Gun Misconceptions in Law Enforcement

[oldbear]

SharpsDressedMan, I had a similar experience in South Eastern Colorado in 1974. We were issued all our gear, including S&W M-19’s along with 6 round loop ammo carriers, which I quickly replaced with double dump pouches with speed strips. My patrol sergeant demanded I not use the belt loops to attach my ammo carrier, as it would not allow me to quickly remove it and throw it to another officer who had run out of ammo. He was not to happy when I explained, in no uncertain terms, that I was not going to give anyone my last 12 rounds of ammo!! I did though buy an “Ammo Wallet” six round holder that I kept in my shirt pocket. This seemed to placate him.
To most cops firearms are just another tool needed, and very seldom thank goodness, to do the job.

 

[SharpsDressedMan]

Maybe some instructor at a Colorado academy back in the 70's was teaching recruits to "throw ammo" in a gunfight. That would explain those two officers having the same plan..................

 

[Slamfire]

The NJSP use to have HK P7s. When they retired them, one reason was expense; it is rumored that another reason was NDs, though that is hard to imagine.

I have handled squeeze cockers. There are two ways to fire the things. The standard procedure was to squeeze the grip and pull the trigger. The alternative method was pull the trigger and squeeze the grip. Either way will fire the pistol.

I am certain someone got confused with all the pulling and squeezing and got out of sequence.

And then I have no doubt someone got excited and pulled and squeezed at the same time, when they only meant to squeeze.

 

[Cop Bob]

In my department back in the day, Cadets and Rookies were required to carry Revolvers, what was pushed were K frames, and later the L frames..

When it came to speed loaders, the Safariland was pushed over the Dade Speed loaders, for just that reason "Ammo Swap" the Safarilands would not (or should I say less likely to) drop ammo out if dropped or thrown... But I like you and giving up mine.. if you couldn't do it with 18, what make you think I would give you mine?

On thing that I will say, is that 80% of all the accidental discharges in my old department were with Glocks... just saying... But as stated, I have seen them with revolvers too. Nothing is safe in the hands of a determined idiot..

 

[JohnBiltz]

It was believed by both my command and squadron that loading an M16 magazine to capacity would exhaust the springs prematurely and cause failure, thus, only 20 rounds were loaded, vice 30.

It was believed (again, by both command sqaudron) that during weapons turnover, the ideal method of inventorying and verifying round count was to drop a magazine and eject a live round on the deck of a rolling ship. Bullet setback, rim erosion, negligent discharge due to unnecessary handling, and loss of live ordinance were all brought up and summarily ignored. Press-checks were mentioned and discarded as "just not the way this Chief's Navy operates, son!"

I was stationed for a year in Korea north of the river. We stored our ready magazines loaded with 28 rounds in them. When we inventoried we took wire coat hangers cut them then took a strip of tape and marked them so when inserted into the magazine the tape would touch the top round when the bottom of the wire was against the bottom of the magazine. Since if it was only a round short the top round would be against the opposite side of the magazine it would take at least being short two rounds to even look correct it was a very reliable system as well as being quick.

 

[Buford57]

The chief at my second department told me I could carry a blue or stainless revolver, but not nickel because "we have lost too many officers because that shiny gun drew fire". He then handed me a very shiny badge. I later learned that the last LOD death in that department was in the 20s in a motorcycle accident.

They were also of the throw ammo school and allowed semi-autos only for plainclothes officers due to fear that average officer couldn't handle one safely. They didn't provide any training for the plainclothesmen, though, just authorized them to carry. So when one of the dimmest patrolmen in the dept. was assigned to Crimestoppers as a rubber-gun assignment the first thing he did was buy a 9mm and shoot a file cabinet, thereby proving their point. I guess the semi-auto fairy didn't sprinkle enough dust on him when he put on his sportcoat.

 

[PBR Streetgang]

Good. That's settled. I had an ND with a Glock once--and I thought it was MY fault (you know, for pulling the trigger with a round in the chamber). Glad to hear it was just the gun.



The NJSP use to have HK P7s. When they retired them, one reason was expense; it is rumored that another reason was NDs, though that is hard to imagine.

Back to topic:

I had a conversation with a Statie here a while back, and I mentioned that I was carrying a primary and back-up gun. He asked why, and I gave him my (standard, but true) line about every SD instructor I've taken classes from having recommended a back-up, and having carried one.

He paused. "Maybe I should think about one."

Loosedhorse, I'm familiar with NJSP switching over to the P7m8's. Originally the NJSP had holsters that had a spring bar that came thru the trigger guard to lock their revolvers in place and had to be depressed back so the handgun could be withdrawn.When the P7's came into play , all I can say is old habits are hard to break!
I won't go on record on the number of ND's but will say it was more than a few! I will say it was one of the more accurate service pistols I have fired.

 

[rellascout]

I had an ignorant VA State Trooper lecture me that carrying my DW CBOB cocked and locked was dangerous and I was going to shoot myself or someone else.

I had to explain to him the difference between a 1911 and the Sig P229 he was carrying. The idiot had appeared to have never encountered a gun that was not DA/SA and assumed all of them worked the way his Sig did.

 

[SSN Vet]

Not any kind of LEO here, but it's well known in these parts that the NH State Police (along with Maine State Police and many other agencies I surmise) never thought that partoling troopers needed a long gun in their car untill Carl Drega went postal with an AR and a bullet proof vest....

http://www.terrymartin.us/Terror.htm

One man with an AR can out gun quite a few lawmen with hand guns.

Both NH and ME issued mil. surp M-16s to their road troopers soon after.