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God and Glocks: Why Churches Should Not be Gun Free Zones

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by chieftain, Dec 16, 2007.

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  1. chieftain

    chieftain Member

    Dec 25, 2002
    The Free State of Arizona
    Momentum seems to be flowing our way. Let’s keep it up.

    Go figure.


  2. Mousegun

    Mousegun Member

    Dec 9, 2005
    A ------------------------------------ Men
  3. Double Naught Spy

    Double Naught Spy Sus Venator

    Dec 24, 2002
    Forestburg, Texas
    You know, the credibility of the author goes down the toilet when two out of his three reasons stated for why Murray went on his rampage were unconfirmed stuff. Playboy channel and 200K text messages?

    I call BS on Doug Giles.

    I have trouble following the lead of people who resort to such tactics. In the world of honorable people and honorable dealings, such presentations are not honorable.
  4. hankdatank1362

    hankdatank1362 Member

    Aug 5, 2006
    Myrtle Beach
    I think it was sarcasm. (unconfirmed)

    It got me at first too.
  5. Rustynuts

    Rustynuts Member

    Mar 29, 2007
    With all religions being the focal point for hatred and violence over the eons, you'd think it would be common sense to stay armed there, or at least have armed protection. Kind of like standing under a lightning rod in a storm!
  6. Double Naught Spy

    Double Naught Spy Sus Venator

    Dec 24, 2002
    Forestburg, Texas
    You would think, but instead they have some institutional mantras like...

    "God will protect us."

    When God fails to do this, then the party lines are something like...

    "God called them {those murdered} home to be with him"
    "They are in a better place, now."
    "God has a plan for us all"
  7. hoji

    hoji Member

    Jun 24, 2004
    Does anyone think that this article paints us as anything but ignorant gits?
    The Redneck Bible? Jesus with a Glock?

    C'mon, this buttmunch makes us all look like a bunch of inbred, banjo pickin albinos.:fire:
  8. Old Fuff

    Old Fuff Member

    Dec 24, 2002
    I am reminded that when the Pilgrim Fathers, escorting their women and children to service, took their weapons with them. :eek:

    And if churches are not an appropriate place to have a gun-free zone, why are schools and shopping malls? Exactly where and when has a “no guns allowed” sign at the door saved any lives, and how many have they cost?

    There is a direct relationship between the length of time a killer has to do what he came too do, and when a respondent returns fire. The longer the time is, the more victims. For the lives involved it doesn’t matter if that respondent is a police officer or a citizen with a CCW. Clearly the authorities at Virginia Tech haven’t learned that. Hopefully some others will now.
  9. cambeul41

    cambeul41 Member

    Oct 31, 2005
    Southeast Michigan
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2007
  10. the pistolero

    the pistolero Member

    Apr 14, 2006
    Beaumont-Port Arthur, Texas
    I thought that was awesome. Somebody go get the garden hose, 'cause that ole boy's on fire. :D
  11. rocinante

    rocinante Member

    Jan 26, 2007
    Alpharetta GA
    surprised no one has taken him to task for saying clips instead of magazines or mags.

    I do think he has a point about self defense and christians. Some folks just aren't smart enough to get what jesus was saying. Take his sound bites like 'turn the other cheek' and you get distortions of what he was trying to say. He really could of used a spin coach IMHO. I don't think he intended christians to act like they have a i will not fight back or kick me sign on their backs either.
  12. Black Adder LXX

    Black Adder LXX Member

    May 2, 2007
    South Florida
    "And the truth shall set you free..."

    I guess you win... :)
  13. Pigspitter

    Pigspitter Member

    Aug 31, 2007
    That reminds me of the family guy add for the NRA "don't you know Jesus and Moses used guns to fight the Romans"
  14. Geno
    • Contributing Member

    Geno Member

    Jun 11, 2005
    WWJD?! Double-tap center of mass! :evil:

    Too funny.
  15. Nagant

    Nagant Member

    Dec 13, 2007
    I found this to be quite appropriate. For those of you who didn't, I guess you don't get the sarcasm. Besides, why shouldn't we be feeling some righteous rage over this intrusion and assault? Christians and their way of life are constantly trampled and we do nothing. As for the question of "what would Jesus do?" I would like to think that he would do something similar to what our friend has suggested. He would protect his disciples. What did Jesus do when the people were "selling oxen and sheep and doves and the money changers were seated at their tables" in the temple? That's right, he made a scourge of cords and drove them out... FORCIBLY. And he *gasp* VIOLENTLY overturned their tables, etc. I can imagine he would do something analagous to this if someone came into the Lord's House and tried to KILL all his disciples... only he would of course ramp up the level of violence to meet the particular threat (ie use divine powers, call on a legion of angels, or simply "bus' a cap"). Jesus is no long-haired hippy buddhist. His "turn the other cheek" doctrine is a guidline for inter-personal relations on a day to day basis. If we projected this ideal to the whole church or to our country, we would have ceased to exist long ago. I, for one, refuse to stand by and allow innocent blood to be spilled if there is anything in this world I can do to stop it (God willing).
  16. Craig_VA

    Craig_VA Member

    Aug 18, 2007
    On Doug Giles' Column

    I like what Giles said in his column. However, I do read him from time to time on Townhall.com. I don;' agree with all his work, but I like a lot.
    Please be aware that the sentiment from Giles does not indicate there is a convert on the web. Giles already holds many sentiments common to members of THR. Further, publishing that column on Townhall is pretty much preaching to the choir just as much as posting it on THR is.
    We canonly claim PR advancement on the topic when we see a similar column from unnamed editorial writer on NY Times or WashPost.

  17. riverdog

    riverdog Member

    Dec 24, 2002
    Sometimes God protects us by sending a messenger much as he sent Jeanne Assam last Sunday -- God does his work on Earth through us. Some refuse thinking God will directly intercede -- ain't gonna happen.
  18. ROMAK IV

    ROMAK IV Member

    Jul 20, 2007
    Church property should be as private property and the status of that property as a "gun free zone" up to the appropriate church authority. In this case, it was the opposite and the leadership had prepared for such an occassion, and thankfully so, the killer was stopped before exhausting his ammunition supply. There is no such rule prohibbiting firearms at my church, and I sometimes take old or unusual weapons from my collection to show to other interested people.

    Some people believe that any form of killing is wrong, and they should be given that choice, since we are supposed to have freedom of religion, but in the context of the "Bible", there isn"t any prohibition. The commandment in the Ten Commandments, "Thou shall not Kill" is better translated "Thou shall not murder", since the Isrealites were urged by other passages to be vivilant in defending themselves. In the New Testament, the first Gentile converted by the Apostle Peter, was a ROman Centurian, and most certainly his duties included armed defense.
  19. Redtail

    Redtail Member

    Nov 28, 2007
    Christians who ought to say that arming up is against God must read the Bible thoroughly.

    Here are some scriptures to back it up:

    Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

    Luke 22:36 Jesus Christ said that himself

    Some would say that the sword symbolizes God's word but if you read clearly on the end it says buy one. You don't buy God's word, it is free.

    Then Simon Peter having a sword drew it, and smote the high priest's servant, and cut off his right ear. The servant's name was Malchus. 11 Then said Jesus unto Peter, Put up thy sword into the sheath: the cup which my Father hath given me, shall I not drink it?

    John 18:10-11

    Notice that Peter is carrying a sword. Jesus never told him to get rid of it or give it up but rather to put it back on the sheath.

    There's a scripture also on Old Testament that Israelites keep their swords, guess what, in the church, however I couldn't find it.
  20. rockinrussky

    rockinrussky Member

    Feb 21, 2007
    Richmond, VA
    seperation of church and state

    I'm not sure if this has already been mentioned but... Most self prescribed 'progressive' and 'liberal' thinkers of our time will claim that they support seperation of Church and State and in theory I agree. Now, how is church seperated from the state when the State (ie any government) feels that it has the right to regulate the church in the manners of the 2nd amendment? I realize they don't have much respect for the 2nd amendment as it is but this issue of seperation is one they tout all the time. Hipocrisy anyone?
    ex: "Oh no I don't want any crazy Christian telling me how to live my life. Wait what? they want to carry guns into their places of worship amongst others who are there of their own free will? No no no, guns are bad and they shouldn't do it cause WE said so." ->this must be the thought process going through their minds, because I honestly can't think of it any other way. And here I thought seperation of church and state was a non-relationship that went both ways :rolleyes:
  21. outofbattery

    outofbattery Member

    Apr 14, 2004
    The last couple times I've been in churches,I was wearing a Seecamp or SIG .380.Had wedding attire been a little less themed,I'd have worn something bigger.

    It's a little strange to me that most states that seem to disallow carry in churches are in the bible belt,places that should be the most gun friendly,but that seems to follow many other restrictions as well.
  22. Owens

    Owens Member

    May 7, 2007
    Don't want to make this a religious thread. We are to be vigilent. God is not the one who comes to steal, kill and destroy. Don't expect a divine fly swatter to reach down out of the heavens when a BG shows up to do harm. We need to take personal responsibility. Trust that we will be guided by God.

    For the lighter side of it, God did, by divine influence on JMB give us the 1911 didn't he now?:D
  23. Landlocked Pirate

    Landlocked Pirate Member

    May 26, 2007
    SE Georgia
    If you're not familiar with Doug Giles you would not be aware that his presentation is always deliberately over-the-top and full of sarcasm. Sometimes he goes a little too far for my tastes but he usually makes a good point.
  24. romma

    romma Member

    Jun 28, 2005
    The thing that bugs me more than anything is the mindset: " I don't believe in guns in church. If a Madman comes in and kills me, then it's Gods will"...

    I just don't get it! Especially if the mindset comes from pro-gunners.
  25. Dorryn

    Dorryn Member

    Oct 18, 2006
    Buffalo, NY
    I dont like his aggressive, sarcastic, violent stance. (2 Peter 2:18) Matthew Murray being shot was a good thing, but Mr. Giles is acting/writing totally inappropriately, and based on this angry rant, I would not classify him as any sort of Christian whatsoever. Threats? Mockery?

    Deuteronomy 32:34-35
    Psalm 4:4
    Matthew 5:21-22
    Matthew 18:21-22
    Ephesians 4:26-30

    Clearly you haven't touched too much Ecclesiastes. Or Job. Or Malachi. Evil people prosper, good people usually dont.

    Certainly the evildoers prosper, and even those who challenge God escape. - Malachi 3:15

    You are always righteous, O LORD,
    when I bring a case before you.
    Yet I would speak with you about your justice:
    Why does the way of the wicked prosper?
    Why do all the faithless live at ease?

    You have planted them, and they have taken root;
    they grow and bear fruit.
    You are always on their lips
    but far from their hearts.
    -Jeremiah 12:1-2 (emphasis mine)
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