HELP - Are 1911s Really This Bad?

Status
Not open for further replies.
I own 3 so called bottom tier 1911s rock islands, a used gi that has well over 6500rds in it had some ftf issues, put wolfs in, no more problems.
A new fs tac, ran all 500 break in rds, in one sitting,
Nary a problem, just got another tac have only
250 in it but going to finish up on that one soon.
Mine like to run wet, if it gets a little gummy i wipe it
Oil it and keep moving.
I cant speak for anyone else but wouldnt
Have anything else
Could you have been limp wristing too?
 
I have never owned nor seen any clean and well lubricated 1911 or for that matter any pistol that had any problems. There is also such a thing as a lemon. It happens in a $100k mercedes or BMW so what do you expect of a 600 to $3000 gun? The rentals at the range are dirty, abused and no representative of any model or brand, excet for looks and feel of holding them. I can't even imagin why one would want to shoot several 1000s rounds without cleaning a gun. :eek: I consider that to be abuse of equipment. even if you are in battle and shooting all day everday!, you always will have a few minutes a day to clean your gun. It goes with the territory. If it does not function flawlessly (rare anyway) with a newly designed brand of ammo, so what. do not use that ammo. What should you do when the dog throws up evey time you feed him kibbles and bits? stop feeding him kibbles and bits and the problem is solved. :rolleyes:
 
It's not the design. It's the (present day) execution of the design that's killin' the 1911.

During the field trials, the pistol was fired 6,000 times, stopping every thousand rounds to field strip, clean, and oil. When it got too hot, it was dunked into a bucket of water...shaken...and firing continued. No failures to function and no broken parts.

For the second phase, ammunition was deliberately damaged. Bullets seated deep into the case...crushed with pliers...corroded with acid. No failures to feed or function were noted.

During WW2, a small shipment of Ithaca pistols were found to have had the parkerizing applied after the feed ramps were cut. The inspectors caught it and were ready to return the guns for repair, when someone suggested test-firing them see if it would cause a problem. One in ten was randomly chosen and test-fired. No failures to feed were noted. The test was repeated with the same results. The shipment was entered into inventory and the matter was forgotten. There were no reports of any problems with the pistols.

Ever seen how rough new parkerizing is? Kinda shoots a hole in the assumption that the feed ramp has to be mirror-polished, no?

The reports of loose, inaccurate pistols is overblown and exaggerated. It likely came from badly worn pistols. Most of them would shoot into 4 inches at 50 yards with issue ball ammo...when they were new.

Most feed problems with the 1911 can be traced straight back to the magazine. Many of the others are the result of oversprung slides and bad extractors...either in the dimensions or the material that they're made of. There was a time that you could open a new extractor, stick it in the gun and go. Occasionally, one had to be slightly bent for tension. For the most part, the bend was already applied, as per the blueprint requirement. Now that the slide specs are all over the map, they have to be fitted and "tuned" before they'll work as intended. Because improper magazines are being marketed, they lose tension and break because the magazines allow the feeding round to "jump the lips" and execute a push feed with the claw being forced to climb over the rim.

If the gun is built to spec, it'll run, and it'll run under some amazingly bad conditions. Dirty or clean. Dry or oiled. Limp-wristed or gripped hard. Upside down, sideways, and every position in between. It'll run. I've proven that point too many times to count.
 
If someone does not want a 1911, for whatever reason, that's fine. There are plenty of other choices out there. For anyone to say the 1911 is an unreliable gun (blanket statement) then they don't understand the platform. It's not for everybody but those that embrace the platform and know how to maintain the 1911 then they get to enjoy what may be the best semi-auto ever designed (IMO). Everyone else can choose whatever flips their switch. There is no one gun that everybody embraces.
 
There is no one gun that everybody embraces.
Click to expand...

Based on the comments I see here the High Point is probably the only one that comes close to that. I'm sure if I ever saw one, I would empty my safe to own it.
 
I've proven that point too many times to count.
Click to expand...

John,

Understand that I am not arguing that such is not the case.

Only reporting my experience.

Surely would have been different if I lived in North Carolina and had you as my gunsmith.
 
OP,
It might be a bit premature to judge all 1911s by a filthy range rental which may not have seen lubrication since God was a boy and using some "local" ammo of unknown quality.
 
Same here, I am not trying to start arguments just stating that my experiences with the current 1911s show that it is not as reliable as more modern designs.

Just my .02,
LeonCarr
 
Based on the comments I see here the High Point is probably the only one that comes close to that. I'm sure if I ever saw one, I would empty my safe to own it.
Click to expand...

Safe or piggy bank?
 
Did anybody look at the advertised velocity on that ammo - 735fps - more than 15% slower than standard 230gr ball.
Click to expand...
Like I said, -p...

Sure makes for a soft shooting pistol though.
 
I've had many 1911s over the past few years and most of them were fantastic peices. Over the years I've had a Kimber Eclipse Target II (which was a total dog with the factory magazines and occasionally had issues with the Series II savety); a Kimber Royal II (same as the Eclipse); a Kimber Desert Warrior (functioned very well, but had a thumb safety break on it after only 400 or 500 rounds); a Springfield Armory TRP (superb gun that's never had so much as a hiccup and one that I still carry); a Springfield MC Operator (again an outstanding gun that's never had a hiccup); a Springfield EMP 9mm (another boringly reliable and accurate 1911 from Springfield); a Springfield Loaded Target (same as with all the other Springfields, stupidly, boringly accurate and dependable); a Colt CCO (never had a malfunction with but the trigger did have a touch of bounce and overtravel in it), and then there's the king daddy of all of my 1911s, my current go to carry gun, a Wilson Combat CQB Compact. The Wilson is everything that the Springfield 1911s have been and more.

As far as the OP's negative experience with the rental 1911, I'd chalk it up to to the gun being improperly maintained and possibly a bad mag. I've run my Wilson CQB for a good 700 rounds with no cleaning and when it seemed that the gun's cycling started to slow down a touch, a couple drops of oil took care of everything and I was back to shooting...and my CQB is by far THE most tightly fit handgun I own and I have a number o them. From the OP it sounds like the gun was very badly maintained and probably in need of some replacement to the wear and tear parts like the recoil spring and mainspring, and maybe the mag was in need of a rebuild as well.

As for the control layout, it may take a little getting used to sweeping the thumb safety off, but once you're used to it, it takes no time at all to accomplish this while drawing and presenting the gun from a holster. In terms of the slide release being a little farther away, you could always use your support hand's thumb to operate the slide release or get an extended slide release from Ed Brown or Wilson Combat...just be patient in fitting it and be sure that it operates as it is supposed to before putting it to use on a carry or competition gun.

Bottom line, give the 1911 another try before completely writing it off.
 
I'm with 1911 Tuner on this one. I have six 1911's and they all work flawlessly. I keep them PM'd properly including springs and magazines - they always run.

Ran one to 2K rounds without cleaning or lubing just for my information - was running fine at the end of the 2k. But, I grease the sliding parts instead of oil.

A properly manufactured and maintained 1911 runs - has nothing to do whether it is tight or loose or the temperature, or phase of the moon. It's a machine, if it's been designed, manufactured, and assembled properly it has to run, it has no choice in the matter.

I just don't find Glocks to be the answer to every firearms query unlike the Internet echo chamber. In fact, I don't own any. I have polymer pistols from: SIG, HK, FN, S&W, and Springfield (XDm) and never have problems with any of these guns. I guess I'm just "lucky" - or, I keep them maintained correctly - your choice.

For reference, I change the oil in my vehicles before the indicator light comes on too.
 
WC145 said:
Did anybody look at the advertised velocity on that ammo - 735fps - more than 15% slower than standard 230gr ball. Combine that with a dry dirty rental gun and you've got a recipe for for failures.
Click to expand...

My handloads also run that velocity(3.9gr Clays, 230gr FMJ) My SC Commander would barely cycle it, clean. The Recoil spring on that pistol was far heavier than any 45 I've seen, and coupled with a filty gun, could very well be the problem.
 
1911Tuner said:
It's not the design. It's the (present day) execution of the design that's killin' the 1911.

During the field trials, the pistol was fired 6,000 times, stopping every thousand rounds to field strip, clean, and oil. When it got too hot, it was dunked into a bucket of water...shaken...and firing continued. No failures to function and no broken parts.

For the second phase, ammunition was deliberately damaged. Bullets seated deep into the case...crushed with pliers...corroded with acid. No failures to feed or function were noted.

During WW2, a small shipment of Ithaca pistols were found to have had the parkerizing applied after the feed ramps were cut. The inspectors caught it and were ready to return the guns for repair, when someone suggested test-firing them see if it would cause a problem. One in ten was randomly chosen and test-fired. No failures to feed were noted. The test was repeated with the same results. The shipment was entered into inventory and the matter was forgotten. There were no reports of any problems with the pistols.

Ever seen how rough new parkerizing is? Kinda shoots a hole in the assumption that the feed ramp has to be mirror-polished, no?

The reports of loose, inaccurate pistols is overblown and exaggerated. It likely came from badly worn pistols. Most of them would shoot into 4 inches at 50 yards with issue ball ammo...when they were new.

Most feed problems with the 1911 can be traced straight back to the magazine. Many of the others are the result of oversprung slides and bad extractors...either in the dimensions or the material that they're made of. There was a time that you could open a new extractor, stick it in the gun and go. Occasionally, one had to be slightly bent for tension. For the most part, the bend was already applied, as per the blueprint requirement. Now that the slide specs are all over the map, they have to be fitted and "tuned" before they'll work as intended. Because improper magazines are being marketed, they lose tension and break because the magazines allow the feeding round to "jump the lips" and execute a push feed with the claw being forced to climb over the rim.

If the gun is built to spec, it'll run, and it'll run under some amazingly bad conditions. Dirty or clean. Dry or oiled. Limp-wristed or gripped hard. Upside down, sideways, and every position in between. It'll run. I've proven that point too many times to count.
Click to expand...
ANY 1911 Pistol, made by any manufacture at anytime is only a piece of Military Junk today and can not hold a candle to a Glock 21, 30, or 36. My 36 is lighter, thinner, has less parts and can do anything a 1911 can do and better too. It will shoot any brand of ammo, including Tula Steel Case and any make hollow point RELIABLY and without failure. Just name one 1911 that can do that out of the box there champ!
 
1911Tuner said:
It's not the design. It's the (present day) execution of the design that's killin' the 1911.

During the field trials, the pistol was fired 6,000 times, stopping every thousand rounds to field strip, clean, and oil. When it got too hot, it was dunked into a bucket of water...shaken...and firing continued. No failures to function and no broken parts.

For the second phase, ammunition was deliberately damaged. Bullets seated deep into the case...crushed with pliers...corroded with acid. No failures to feed or function were noted.

During WW2, a small shipment of Ithaca pistols were found to have had the parkerizing applied after the feed ramps were cut. The inspectors caught it and were ready to return the guns for repair, when someone suggested test-firing them see if it would cause a problem. One in ten was randomly chosen and test-fired. No failures to feed were noted. The test was repeated with the same results. The shipment was entered into inventory and the matter was forgotten. There were no reports of any problems with the pistols.

Ever seen how rough new parkerizing is? Kinda shoots a hole in the assumption that the feed ramp has to be mirror-polished, no?

The reports of loose, inaccurate pistols is overblown and exaggerated. It likely came from badly worn pistols. Most of them would shoot into 4 inches at 50 yards with issue ball ammo...when they were new.

Most feed problems with the 1911 can be traced straight back to the magazine. Many of the others are the result of oversprung slides and bad extractors...either in the dimensions or the material that they're made of. There was a time that you could open a new extractor, stick it in the gun and go. Occasionally, one had to be slightly bent for tension. For the most part, the bend was already applied, as per the blueprint requirement. Now that the slide specs are all over the map, they have to be fitted and "tuned" before they'll work as intended. Because improper magazines are being marketed, they lose tension and break because the magazines allow the feeding round to "jump the lips" and execute a push feed with the claw being forced to climb over the rim.

If the gun is built to spec, it'll run, and it'll run under some amazingly bad conditions. Dirty or clean. Dry or oiled. Limp-wristed or gripped hard. Upside down, sideways, and every position in between. It'll run. I've proven that point too many times to count.
Click to expand...
While you are blocking my posts just remember that Glocks don't need Tuners or Tuning and more than me know it.
 
I just don't find Glocks to be the answer to every firearms query unlike the Internet echo chamber.
Click to expand...

The Glock is a solid pistol, and it fills a good sized niche...but what a good many of the raving fan boys don't seem to understand is that John Browning's fingerprints are all over it.

The basic system is all 1911, with a little High Power thrown in...which was esigned by Dieudonne Saive, using Browning's tilt barrel/short recoil system after Browning died and the patents expired.

I sometimes hear the question: "What would JMB think of the Glock?"

I answer: "He'd like it just fine. Why wouldn't he? He designed most of it."
 
1911Tuner said:
The Glock is a solid pistol, and it fills a good sized niche...but what a good many of the raving fan boys don't seem to understand is that John Browning's fingerprints are all over it.

The basic system is all 1911, with a little High Power thrown in...which was esigned by Dieudonne Saive, using Browning's tilt barrel/short recoil system after Browning died and the patents expired.

I sometimes hear the question: "What would JMB think of the Glock?"

I answer: "He'd like it just fine. Why wouldn't he? He designed most of it."
Click to expand...
Hey mister expert. John Browning wasn't even alive when the Belgians designed the Browning Hi Power. Gaston Glock did not use a single Browning design in his design. He purposely avoided them all to make a pistol FREE from all the Browning Design Flaws like split feed ramps, Barrel inks and those stupid staked on plunger tubes and ejectors! Get an education please. They also don't need any tuning and work with outstanding reliability out of the box thus rendering your service USELESS! Gaston Glock FIXED all of Browning mistakes and now makes America's Gun. Read a book please and get educated and not just blindly opinionated. Albert Einstein defined INSANITY as doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different out come every time. The 1911 is MILITARY SCRAP AND JUNK. End of story!
 
1911Tuner said:
The Glock is a solid pistol, and it fills a good sized niche...but what a good many of the raving fan boys don't seem to understand is that John Browning's fingerprints are all over it.

The basic system is all 1911, with a little High Power thrown in...which was esigned by Dieudonne Saive, using Browning's tilt barrel/short recoil system after Browning died and the patents expired.

I sometimes hear the question: "What would JMB think of the Glock?"

I answer: "He'd like it just fine. Why wouldn't he? He designed most of it."
Click to expand...
It has been well established that this is an ANTI GLOCK and HATE GLOCK Website and Glock users will get pitched off for not kissing the ass of the 1911 crowd. They are cowards and won't even let my posts show to the general public. Narrow Minded Morons run this site. They even made you a moderator. That just about says it all. The Great Carolina 1911 Tuner and Gun Guru that don't know his ass from a hole in the ground.
 
1911Tuner, you may have answered this before, but I have the utmost respect for you on all matters 1911 and I would love to know which manufacturers do the 1911 correctly in your opinion.
Also, I hope you know you could sell 1911Tuner inspected or approved guns and make a killing!
 
Let's look at how much of Gaston's Toy was inspired by Browning's designs.

Tilt barrel....Check.

Locking/recoil lug on top of barrel...Check

Recoil/action spring under the barrel...Check.

Front slide dismount...Check.

Side mount magazine catch...Check.

Striker-fired...Check (Grande Rendement)

Double column/single feed position magazine....Check. (Grande Rendement)

Spring-driven, pivoting external extractor...Check. (M1903 Colt)

And let's not forget Dieudonne's ideas on the High Power.

Linkless lower barrel lug with cross member to cam the barrel up and down...Check.

Gaston's task was pretty easy. All the hard stuff had already been done. He did away with multiple upper barrel lugs to make it simpler/cheaper/easier...but in order to provide the necessary surface area for breech strength, he had to use a slide that resembles a brick. It worked well enough, but it lacks in aesthetic appeal, balance, and plain svelte.

Of course, Saive had to wait until Browning's patents...owned by Colt...expired before he could utilize the Colt-Browning tilt barrel short recoil design in the P35, but that was the plan all along. Browning himself couldn't use any of those things because he'd sold the patent rights to Colt several years earlier.

The more things change, the more they remain the same, it seems.
 
A Browning Hi-Power hardly don't do no drama.. 100 countries have used/use it and pretty much goes pow.
Click to expand...

Yep. They were all built to spec, and because everybody and his half-brother hasn't jumped into the market with a High Power clone or variant...they don't give problems.

If they'd just stuck to the specs that faithfully on the 1911, this thread would have never manifested.
 
Should be a sticky.
Click to expand...

If we did that, the Glockers would burst into flames. I pointed all that stuff out to one such fella and told him that if he'd spend a few minutes lookin' at the two pistols side by side, he'd see John Moses' fingerprints all over that grand, new innovation of his.

I swear...I thought I was gonna hafta fight him before I could get out the door.

They're in deep denial on these points.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

rswartsell
  • Locked
1911 Slide Stop Handling
Replies
20
Views
1K
REAPER4206969
R
B
  • Locked
1911s hate me
Replies
12
Views
959
Marshall
M
E
  • Locked
New 1911 - Is this a problem?
Replies
7
Views
653
gudel
G
W
  • Locked
Need Help With My 45acp
Replies
5
Views
477
Quoheleth
Quoheleth
S
  • Locked
ext. slide release on G36
Replies
4
Views
441
Storm
S
Back
Top