Goodbye Canadian Gun Registry

[dak0ta]

dak0ta, you must live in QB, not AB or BC...AB and BC would love to see QB silde off into the ocean and resurface on the coat of France...let them go.

No I'm actually a Canucks fan Habs suck

 

[Midwest]

That leaves, conservatively, 3/4 of the firearms in the country unregistered in a massive act of civil disobedience by true patriot Canadians against a bad law.

I am proud of our neighbors to the North.

 

[idcurrie]

In the largest Canadian Gun Form, there are many people now openly admitting to having many unregistered firearms and are going to retrieve them from where they are stored tomorrow.

Incredible, 24 hours ago, they would be facing jail time...

 

[usmarine0352_2005]

Idcurrie: looks like the long gun registry and registration is still in full effect until decided by a judge because injunction.

 

[Carl N. Brown]

Last I heard, a judge has blocked destruction of long gun records for Quebec.

The long gun registry has cost 2.7 billion dollars (when it was supposed to cost a fraction of that); has provided corroborating evidence in 3 cases in 17 years (after suspect, motive and opportunity had already be established); and for 2.7 billion over 17 years, Canada could have had 2,300 full time additional police officers (John Lott projects that would have deterred 34,000 violent crimes).

Quebec wants to preserve the registry for the province of Quebec while federal wants rid of the white elephant. Nobody can project a number of crimes deterred by the registry because belief in gun registration is simply an article of secular faith with true doctrinaire liberals that cannot be proven like all "true" religious dogmas. $2.7 billion to provide unneeded corroborating evidence in 3 cases makes no economic sense.

The international gun control movement has had two dogmas fall:
o No Canada gun law has ever been repealed.
o No US gun law has ever been declared unconstitutional under the Second Amendment.
That has happened: but they are in denial.

We should not give up our faith, for verily our opposition will not abandon theirs.

 

[sailorjosh]

Idcurrie: looks like the long gun registry and registration is still in full effect until decided by a judge because injunction.

Only in Quebec. It is totally dead everywhere else in Canada. Quebec won't get the data anyways, it's just political posturing.

 

[usmarine0352_2005]

Only in Quebec. It is totally dead everywhere else in Canada. Quebec won't get the data anyways, it's just political posturing.

Really? I didn't read that it was only in Quebec.




Why do you think Quebec won't get the data?
.

 

[sailorjosh]

Really? I didn't read that it was only in Quebec.




Why do you think Quebec won't get the data?
.

Yeah the new law is in effect everywhere else in Canada, I spoke to the Firearms Center yesterday, there is also a notice on the CFC website here -
http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/cfp-pcaf/index-eng.htm

I am not a law expert, but the general consensus I have been hearing and reading from people who are is that Quebec has no case and almost certainly knows it. The data was collected for a specific purpose (a federal firearms registry) and Quebec has no right to it, as well as the fact that firearms laws are federal juristiction and even if Quebec did start a new registry from scratch (which they are completely entitled to do) it would simply be a property registry and couldn't have criminal charges attached. A fine for not registering a gun? It would have even less compliance than the registry we just killed. Not to mention Quebec's 150 billion dollar or so debt, and all the logistical problems that go with being the only province with a registry. Here's a quote I found -

But Stephen Scott, a McGill University emeritus law professor, says that while he considers it "irresponsible and unfortunate" of the Harper government to abolish the gun registry, on first glance he doesn’t think Quebec has a case.

"I doubt it has any legs," Scott said, explaining that the registry was created by Parliament, using federal funds, describing Fournier’s case against Bill C-19 as "pretty abstruse and a little far-fetched."

 

[Badlander]

Congrats on A big step forward!!!

 

[usmarine0352_2005]

Yeah the new law is in effect everywhere else in Canada, I spoke to the Firearms Center yesterday, there is also a notice on the CFC website here -
http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/cfp-pcaf/index-eng.htm

I am not a law expert, but the general consensus I have been hearing and reading from people who are is that Quebec has no case and almost certainly knows it. The data was collected for a specific purpose (a federal firearms registry) and Quebec has no right to it, as well as the fact that firearms laws are federal juristiction and even if Quebec did start a new registry from scratch (which they are completely entitled to do) it would simply be a property registry and couldn't have criminal charges attached. A fine for not registering a gun? It would have even less compliance than the registry we just killed. Not to mention Quebec's 150 billion dollar or so debt, and all the logistical problems that go with being the only province with a registry. Here's a quote I found -

So all firearm laws are Federal? So Quebec cannot make firearms laws?


Also, Quebec can make their own registry, but they cannot attach any criminal charges to it, why is that? Because only the Federal government can make gun laws?
.

 

[idcurrie]

Idcurrie: looks like the long gun registry and registration is still in full effect until decided by a judge because injunction.

You're mistaken. The Canadian Firearms Centre is no longer accepting or processing registrations or transfers for anyone in Canada except those in Quebec. The injunction only applies to the province of Quebec. You can read about it on their website if you wish...

usmarine:

Here's the skinny: When C-68 was instituted in 1995, the province of Alberta wanted to abstain and challenged the implementation of the law in their province all the way up to the Supreme Court. They lost. The court ruled that Criminal Law regarding firearms is Federal Jurisdiction and as such Alberta has had to comply with C68 since 1995.

Now, the shoe is on the other foot. Quebec is saying they want a provincial firearms registry and have challenged the implementation of C-19 in their province. Too bad for them, this jurisdiction has already been established by the supreme court ruling.

Quebec wants the Federal Government to hand over existing registry on its citizens and the injunction means that they must continue to process transfers and new registration until this ruled upon or the data would become invalid 10 minutes after they stopped doing such.

Also unfortunate for Quebec, the Privacy Act expressly forbids the Federal Government from giving information to any other agency or person or for that data to be used for any purpose than for which it was expressly collected. In short, it's illegal for the federal gov't to give the registry data to Quebec since that's not the original purpose the data was collected for.

Quebec does have rights to administer registration of PROPERTY in their province. So they can create a provincial firearms registry from scratch if they want. The problem is they can't make it a crime not to comply or to have unregistered guns. At best, they can apply a small fine. The cost of doing such would be astronomical and compliance would be near zero from people who were burned by the federal registry already. With no criminal penalty, compliance would be nill. Consider that compliance was already 1 in 4 when there were severe criminal penalties for non compliance.

The Quebec government is only posturing. They know that they can't win but they are doing everything they can in order to satiate their constituents.

You see, the reason behind C68 and all of this draconian gun control was a massacre at a school that took place in the province of Quebec.