HELP - Are 1911s Really This Bad?

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I have to take it with a grain of salt when someone says, "I have x number of 1911's and ALL of them have been 100% reliable." Really, I can say the same about all the guns in my safe. They haven't been shot more than a couple hundred rounds each and many of them haven't been fired at all so they don't get a chance to malfunction. My M&P, on the other hand gets a regular diet of 100+ rounds per week. I have well over 8000 rounds through it without a hiccup. There is a HUGE difference between saying it is reliable, and my safe guns are reliable. If you are going to make the claims if might be informative to let us know about how many rounds its fired rather than an empty, blanket statement of reliability.
 
1911Tuner, try telling a Glocker that Herr Glock didn't invent polymer, polygonal rifling, or a trigger safety. I had one Glock "armorer" who was bragging how the Glock is better than other pistols because it was only 35 parts. I told him that wasn't true and even showed him a diagram of the parts and he STILL denied it.
I understand being a fan of a paticular design or brand and I have TRIED to get on the 1911 bandwagon but I've just had too many negative experiences with them that I didn't get from other brands or types of pistols. If I had a choice to grab a Glock or a 1911 to defend myself with I'll take the Glock every time and I don't even like Glocks. BUT I've never had a problem with one either.
 
If you are going to make the claims if might be informative to let us know about how many rounds its fired rather than an empty, blanket statement of reliability.
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In case that was for me...okay.

A pair of "Billboard" 91A1 Colts bought just for range beater duty that have collectively seen close to 400,000 rounds about evenly split. I can't remember the last time that I had a malfunction in either of them. No "super-secret" super-tunin' tricks on either of them. I've had about a dozen malfunctions with both, most attributable to my funky reloads with my own cast bullets. One never malfunctioned until about a year ago, and it was filthy at the time.

Both plunger tubes got loose about 5 years ago, and were restaked. No further problems.

A NRM Colt bought in '01...also a range beater...saw about 30,000 rounds. No broken parts and one malfunction that resulted from a broken slidestop at the tip. The gun didn't stop, but it did fail to lock the slide on empty. I had a little trouble with the OEM extractor not holding tension...but it was one of Colt's experiments with MIM extrators. Replaced with a Wilson HD and have had no more problems.

I have original/correct USGI pistols from four of the five WW2 contractors that'll function with hollowpoints and even the H&G #68 lead SWC as reliably as ball...and they'll do it from the original "Hardball" magazines. I admit that I haven't run tens of thousands of rounds through those pistols...but the evidence is strong.
 
1911Tuner said:
In case that was for me...okay.

A pair of "Billboard" 91A1 Colts bought just for range beater duty that have collectively seen close to 400,000 rounds about evenly split. I can't remember the last time that I had a malfunction in either of them. No "super-secret" super-tunin' tricks on either of them. I've had about a dozen malfunctions with both, most attributable to my funky reloads with my own cast bullets. One never malfunctioned until about a year ago, and it was filthy at the time.

Both plunger tubes got loose about 5 years ago, and were restaked. No further problems.

A NRM Colt bought in '01...also a range beater...saw about 30,000 rounds. No broken parts and one malfunction that resulted from a broken slidestop at the tip. The gun didn't stop, but it did fail to lock the slide on empty. I had a little trouble with the OEM extractor not holding tension...but it was one of Colt's experiments with MIM extrators. Replaced with a Wilson HD and have had no more problems.

I have original/correct USGI pistols from four of the five WW2 contractors that'll function with hollowpoints and even the H&G #68 lead SWC as reliably as ball...and they'll do it from the original "Hardball" magazines. I admit that I haven't run tens of thousands of rounds through those pistols...but the evidence is strong.
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You are an uneducated blowhard who likes military junk.......BIG DEAL. Glock rules the world little man! Glock has sold more pistols than all the 1911's ever made and junked in the world. Stop the Glock bashing!:barf:
 
My only real problem with Glocks is that they just don't point naturally for me. I have to practice regularly and dryfire everyday to keep from shooting high on the first shot and being able to recover the target. And if I pick up a naturally pointing gun, it all goes out the window. And I enjoy shooting too much to limit myself to one design.

The 1911 and High Power point naturally. With them, if the gun does its part, I know I can do mine. i can't say that about a Glock.
 
1911Tuner. Given your statement so many people have been trying to outsmart John Browning, which I agree with, is there a 1911 that you would recommend? Think range and conceal carry. Would you stay with a Colt, since that is the original or is there a clone out there that is as good or better? And is there such a thing for under $1,000?
 
spm...If I were in the market for a carry pistol, and I wanted a 1911 or variant...I think I'd search around for one of Colt's WW1 or WW2 repros.

Right now, I've got three pistols in the carry rotation. A stock Norinco....An early stock Springfield 1911A1..and a pre-Series 80 Electroless Nickel Combat Commander that I installed a Kart barrel in and upgraded with USGI thumb safety...modified grip safety...and slidestop. My SOP small radius EGW firing pin stop, of course. Everything else is bone stock...and no...it doesn't have an 18-pound spring in it. Colt never used one that stiff. Why would I?
 
1911Tuner said:
spm...If I were in the market for a carry pistol, and I wanted a 1911 or variant...I think I'd search around for one of Colt's WW1 or WW2 repros.

Right now, I've got three pistols in the carry rotation. A stock Norinco....An early stock Springfield 1911A1..and a pre-Series 80 Electroless Nickel Combat Commander that I installed a Kart barrel in and upgraded with USGI thumb safety...modified grip safety...and slidestop. My SOP small radius EGW firing pin stop, of course. Everything else is bone stock...and no...it doesn't have an 18-pound spring in it. Colt never used one that stiff. Why would I?
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Does someone want to tell the TUNER 1911 expert that it was Remington Rand who made the largest amount of military 1911 junk.

Now for $500.00 you can by a Glock 36 that will shoot ANYTHING out of the box including hollow points and not need one single bit of tuning. It is also lighter to carry and thinner than a 1911 and smaller and will shoot rings around 1911 military junk
 
I've no experience with the Johnny-come-lately brands of 1911s. I've meddled around with a couple of dozen older critters, Series 70 and earlier. GI and civilian. When I say early, I include a couple of 1912s. At the moment all I have is a LW Commander which is all worked over as a carry gun, and a Heinz 57 Colt that I've worked over for IPSC-style shooting (But it's not at all a "race gun").

I've never had any sort of failure that in any way was inherent in the design or manufacture. Heck, I couldn't even mess 'em up in any exploratory tweaking! :D
 
Neither have I, Art. Among my modest collection are three Rands...the Union Switch twins...an Ithaca...four Colts including a 1919 dated Black Army and a 1913 Commercial Government Model...and one each 1942 and '43 production. None of'em have been super tweaked beyond setting tension on the 1919's extrator, and new springs in all of'em. They all work just fine, and feed hollowpoints like a house afire.

Here's the 1919 Colt. One of the Rands is on the table.

Colt.jpg
 
I have to echo Tuner's sentiments on the basic Colts. I picked up a couple of the 01918 Black Oxide WWI Repros right near the end of their production run. All I can say is wow! Not only are the beautiful, but the one I shoot is flawless. (I'm keeping one NIB) It is very accurate and feeds anything, including my 200 grain LSWC reloads.

What I really like about the basic Colts, (WWI, WWII Repros, S70 Repro, and Government Model) is the lack of any superfluous stuff that takes away from the original spirit of the 1911. No front slide serrations, no beavertails, spur hammers, etc. Everything you need, and nothing you don't. Plus they WORK.

My other 1911, a Springfield Milspec has been flawless from the day I bouight it in 1993. Keep it simple!
 
1911Tuner, I wasn't referring to you on the round count comment. I've read enough of your posts to take what you say at face value. I also know that with your knowledge of the 1911 you are able to keep yours tuned and working where I might not.
 
What 1911 knowledge. No formal training he just plays with them at the kitchen table. I wish I had him in Vietnam to teach the real world training for the 1911 POS.
 
Speaking to the OP, none of us can say with certainty whether the failures you experienced were a manifestation of that pistol, weak springs, dirt or low velocity ammo. My particular sentiment on S&Ws is that their older series SW1911s were a fine variant that in general were as reliable as anything made. There were a few parts know to need service at given intervals and some I have heard horror stories on. I have a new production S&W that has been 100% through nearly 1,000 rounds shooting mostly RNFP and HP and will cycle empties (so far every time). I don't as a general rule attempt to punish my firearms but I can say I've put 350 rounds through it in an afternoon without stopping to clean or lube and just a light oiling from the previous range trip.

I've heard plenty of Glock stories, watched plenty of stupid Glock torture videos and listened to people swear it's the only firearm that will ever work in xyz conditions. Well from Japan to Continental Africa (Sahara included) to Germany, Kuwait and France (yes, firearms do function in France-who knew) the 1911 has seen it all and kicked its rear. If you trust your life to a firearm you must care for it likewise. I wouldn't swear every 1911 manufacturer has things figured out but ask yourself how they sell hundreds of thousands every year if the majority don't function.

If you're looking for near complete reliability in a 1911 it would behoove you to start with a good one and find a reliable smith to do the rest.
 
The first 1911 I ever bought was a S.A. loaded. I payed $600 for it new. Went to the range and couldn't get through one complete magazine without a FTE or FTF. I was pissed and felt completely let down. Being new to handguns and being my first 1911, I never thought to send it in. I should have. Anyway, bought some Wilson mags, spent $150 at a gun smith then spent $250 later at a reputable gun smith fixing the damage the first one did. In the end, I had the feed ramp polished, ejection port lowered and a gold bead put on the front site. So excluding the bad gun smith I spent about the same amount of money as a H&K USP 45.

It's now a completely reliable gun with thousands of error free rounds through it and I love to shoot it.

In hind site would I have rather just bought the H&K? Yep. But now my 1911 and I have history so its a keeper.

But who wants an H$K when you can get a new Glock for half the price? Well, a mid 2010 gen3 or earlier anyway. So, maybe not new. What the hell, what's Taurus doing these days? :)
 
1911Tuner said:
Let's look at how much of Gaston's Toy was inspired by Browning's designs.
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1911Tuner said:
The Glock ... John Browning's fingerprints are all over it.

The basic system is all 1911
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Yes, yes, and YES!!!!!

I'm a huge Glock fanboy. I clearly recognize and give homage to the Browning/1911 heritage. There are too many similarities! It's easier to list the few differences:

- Polymer/Tenifer vs Steel
- Striker vs Hammer
- Locking block vs Link
- No barrel bushing
- Captive slide spring
- No grip safety / no thumb safety / added trigger "safety"
- Firing pin block (also on some newer 1911's)
- some crazy "cruciform" thingy vs an actual sear
- various "aesthetic" changes
- the infamous grip-angle difference

But the basic system is remarkably similar... Just about all modern pistols copy heavily from the original master.
 
Locking block vs Link
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Small point...

Neither the block...which traces back to the High Power...nor the link "lock" either pistol.

The block cams the barrel in and out of the slide vertically. With the 1911, the lower barrel lug cams it up, and the link brings it down. While there are a good many 1911 barrels that ride the link and stand on it, that's not its function. The only function that it has is vertically disengaging the barrel. The lock occurs horizontally, when the gun fires...with the lugs in opposition/shear.

The firing pin block idea first appeared on the Walther P38, which inspired the system on the Beretta 92/M9 series. Go look at both and see what you come up with.
 
You get what you pay for. If you want a 1911 go for it. It is not like a newer weapon. It requires more maintenance and parts on hand. It is as reliable as you make it. I recommend if you want one buy a cheep one shoot it. If you like it bring it up slowly a few bucks at a time. If ammo is an issue rock island has a 9mm version. It's about 450 msrp. Me I love the 1911 but I won't carry it daily. My edc is ruger sr9. I have had it for 2 years. And 10000 rounds ( I keep a log of rounds fired.) find one that fits you, and carry every day. My back up is a Phoenix arms hp22a range master. I keep the sb on it and use the lb for family to shoot at the range.
 
Look at the bright side.

If it isn't ejecting, at least it isn't bouncing .45 casings off your forehead.

I've had a number of 1911's, and they all bounced casings off my forehead to one degree or another.
Worst one of all was the Colt 70 series.
 
1911Tuner said:
Small point...

Neither the block...which traces back to the High Power...nor the link "lock" either pistol.

The block cams the barrel in and out of the slide vertically. With the 1911, the lower barrel lug cams it up, and the link brings it down. While there are a good many 1911 barrels that ride the link and stand on it, that's not its function. The only function that it has is vertically disengaging the barrel. The lock occurs horizontally, when the gun fires...with the lugs in opposition/shear.

The firing pin block idea first appeared on the Walther P38, which inspired the system on the Beretta 92/M9 series. Go look at both and see what you come up with.
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I notice you never mentioned those STUPID staked on parts like the plunger tube and ejector or that stupid position of the main spring in the bottom of the grip that sticks out of the holster and exposes it to the elements for internal rusting of the spring. Glock did not use one damn part of the browning design. Lock breach short stroke was introduced buy Luger before the Mormon had his first ugly wife in Utah. Then there are those absolutely moronic tongue and grove lock up rings on the barrel and slide. Glock eliminated that mistake with simple machining of a square and larger breech opening. Then there is that totally stupid 2 section feed ramp and make next round up feeding unreliable. Gaston solved that by putting the entire feed ramp on the barrel. The 1911 is a total design failure and was scrapped in 1947 by the Joint Chiefs Of Staff.
 
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