot model with the longer barrel is too bulky for confined spaces, and is clumsy to handle with a full magazine. (Frankly, I think the long-barrel 9-shot is clumsy even with an EMPTY magazine, but that's my opinion.)

    A harder decision to make is whether to get the quite-large iron sights, or just a plain bead.
    The argument for the big sights can surely be made if there is any reasonable prospect of using the gun for slugs. But ONLY if slugs are part of the plan. At any distance beyond 25 yards, buckshot goes into complete spew-mode, and sights become pointless.

    If I have to handle a shotgun in confined spaces, I want the shorter barrel, and I have no use for aperture sights in that setting.

    For non-military applications, I don't go for lights mounted on guns. The temptation to point the gun at things for no better reason than to use the flashlight is TOO TEMPTING. Do you really want to be seen pointing a shotgun at the neighbor's dog or your teenage neighbor in the back yard? Skip the flashlight handguard.

    If I had to give up my handguns and AR15's for a shotgun, and I had to go out and buy a new shotgun today, this is the one I would want:

    [​IMG]

    Another benefit of avoiding the very-clunky receiver-mounted aperture sight, is that you can swap barrels on this gun, and use it for hunting too.

    Some folks are still going to insist on having the clunky sights, and the uber-long magazine tube - mostly because they just want whatever delivers the most "tactical."

    Whatever THAT is.

    As noted in a previous post, if you need that much shotgun capacity in the magazine, I'm not sure that 3 more shots in the magazine is going to be the difference in the outcome. Moreover, even a 10-shot magazine in an AR15 offers as much as the "tactical" shotgun.
     
  21. JAshley73

    JAshley73 Member

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    I like the way this ^^^ guy thinks...
     
  22. jehu

    jehu Member

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    "Capacity in the magazine" = Better to have it and not need it than to need it and not have it!;)
     
  23. Mike1234567

    Mike1234567 member

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    I bought a TriStar Raptor A-Tac. The only things I added are a mag extension (now holds 7+1) and light/laser combo. So far it's been 100 percent with any buckshot and slugs (approximately 600-800 rds) but won't "quite" cycle light target loads... I've read that can be remedied though. Other than the fluff-n-buff to improve light load cycling the only other thing I'll probably do is change the mag extension for one at least 1/8" longer... just that little bit extra length will allow 8+1 with most 2-3/4" shells.
     
  24. Girodin

    Girodin Member

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    There are two groups in the defensive shotgunning world that are equally ridiculous to me. The first is the group that has already been addressed here. These are the folks who have a gun that looks like they walked down the 870 accessory isle with giant crap magnet.
    The second group are those that seem to think anything more than a bone stock gun is superfluous. This groups seems to think that everyone else falls into the first group. This group can’t see the sense in a light, a magazine extension, a side saddle or anything else. They very often think a semi auto shotgun is a bad idea because a pump is so much more reliable.

    Both groups are silly. The one thing they share is that they both tend to be made up of people with basically no training or experience in the defensive use of a shotgun. They never have and likely never will go take a reputable class. They may shoot their guns, but they sure as heck don’t train with them. Typically members of each group don’t really understand the hows and whys of a lot of equipment and don’t have the training or experience to actually know what is useful and what isn’t.

    Luckily there is a third way. Some folks take classes, train, learn the ins and outs of equipment and how to use it. These folks add and remove items from a gun based on intended use and whether a particular item in reality helps or hinders. They get to figure that out, because they actually get out and train with their gun. A few quality classes will really help one shake out their setup.

    There are a number of items that can really enhance a shotgun for defensive use IMHO. Some of them, such as a well thought out light set up, are essential for me. If one actually puts in the time developing one’s skill set (which is infinitely more important) one will get a good sense of what is useful, what is dead weight, and what actually is an impediment.

    If you run into members of either group you can talk until you are blue in the face and do little good. The best cure seems to be to get them out on range where you can set up various courses of fire, shoot and move, shoot from various positions, and do it all on a shot timer. That cuts through a whole lot of BS and theoretical arguments.
     
  25. PabloJ

    PabloJ Member

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    Here is what is needed on HD shotgun: old fashioned sling, light with means of attachment to the gun. I have dot sight on mine because I like to shoot slugs.
     
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