Have you found the "perfect" factory hunting rifle ... at any price?

[MCMXI]

I've been watching these guys on YouTube that have a channel called Backfire. Their videos are entertaining but they are certainly not rifle experts, not even close, but maybe that's the point. Anyway, this got me thinking about the "perfect" factory hunting rifle ... at any price!

Obviously this isn't an objective topic since we all have different expectations and requirements, but I'd be interested to hear if anyone has found their unicorn ... I certainly haven't. By "perfect" I mean a hunting rifle that checks every box for you, is ideal in every way, and requires zero upgrades or changes.

To get the ball rolling I'll mention the Tikka T3x family. Tikka gets a lot right with a locking bolt handle but the .30 cal offerings have a 1:11 twist ... yuk! Tikka offers short action cartridges in a one size fits all receiver which isn't good. The magazines work/feed well in the rifle, and the actions are among the smoothest, but the magazine catch/release is crap being way too small and not even vaguely positive. Even aftermarket catches such as the one included with expensive RMT bottom metal is crap. Extraction is garbage when pulling the bolt to the rear slowly (annoying for practice sessions or load development) resulting in the spent case wallowing around inside the action, and the non-tactical models don't have an adjustable comb height. Additionally, QD cups aren't offered or necessarily easy to install on the side of the stock. Standard sling swivel studs need to go away for various reasons. So as good at Tikka rifles are, they're not perfect. Just my opinion of course.

Don't get me started on Kimber ... and I used to work for them!!!

 

[MCMXI]

I probably had too much coffee today so I apologize in advance ...

I'm not asking for much, but here's my checklist. If Accuracy International built a hunting rifle I'd probably own five or six of them.

• Locking bolt handle
• Smooth, reliable action without excessive lateral bolt movement
• Minimal bolt rotation to provide optic clearance
• Good primary extraction without heavy bolt lift
• Smooth and geometrically advantageous cocking cams
• 100% reliable extraction regardless of bolt velocity
• No excessive bolt travel i.e. not a short action cartridge in a long action
• No heavy bolt lift (i.e. bolt can be run quickly with rifle shouldered and sights on target, see my Lee-Enfield video)
• Good, adjustable trigger
• Excellent magazine with suitable capacity, internal or external, that feeds equally well regardless of spring loading
• Easy to use, positive and reliable magazine catch (if dbm)
• Adjustable comb height to allow proper cheek weld
• Stock design that helps to mitigate felt recoil
• No protruding sling swivel studs
• QD cups on opposite side of stock to bolt handle
• Action/barrel optimally fit to the stock
• Appropriate barrel twist
• Appropriate barrel length
• Suitable muzzle threads for suppressor or brake i.e. no 7/16-28 or 1/2-28 crap that result in ridiculously thin walls near the muzzle
• Appropriate internal magazine length to allow bullets to touch the lands (handloads)
• Reasonable overall weight
• Rugged, weather resistant and capable of being reliable in a wide range of environments
• Last but not least, capable of consistent sub moa accuracy/precision with at least two factory hunting loads i.e. tough bullets with controlled expansion

 

[jmr40]

Nothing out of the box is perfect for me. I do have a couple of Winchester 70's in aftermarket stocks that come close. One is a 1999 production SS Classic in 30-06 in a McMillan Edge stock. The other is a 2008 production EW in 308, also in a McMillan Edge stock.

If I had to choose the one that comes closest I'd go with one of the EW's in the cartridge of your choice. While I like the Edge stocks a lot better, I could live with the factory stock if I had to.

And I agree the Tikka's have a lot going for them. The 1:11 twist doesn't bother me. My 30-06 is 1:10, the 308 is 1:12. Both of those rifles shoot exceptionally well with the 130-200 gr bullets that I've tried. I don't see the 11 twist as a negative, just different.

 

[BreechFace]

The new EW Winchester m70's (CRF, coned breech, 3-position safety, good tuneable stock trigger, easy to bed) get me quite a bit of the way there, but they still are not my optimal out of the box (stock could be lighter and better shaped for me, and a rebarrel to a cartridge, twist and contour I like), I end up spending another $600-800 to get them like I want them.

But my $1,800-2,000 rifle I put together may be abhorred by others.

 

[Olympus]

I’ve been on the same quest for several years now and I too have yet to find that one rifle. It seems like some have gotten close, but never really hit that mark for me. My current rifle is dang close, but the accuracy just hasn’t reached where I think it should be. It’s a Howa 1500 HS Precision in 6.5CM. I’ve only got 60 rounds through it, three boxes of different Hornady factory rounds, and none of them have reached MOA accuracy. I plan on giving it a few more boxes of shells to either get settled it or it’s getting kicked to the curb.

 

[MCMXI]

Both of those rifles shoot exceptionally well with the 130-200 gr bullets that I've tried. I don't see the 11 twist as a negative, just different.

I only use solid copper bullets for hunting which as you know are topically quite a bit longer than cup & core bullets, and I only hunt in cold weather which adversely affects bullet stability so twist rate is important for me.

Looks like we're 0/4 in terms of the "perfect" hunting rifle at any price.

 

[MCMXI]

Nothing out of the box is perfect for me. I do have a couple of Winchester 70's in aftermarket stocks that come close. One is a 1999 production SS Classic in 30-06 in a McMillan Edge stock. The other is a 2008 production EW in 308, also in a McMillan Edge stock.

So now I'm really interested. They only "come close" and that's after spending ~$500 on each for those fancy McMillan stocks. So how are they still lacking?

 

[Captcurt]

Closest thing that I have is my new Mauser M18 in 6.5 CM. For a cheaper rifle it has a lot going for it. I stuck a 3-9X Leupold VXII on it in Leupold mounts. The bolt runs smooth and has a 60 degree lift. The synthetic stock fits me well and is decent. Kind of between a Bergara and the Tupperware on a Savage Axis. The trigger is excellent. It has a detachable plastic magazine that is well designed and feeds well. I am sure that there are others that might fit the criteria better, but this one works for me. The fact that it shoots sub-MOA is only a bonus.

 

[Hookeye]

If the Grice carbine 7600 in .35 rem came w high comb stock ( dunno if did or not ) then yeah, itd be perfect for timber deer.

No need for adj sear or better trigger.
Just swap or mod sear spring and maybe not even need that.

I have a low comb 760 rifle in .35 rem and havent done anything to it. Well, it has a scope in low rings. Entirely usable as is.....and quite good.

My Steyr Prohunter is heavy, but also is good to go, as is.

 

[MCMXI]

Feel free to provide a list of things you'd do, with approximate costs, to turn rifle X into the "perfect" rifle. I think that would be interesting.

I was looking on Proof's website at the Tikka pre-fit options so that would solve the twist rate and possibly drop a few ounces, but there's still the magazine catch issue, bolt velocity dependent extraction, lack of an adjustable comb, and overly long actions for short action cartridges so possibly a non-starter.

 

[Legionnaire]

Interesting question. I can think of only two bolt action rifles in my safe that I haven't done some tweaking to: a Ruger 77/22 in 22 WMR, and a Cooper 52 Excalibur in 280 AI. All I did to both was add a scope, and that doesn't count as tweaking. But I've never been on the quest for the perfect factory hunting rifle. "Personalizing" them is part of the fun for me.

 

[MCMXI]

I can think of only two bolt action rifles in my safe that I haven't done some tweaking to: a Ruger 77/22 in 22 WMR

When I was working on a rifle project for a major rifle manufacturer I was sent a Ruger 77/22 chambered in .22LR and what a cool rifle it was. The barrel was bulged but it was such a great design and I wanted to keep it. I was going to get the barrel cut back before the bulge and have it threaded for a suppressor. Unfortunately I had to return it.

 

[WisBorn]

@MCMXI I didn't realize that Tikka had a 1-11 twist for 30 cals. Maybe that is why I couldn't get good groups with a 300 wsm using 180???

 

[jmr40]

So now I'm really interested. They only "come close" and that's after spending ~$500 on each for those fancy McMillan stocks. So how are they still lacking?

I meant they came close out of the box. After adding the Edge stocks they are IMO the perfect hunting rifles, maybe not the best platform for precision shooting.

The older Classic has the original Winchester trigger which I think is near bullet proof, but some dislike because it is not as smooth and light. But the one on my rifle is pretty good. I bought the rifle used so I'm assuming someone had it worked on. The trigger on the newer EW is better out of the box, and easier to adjust. While I've had no reason to doubt it, I have to admit that I still trust the older trigger for a harsh use rifle.

If forced to choose only 1 to use for everything, everywhere in any conditions, it would be the older rifle chambered in 30-06. But it isn't current production.

Another honorable mention are the SS Ruger 77's. But once again the SS Synthetic All Weather version has been discontinued.

 

[JFrank]

I believe the Remington mil spec 308 are 11.25 twist R-5 riflings shooting 175 gr bthp with effective range of 800 yards.
I have not seen anything negative in a 1-11 twist . No experience with Barnes copper Bullets so I need someone with that first hand information to weigh in on that.

 

[JFrank]

@MCMXI I didn't realize that Tikka had a 1-11 twist for 30 cals. Maybe that is why I couldn't get good groups with a 300 wsm using 180???

Their 308 is 1-11
The 300 WSM ??? I don’t know

 

[MCMXI]

I believe the Remington mil spec 308 are 11.25 twist R-5 riflings shooting 175 gr bthp with effective range of 800 yards.
I have not seen anything negative in a 1-11 twist . No experience with Barnes copper Bullets so I need someone with that first hand information to weigh in on that.

I've had stability issues with Barnes .30 cal 165gr TTSX bullets from a 1:12 barrel in cold weather. If you use Berger's TRSC and run the numbers for the Barnes .30 cal 175gr LRX, a 1:11 twist barrel, 30F and 3200' elevation (where I live), the bullet is only marginally stable with an SG of 1.28. A 1:10 twist improves things significantly with an SG of 1.55.

 

[MCMXI]

Their 308 is 1-11
The 300 WSM ??? I don’t know

The Tikka .308 Win, .30-06 Sprg., 300 WSM, and .300 WM are all 1:11. Tikka uses one action size so I guess it's no surprise that all .30 cals get the same twist rate.

 

[JFrank]

Thanks now I know, I should look into those Barnes , I’m always ready for something different.

 

[WisBorn]

Their 308 is 1-11
The 300 WSM ??? I don’t know

I Goggled it and it looks like the 300wsm was 1-11. I didn't keep the Tikka Rifle very long as it didn't make my accuracy minimum.
I traded it on a Savage model 16 1-10 twist it shot moa with premium factory ammo. I have a belief that 300 mag bullets begin at 180 grains and goes up from there.

 

[George P]

For Western critters, I prefer my 700BDL in 7mm mag; for smaller ones, I prefer my Model 7 in 7-08

 

[JFrank]

Defining my mission ‘ I’ll take my 30-30 for hunting in Timber , since I already own a 308 I’ll consider that my open area / long rifle

 

[WisBorn]

I Goggled it and it looks like the 300wsm was 1-11. I didn't keep the Tikka Rifle very long as it didn't make my accuracy minimum.
I traded it on a Savage model 16 1-10 twist it shot moa with premium factory ammo. I have a belief that 300 mag bullets begin at 180 grains and goes up from there.

If shooting TTSX or other solid copper bullets the 165 would be a good choice.

 

[MCMXI]

I Goggled it and it looks like the 300wsm was 1-11. I didn't keep the Tikka Rifle very long as it didn't make my accuracy minimum.
I traded it on a Savage model 16 1-10 twist it shot moa with premium factory ammo. I have a belief that 300 mag bullets begin at 180 grains and goes up from there.

I have a Tikka T3x TAC chambered in .300 Win Mag that shoots the Federal Premium Vital-Shok Trophy Copper 180gr very well with 5-shot groups under 3/4" at 100 yards. The barrel is 1:11 twist and 23-3/4" long but it wasn't cold when I did that testing. I'm not sure how long the Federal bullet is either.

https://cdn1.tikka.fi/sites/default/files/T3_TAC.pdf

 

[WisBorn]

I have a Tikka T3x TAC chambered in .300 Win Mag that shoots the Federal Premium Vital-Shok Trophy Copper 180gr very well with 5-shot groups under 3/4" at 100 yards. The barrel is 1:11 twist and 23-3/4" long but it wasn't cold when I did that testing. I'm not sure how long the Federal bullet is either.

https://cdn1.tikka.fi/sites/default/files/T3_TAC.pdf

I'm glad to hear that you got good results with your 300 wm!!! I liked the look and feel of the Tikka might have been just that rifle???