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Gifting pistol to daughter for 18th birthday

Discussion in 'Legal' started by Neo-Luddite, Nov 29, 2020.

  1. 12Bravo20

    12Bravo20 Member

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    Let me rephrase that so everyone understands. Under federal law, schools are a gun free zone just like post offices and government property. The exception to that (in Missouri) is that if you do have a Missouri CCW permit, then you can legally have a firearm on school grounds as long as it stays in the vehicle and you do not brandish it.

    I did link to the corresponding Missouri State Statutes
     
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  2. Kleanbore

    Kleanbore Moderator Staff Member

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    But what governs here is 18 USC §922(q)(2)(A) .
     
  3. 12Bravo20

    12Bravo20 Member

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    You need to also read the Missouri State Statutes. You can have a firearm on school property if it stays in the vehicle here in Missouri. You need to have a valid CCW permit to do so (unless that has changed when we went to no permit needed to CCW). So as the current Missouri laws are wrote, if you have a valid Missouri CCW permit, you indeed can have a firearm on school property. The firearm must stay in your vehicle though.

    What I quoted in my first post was taken directly from the official Missouri State Statutes webpage.
     
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  4. 12Bravo20

    12Bravo20 Member

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    To quote Missouri Revised Statute 571.107 (10)

     
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  5. dogtown tom

    dogtown tom Member

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    Where one "resides".
    If you want to know something not covered in ATF Ruling 2010-6 you'll need to ask ATF.
     
  6. deadin

    deadin Member

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    OK, Forgive me for being obtuse but I am having trouble understanding your statement “they just have to live there with the intent of making it their home”

    You stated that “living there” meant “residing there”.

    Let’s forget about my example of being a full time RV’er., and make that my various ID’s are from a different State (DL License plates, etc.) and I am on an extended assignment in the State and have rented a motel/hotel room for several months. I do not have any government issued ID showing that I am located here other than a rent receipt.

    By your definition I am residing/living there and if I claim I am planning to make my home there I should be able to purchase a firearm from an FFL just as if I were a citizen of said state?

    It’s my understanding that I must have some form of local government ID or be in one of the special classes such as military on orders or a student enrolled in classes, etc.
     
  7. Spats McGee

    Spats McGee Moderator Staff Member

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    Yes, let's forget about the RV example. It's irrelevant for purposes of this discussion.
     
  8. Kleanbore

    Kleanbore Moderator Staff Member

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    Alrighty than. But what makes lawful carry by a permitted person is the Federal law--not the state code.

    It cannot and does not "supersede" any Federal law.
     
  9. 12Bravo20

    12Bravo20 Member

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    Yes by federal law it is unlawful to have a firearm on school property. The way Missouri law is written, as long as you have a valid CCW permit, you can legally have a firearm inside your vehicle while on school property. And yes I have talked to federal, state, and local law enforcement along will lawyers that specialize in firearms laws. In this case (in Missouri) yes you can have a firearm on school property as long as you have your valid CCW permit and you will not be breaking any state or federal laws.

    I won't argue any further on this. I have done my homework and know that I am spreading false information to anyone. And if you don't believe me, contact a lawyer that specializes in firearms laws, specifically Missouri laws.
     
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  10. Kleanbore

    Kleanbore Moderator Staff Member

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    Within a specified distance of school property, unless one has a state permit to carry.

    Well, yeah, but the Missouri law only makes carry lawful under state law.

    It is the Federal law that gives the permit holder permission to have a gun on school property and to walk, drive, or ride close to a schoolyard while carrying a gun.

    Few people in constitutional carry jurisdictions seem to understand the problem of going near a school without a resident state permit.
     
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  11. 12Bravo20

    12Bravo20 Member

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    And that is why I quoted and linked to the relevant Missouri state statutes AND brought up the fact that you need to have a valid CCW permit to have a firearm in your vehicle on school grounds IN Missouri.
     
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  12. Kleanbore

    Kleanbore Moderator Staff Member

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    Or within 1000 feet of school grounds, unless the firearm is secured.

    That's the Federal law.
     
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  13. Telekinesis

    Telekinesis Member

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    Not a lawyer, but for federal law doesn’t “school zone” used in this context refer back to 18 USC 921 (a)(25) and ...(26), which would mean it would not apply to post-secondary education like a college?

    Also another question regarding 18 USC 922 (q)(2).
    Doesn’t 18 USC 922 (q)(2)(b)(iii) allow that it is not a violation of the law if the firearm is unloaded and in a locked container, regardless of if the individual has a CCW permit?

    (I summarized sections for brevity - in brackets)
     
  14. 12Bravo20

    12Bravo20 Member

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    You are correct about if the firearm is unloaded and in a locked container.

    And also in your quote - (ii) has state CCW permit is why it IS legal to have a loaded handgun on school grounds with a valid state issued CCW permit.

    Now colleges here in Missouri seem to do their own thing. The University of Missouri System does not allow any firearms on school property (state law still in effect as long as it is followed and firearm stays in the vehicle). The Missouri State College system is different in that you can apply to CCW on campus.

    I don't know how other states handle this. In Missouri you can have a loaded hand gun in the vehicle on school property to include colleges as long as state law is followed.
     
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  15. Kleanbore

    Kleanbore Moderator Staff Member

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    Yes.

    Yes. On and within 1000 ft.
     
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  16. Neo-Luddite

    Neo-Luddite Member

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    Yes. If not in her car's trunk than in a safety deposit box at the bank in town or similar. This isn't a daily carry weapon but an in case item because she'll be 500 miles from home.
     
  17. Neo-Luddite

    Neo-Luddite Member

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    She now here, would turn 18 here, take possession and lawful ownership upon age 18 next March. She can most assuredly take lawful ownership in such a transfer, no problem with Federal or MO law if she crosses the state lines with it.
     
  18. Neo-Luddite

    Neo-Luddite Member

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    Thanks! What I was most looking for.
     
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  19. Rule3

    Rule3 Member

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    Sorry but I just do not get it??

    A gun is only useful if it is readily available. Being locked in a box in a trunk or in safe deposit box?? What good is going to be to her?

    "When seconds count, the Police are many Minutes away"
     
  20. Spats McGee

    Spats McGee Moderator Staff Member

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    Maybe so that she can take it with her for that 500 mile drive home?
     
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  21. dodo bird

    dodo bird Member

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    When I was in college in the 90,s (ah good times), I rented a tiny storage unit for like $20 a month. I kept my guns and other gear in there that I couldn’t store in a dorm room. I usually had a compact shotgun in my vehicle on trips. Just an idea. Black powder pistols can be ordered in the mail btw. (Flame away).
     
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  22. Rule3

    Rule3 Member

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    Well is she is 19 years old she is good to go in Missouri and I am assuming OK in Il if she has her card there. In Missouri she can have a gun in her car.

    If she is only 18 then all bets are off.

    https://www.usconcealedcarry.com/blog/missouri-gun-laws-what-you-need-to-know/

    Can I Carry a Loaded Gun in My Car in Missouri?
    Yes, any person who is at least 19 years of age and not otherwise prohibited from possessing a firearm can transport a concealable firearm in the passenger compartment of a motor vehicle without a permit. The firearm must not be removed from the vehicle or brandished while the vehicle is on restricted premises. Restricted premises are locations where concealed carry is not allowed in the state of Missouri.


    http://www.illinoisgunpros.com/gun-in-your-car-in-illinois-without-a-carry-license-what-is-legal/
     
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  23. Neo-Luddite

    Neo-Luddite Member

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    That's the entire thing.
     
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  24. FFGColorado

    FFGColorado Member

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    Haven't read the whole thread but I wouldn't store a gun in a car unless it is in a secure locked box that is secured to the car. And maybe not even then if the car could be stolen. Telling the police that you have 'had a gun stolen' or 'stolen car had a gun in it' opens a whole can of worms..along with where she will be living, on campus or off, her roomies, her 'apartment' or whatever......etc...

    I know when I went to college, the 'snake ranch' I lived in was anything but secure.
     
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  25. simonjester

    simonjester Member

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    This for sure!!! Both my college attending kids are in relatively safe areas of the county and saw multiple cars broken into on campus every semester. Also the "code of conduct" polices for each school strictly forbid having any "weapons" in dorms, on persons, and in vehicles while parked in their property.
     
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