guns in church?

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I've had someone "touch" my weapon in church two times.

Once was an aunt who gave me a hug. Her eyes kinda' got big, but it was a sign of "What's that?" not recognition. I don't think she had a clue what it was. It was never spoken of in any case.

The other instance was the case of another male member approaching from behind the weak side (blind side) and reaching out with his hand to tell me of his presence in a greeting. (I think I may not be describing this well, because it was NOT anything wierd). His hand made contact on my strong side, under my arm (I was shaking another individual's hand). This put his hand on the top of my Kimber (carried in a tuckable IWB, no jacket). There was absolutely no reaction at all.

I think your reaction can make a big difference in how they interpret what they think they felt. In the first case, I didn't react at all, so my aunt thought there must be nothing out of the ordinary. In the second case neither of us reacted, so it would not seem there was anything to react to.
 
i understand. it's probably 80/20 where i go, where 80% if they touched the ccw would want to know what kind it is, and if i liked it, and how it shot. the other 20% would give me a "i can't believe you brought a gun in here" look. they wouldn't say anything to me about it, but they'd sure gossip to others.
 
My church came out against carrying in church buildings. While I disagree with their decision, I choose to belong and thus must submit to their rules. If I choose not to follow their rules, I must of good conscience separate myself from them. You can't have it both ways. I chose to submit. You might have chosen differently.

CaCrusin :cool:
 
Peace officer in the pews

I often sit behind a uniformed and armed police officer in church on Sundays. No one makes a deal of it and I feel they shouldn't for anyone in civilian clothes either.
 
For a long time, I did not carry in church-just didn't feel comfortable with it. That changed last spring when I got a call from the local Child Protective Services office. Seems that a now-former member of our church was discovered to be a pedophile, and that he had expressed a sexual interest in my then 9-year old daughter :fire: . Needless to say,.....
 
At my home church, the members who are LEO carry. My pastor prefers that they do.

At my college church, the pastor has armed security (he's fairly well known).

I can't legally carry (under 21). If I could, I would in church. A church is the people, not the building.
 
Something I had not thought of in years... When I first got my permit I carried everywhere at all times. Including all church functions. I want to say this was '84 but I might be a bit off there one way or the other. Regardless, back then I was the only person I knew with a permit, period. Not sure what the numbers were for Indiana's Shall Issue back then but there couldn't have been many of us.

Anyway the first time I got "made", by my dad no less, was at a church get-together of some kind and the feces hit the wind machine. People just didn't seem to know what to make of it at the time. I continued to carry anyway and they tolerated it. 20'ish years later I rarely carry(there's one at each office and plenty at home though last month's experience should have broke me of this bad habit) but everyone at church, still the same preacher and all, do. :) Not sure if I started a trend or not but now that I think of it it is kinda funny.
 
I have carried in church for many, many years. Bad things can happen to good people anyplace - and church is no exception to that. I once had a parish priest who had been a missionary in China when Communism was emerging and was making it both hard and dangerous for Catholic priests. He took to carrying a 1911 for personal protection and, even when he came back to the U.S., kept the habit.

When he officiated at our wedding he was "packin heat" and I knew it. That was 45 years ago and my wife and I are still married. As far as packing in church is concerned anything said about it is a non sequitur. Movin' on ;)
 
You think Churches are exempt from fanatics or terrorists. A couple friends that know I carry think I'm crazy for carrying in church. It's no different than any other place. In fact, I bet the Middle Eastern nut jobs would feel very comfortable targeting my "church of infidels" since there are probably around 500+ people in each service.
 
Thanks Preacherman. The Cardinal will be coming next week and what will I be thinking about?

Out of curiosity ... why not? Does your faith state that the earthly leadership of your organization is infallible on such matters? Or is it a politeness thing?
Click to expand...

Just a friendly reminder, carrying on private property is subject to the approval of the property owner. If you are told no carry and you do, you are tresspassing and can be charged. Aside from that, it's just bad manners.
 
Rebar, in response to the MA law requiring all men to bring a rifle to church on Sundays, I decided to add a just-recently-repealed law to their list for PA.

Here's what I e-mailed to them.

Not necessarily a stupid law, as I believe "an armed society is a polite society," but here you go. This law was repealed just a few years ago:

FRANKLINTOWN, PA
All law-abiding, mentally- and physically-capable residents, over the age of 21 years, are required to own and maintain a firearm in their place of residence.

But, back to topic:

This is a repeat (at least to me) of a thread either here on THR or on TFL. My job usually requires me to work on Sundays, therefore making me unavailble to attend Sunday Services. However, when I can and do attend, I carry. I do so discreetly, so as not to offend others, but I've read and heard too many churches being attacked during mass/services. I'm also of the crowd who feels "the church is the people, not the building," and that "we are all our Brothers' Keeper."

As for the "hugging" thing, unless it's a family member or very close friend (all of which know I carry anyways), I always reach for the low side, requiring them to go high. As for my church, it's a handshake rather than a hug.

Just my $.02

-38SnubFan
 
But...

Jesus Christ himself did not object to OPEN carry, in His very presence.

I've posted this before, but you remember the Agony in the Garden?
The arrest at Gethsemane? Kephas (Peter) put up a fight,
and severed the ear of Maalkhos, a member of the arresting party,
using a short sword called a kereb (chereb), and what that shows is that

1. Peter HAD a weapon to draw
2. The Lord did not object to Peter's keeping and bearing of a weapon

Of course a lot is made of Jesus' admonition to Peter at Gethsemane
"Those who live by the sword...", but really...
the point was that Peter had chosen to trust his weapon instead of the Lord, physically present before him.
Peter was living by the sword, rather than by Christ --denying Christ's power, authority,
and above all Christ's mission (which granted, wasn't yet clear to the chief Apostle)--
by presuming to defend Christ with mere steel.

Jesus didn't need Peter's steel for His own protection.
That Jesus didn't object to Peter's steel prior, however suggests said steel was deemd useful
for the protection of others: the meek and innocent.


Those who would visit violent evil upon us
often do not respect holy sanctuary, no?


JM2P
 
I (like Preacherman) am a member of the clergy, and in MO, carry in church requires consent of someone with responsibility for the worship services (generally, the minister). I have given consent to one person (the only one who asked) to carry in church. Have I carried in church? No. Why? My Milt Sparks holster just arrived this week, and I haven't had the opportunity to do so yet. I might take a couple weeks to get used to it before bringing my 1911 to worship. Unfortunately, we don't wear vestments and the like (heck, I could hide a 12 gauge under that), but a full suit can go a long way to hiding a good piece.

To tell the truth, there are a few members of the church I wish would carry; they have the training and mindset to be good protectors of the body. However, for legal liability reasons I am loathe to suggest that they do so. If they asked, though, I might just recommend it.

Theologically, there is NO Biblical prohibition. It requires too many Scriptual calisthenics in order to pull it off; what we have here is a pure matter of opinion.
 
I know we are not supposed to get religious, but this thread is sort of broken the barrier so I'll add this.

The reference to Matthew 26:51 highlites the fact that people carried weapons in Jesus time...now a sword was more than just a defensive tool (against predators 2 & 4 legged), but it was also used, I imagine, to cut wood for fires, building things and whatever other purpose the user had need. But wanting to protect oneself was a prime reason for having a sword.

Anyways, "CONCEALED" is the key here. Just don't advertise and no one will be the wiser...Just you and your god.

:cool:
 
Pastor of our church, (retired Marine, and a friend for the last 26 years) emailed last night asking for advice on what kind of gun to get. He hasn't shot much since retirement and when he has it's been with me. We'll probably hit the desert and run through the Glocks, HKs, Kimbers, Colts until he finds what he likes, (which will be a 1911 style if I can twist his arm enough) :D A bunch of us carry at church and are the "unofficial" security. Badges? we don't need no stinkin badges...... ;) (unlike the ushers)
 
CaCrusin, it does not make logical sense that you have to submit to his rules unless you are legally compelled to do so. His rules are wishes. He holds no moral authority over your rights. Furthermore, his "rules" are arbitrary and dumb.

If he had a "rule" that you had to be naked, would you follow it? Don't dignify his stupid wishes with compliance.
 
Being somewhat familiar with the group ( as a member) one has pretty good idea of the reasonableness of authority and the scope of the rules. If the request violates Christian teaching, then there is no authority.

The compulsion is from a scriptural standpoint, not legality.
 
I can't locate the article right now, but IIRC, the members of the St. Stephens AME church in Toldeo, OH found out about this the hard way early this year...

Couple of BG's ran into the church and pointed guns to the heads of children, under age 12, demanding that the members give them money, jewelry, etc.

Don't know how much money & stuff they got.
 
Not illegal in TX! A house of worship must post an appropriate sign. I haven't seen one yet. But then again, I don't survey them. But no one's every mentioned seeing one in San Antonio.
 
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