Gun Case/Safe for the Inexperienced

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MXan

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My kid is getting old enough that I need a gun case or safe. Unfortunately, I know nothing about the topic and after research, I feel more confused than when I started. You guys helped me out immensely when I was first picking a gun, so...

I live in a small apartment, so it needs to be compact. I have a 10/22 and a 12 gauge (Remington 870). I plan on getting a pistol, but haven't made it that far yet. I don't need to store documents, ammo, etc, and it doesn't need to do anything but keep curious children out.

Looking through various sites, I see all kinds of features and all kinds of solutions. Vaults, boxes, cases, safes, lockers, and more. Right now I'm picturing a small vertical case, wood or metal, no glass front (why draw attention to the contents?), with a combination lock.

Does that seem to fit with my needs, or is there something else I should be looking at instead? What other advice do you smart folks have?
 
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whatever you get make sure to lag bolt the safe if possible to the floor joists or wall studs to make it much harder to remove or pry open.
 
Just to verify, it sounds like you are looking for the product with the primary purpose of storage and child resistance? (that is, is a safe that has no real burglary protection OK?)

Do you want fire protection?

Beyond the items listed, do you think there is a reasonably good chance that you will use this for any other valuable storage in the future? (including more firearms beyond your current collection and a pistol)

Do you want a product that has fast-access so that the firearm can be rapidly accessed for self defense?

Do you prefer a mechanical versus electronic locking mechanism? (both can be super reliable, but note that the electronic locks on many of the entry and mid level locking gun containers are total garbage.)

There are some locking metal boxes sometimes called "under bed gun safes" that use reliable mechanical locks and reliable electronic/biometric locks that can hold a few long guns and hand guns and are made for the purpose of fast access. Some of these types of products are build quite solidly and they do provide some degree of meaningful theft protection. The pricing on these can vary considerably.

Stack-On cabinets are an economical option for storage. I have quite a few. I would recommend either adding a secondary locking device or changing out the lock for something a little better.
 
Eddie Eagle program for the tyke at least a full year before the child's mother thinks the child is ready.;). And lots of BB gun time with dad. That way the child learns safety just in case one of the tykes friends parents don't store safely.

Check for low cost units like Stack On. Just don't expect a lot of theft protection from that type of lock box.
 
I say, if you're going to buy something (and you need to), unless money is super tight, get at least an entry-level safe (i.e. a low end Liberty, or the store brand from Bass Pro or whatever you have nearby). At the bottom of the line, determined theft protection is more "security theater" than actual security, but it will keep a quick smash and grab thief out, and keep your kid out. Get much bigger than you think you need...you have just a couple of guns now...but you'll end up with more and find other things are worth locking up. Do yourself a favor and focus on safes weighing at least a few hundred pounds, offering some fire protection, and using dial combination locks (keylock on the dial is a nice bonus, but unlikely at the bottom of low end).
 
For the cost of the steel cabbinet at home despot you can buy 2 steel cabbinets made for guns from dicks or spend $100 bucks more and get a proper "safe" (rsc) from harbor freight
 
The other posters are right; just get a metal locker from anywhere for what you need.

But...counter the curiosity with regular safety and familiarization sessions with your kid(s). Let them handle the gun, show them how to point it in a safe direction, how to keep their fingers away, etc. To me, the best course is to let them hold it and heft it and remove the stigma of the forbidden fruit. My kids have their classes quarterly and have grown quite bored with it by now. That's success in my book, because now there's nothing exciting about finding a gun and waving it around and being dangerous like some kids may do.
 
Normally I would quote and respond individually, but this is gonna get long. I trust you guys can find the parts corresponding to your messages. ;)

I don't need fire or theft protection. I have renter's insurance for the unlikely possibility that either event occurs. Further, I don't advertise the fact that I have guns (even my best friend in town didn't know until he helped me move), and I live in a safe neighborhood of a small town, further reducing (not eliminating, reducing) my risks.

I live in an apartment. I cannot bolt anything to the subfloor/floor/etc.

Something that could handle my two guns, the future pistol, and the mags for my 10/22 would be all I need. Space for a third rifle wouldn't be bad, but it will be some time before I get an AK/AR/bullpup/something. I don't have the finances for a large gun collection, nor the time to use them all if I had them. I'm a minimalist by nature and won't get more guns than I can use (sorry guys, I'm not a collector :p ). I have other secure storage for documents and lack any other valuable worth putting in a safe.

To clarify, my son is 2. I suspect that some time in the next year or two my son will get the mental capacity to understand some gun basics, but for now he still hasn't grasped the concept of a hot stove, so safety lessons will have to wait. But he doesn't have to understand for an accident to happen, and while I don't keep the guns loaded I'd just as soon get something before we need it. Plus we sometimes have older kids over; they are unlikely to find the guns or remain with them unnoticed in our small apartment, but I'd like to remove the possibility.

Ideally, whatever option I chose could be accessed quickly in case of emergency. However, I'm a black belt and always "armed" in a sense, and if defense was my priority I'd already own that pistol.

Looking at reviews, I wasn't impressed with electronic or biometric locks in my price range. Are there particular advantages to a key vs a combination?

Thanks for the responses! I hadn't considered a simple metal locker, but that might work better than a dedicated 'gun safe.'
 
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MXan said:
Normally I would quote and respond individually, but this is gonna get long. I trust you guys can find the parts corresponding to your messages. ;)

I don't need fire or theft protection. I have renter's insurance for the unlikely possibility that either event occurs. Further, I don't advertise the fact that I have guns (even my best friend in town didn't know until he helped me move), and I live in a safe neighborhood of a small town, further reducing (not eliminating, reducing) my risks.

I live in an apartment. I cannot bolt anything to the subfloor/floor/etc.

Something that could handle my two guns, the future pistol, and the mags for my 10/22 would be all I need. Space for a third rifle wouldn't be bad, but it will be some time before I get an AK/AR/bullpup/something. I don't have the finances for a large gun collection, nor the time to use them all if I had them. I'm a minimalist by nature and won't get more guns than I can use (sorry guys, I'm not a collector :p ). I have other secure storage for documents and lack any other valuable worth putting in a safe.

To clarify, my son is 2. I suspect that some time in the next year or two my son will get the mental capacity to understand some gun basics, but for now he still hasn't grasped the concept of a hot stove, so safety lessons will have to wait. But he doesn't have to understand for an accident to happen, and while I don't keep the guns loaded I'd just as soon get something before we need it. Plus we sometimes have older kids over; they are unlikely to find the guns or remain with them unnoticed in our small apartment, but I'd like to remove the possibility.

Ideally, whatever option I chose could be accessed quickly in case of emergency. However, I'm a black belt and always "armed" in a sense, and if defense was my priority I'd already own that pistol.

Looking at reviews, I wasn't impressed with electronic or biometric locks in my price range. Are there particular advantages to a key vs a combination?

Thanks for the responses! I hadn't considered a simple metal locker, but that might work better than a dedicated 'gun safe.'
Click to expand...
you can't lose a combination unless you go braindead, and you won't need your gun at that point anyway :)

some say the key will be slightly quicker, assuming you have it on you when you need it, which will likely be while naked at 2am, when you won't, and of course it will be somewhere for safe keeping so the kid cant find it, hence not within immediate reach of the cabinet.
 
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http://m.big5sportinggoods.com/mobi...ges/SearchBox/SearchBox.jsp&_dyncharset=UTF-8

I used something like this for a long time.

The dementions fit nicely in the side/corner of a typical bedroom closet with the sliding doors; the area to the far sides that usually behind dry wall and don't take up much closet space. That area is also protected by drywall on 3 sides.

You could also buy a couple of pad locks and hasps and easily drill though it to add additional locks if you wanted.

I prefer key because you can do that in the dark whereas a combo you cant.

This isn't a safe that going to stop a real thief but will keep kids out in your situation.

If you get one with a key like I did, I kept 1 key on my keyring in my pocket at all waking times and the other spare key was locked in my truck. At the time, my wife wouldn't have touched a gun anyways so she didn't need a key.

And don't think you can hide a key. At some point in their young life they all start snooping around. It's what kids do.

Do it sooner rather than later. At about 3 they will have figured out how to use a chair to climb on top of the counter.... nothing is "out of reach" of 3-4 yr old.
 
Combination locks in the low end residential security containers are very low end products themselves and only drive the price up.

A keyed RSC from StackOn can be put in a closet for under $150 and the key can be kept secure since you're not concerned with immediate access to the firearms.
 
Hey, let's not forget that OP is a renter.

He's not likely going to be able to lag anything anywhere in his apartment.
Further, apartments are not always built to safe-resistant sorts of stregths. A 400# 30" x 30" RSC is 64#/sf (and that's assuming it has a perfectly flat bottom, which most don't)--that's considerably more than the 40#/sf Live Load/10# dead load too many apartment floors are designed to. Not that the 1.5" gypsum (lightweight) conccrete floors over 3/4" plywood would give much to bolt to, they will get bendy, and with a 'lightweight' RSC.

Now, to the OP, since he is self-described as a minimalist, I'd say to go ceck out the Bedvault line from Gun vault (which is probably gunvault.com)/ THis is a box, with a furniture laminate that tucks in the space under the bed. A $30 dust ruffle will make it invisible. Or it can be left exposed to look like what it is, and underbed storage container (just not containing quilts or sweaters).
 
alexander45 said:
For the cost of the steel cabbinet at home despot you can buy 2 steel cabbinets made for guns from dicks or spend $100 bucks more and get a proper "safe" (rsc) from harbor freight
Click to expand...
I get what you are saying but I don't think that most RSCs built to bare minimum UL requirements are all the more difficult to defeat than locking cabinets. All-in-all, locking cabinets or safes that have side armor measured in the 16-10 gauge arena don't really give any protection against attack, IMO.
 
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hso said:
Combination locks in the low end residential security containers are very low end products themselves and only drive the price up.

A keyed RSC from StackOn can be put in a closet for under $150 and the key can be kept secure since you're not concerned with immediate access to the firearms.
Click to expand...
Stack On makes RSCs? I know they advertise their safes as being built to certain UL code, or use a UL RSC lock, but I was not aware that they made a product that is been entered in, and passed, the UL Residential Security Container test?
 
MXan said:
Normally I would quote and respond individually, but this is gonna get long. I trust you guys can find the parts corresponding to your messages. ;)

I don't need fire or theft protection. I have renter's insurance for the unlikely possibility that either event occurs. Further, I don't advertise the fact that I have guns (even my best friend in town didn't know until he helped me move), and I live in a safe neighborhood of a small town, further reducing (not eliminating, reducing) my risks.

I live in an apartment. I cannot bolt anything to the subfloor/floor/etc.

Something that could handle my two guns, the future pistol, and the mags for my 10/22 would be all I need. Space for a third rifle wouldn't be bad, but it will be some time before I get an AK/AR/bullpup/something. I don't have the finances for a large gun collection, nor the time to use them all if I had them. I'm a minimalist by nature and won't get more guns than I can use (sorry guys, I'm not a collector :p ). I have other secure storage for documents and lack any other valuable worth putting in a safe.

To clarify, my son is 2. I suspect that some time in the next year or two my son will get the mental capacity to understand some gun basics, but for now he still hasn't grasped the concept of a hot stove, so safety lessons will have to wait. But he doesn't have to understand for an accident to happen, and while I don't keep the guns loaded I'd just as soon get something before we need it. Plus we sometimes have older kids over; they are unlikely to find the guns or remain with them unnoticed in our small apartment, but I'd like to remove the possibility.

Ideally, whatever option I chose could be accessed quickly in case of emergency. However, I'm a black belt and always "armed" in a sense, and if defense was my priority I'd already own that pistol.

Looking at reviews, I wasn't impressed with electronic or biometric locks in my price range. Are there particular advantages to a key vs a combination?

Thanks for the responses! I hadn't considered a simple metal locker, but that might work better than a dedicated 'gun safe.'
Click to expand...

What are we talking price range? The good quality Under Bed Safes sound like they will suit all of your needs except maybe price.

With what you want, I think the cheap Stack On Cabinets will do great with one downside...speed of access. Obviously this type of product provides zero protection from an attack. It is worth hiding them given hiding is a very effective security countermeasure.

Cheap biometric and electronic locks are garbage and can get people killed. Many are not child proof whatsoever. For a fast-access safe or vault, my opinion is that the mechanical Simplex lock is far superior to everything else. The Fort Knox Pistol Box is one of numerous types of this product to use Simplex.



One home defense option could be this...

This for your long guns...I purchased one of these on sale in store for 65 bucks. I did replace the lock and advise doing this.
http://www.dickssportinggoods.com/p...6.4413993.4414427.4414433&categoryId=11484400


One of these for your future hand gun. Built more solidly, this design gives you the absolute best reliability when a reliable product could play the deciding factor in a SHTF situation. None of the BS that many electronic locks on this type of product come with. You can find the original on sale for $140-ish at times.
http://www.ftknox.com/product-category/boxes/
 
There is a company that makes modular safes. I gave them some serious consideration when I was still on active duty and moved around a bit. They are great ideas for apartments.

snapsafe.com
 
While no body wants their things stolen, a safe is to keep it out of the hands of kids, and those who could hurt themselves or others. Insurance is for theft. It is not likely, however people can and do get in to even the best safes. Buy a safe to keep the kids out, buy insurance to keep it from being stolen.

Some insurance companies even cover damage at events, competitions, being stolen from your vehicle etc. USAA will replace it, if it gets damaged at the shooting range, or in competition. Something else to understand. Scopes, Silencers, Red Dots, and other equipment that can be removed are not included with the rifle, unless specifically stated. So if you have a 3000$ Rifle, and a 2500$ scope. But you do not have them marked aside from themselves, they will only replace the rifle. You have to insure each item. Also know most companies cover 1500-2500$ in firearms and related equipment. So if your chronograph, spotting scope, rifle, chairs, bipods, bag, glasses, ear and eye pro can all fall under this. It adds up quickly. The only true way to be safe, is to have each item individually marked and insured, and then understand what your cap is, and have everything else fall under that cap.

Gun safes are to keep people from getting hurt, Insurance is to recover theft.
 
Just got back from vacation, and lots of good answers here! Thank you all very much! I think you've given me enough to go on. I'll go poke around some places, and if I remember to do so I'll let you know what I end up getting.
 
One other thing you can do beyond what is mentioned is buy one of those keyed cable locks and run them through the actions of each.
 
How about a hard side double rifle case with combo or padlocks? Or a couple of single hard cases with locks? They are readily available and inexpensive, typically from $40 to $150 for entry to mid level models.

I'm partial to storing one gun in a double case, you can put all your extra mags, ammo, and accessories right there with it. You can stick a pistol or 2 in there too when the time comes to add one. And it fits under the bed very stealthily.

Neither is any good for theft protection, but a loose RSC isn't much better. And they'll keep a little guy out and all your gun stuff conveniently in one location.
 
Sheepdog1968: I've considered single hard cases (especially since I don't have any case at all for the shotgun). It will just depend on what I can get a deal on at this point.

Fred in Wisc: A lock on the action itself I hadn't considered, but I have seen them. More to consider.

Drail: That would be the simplest solution, but I can't lock the room. For one, there isn't a lock on the door already; I'd have to get landlord approval to go messing with the door. Two, we don't have central air. Closing that door would cut the room off from the only window AC unit in the apartment, and with triple digit temperatures being not uncommon, that would get unpleasant.
 
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