Here we go... Dry Firing.

[9mmepiphany]

And by the way, the instruction was, in my opinion, excellent.

I don't want to take this thread too far off track...hopefully it hasn't gone too far already...but,

The obvious question would be, what other training have you completed, that you are comparing this against?

 

[84B20]

I don't want to take this thread too far off track...hopefully it hasn't gone too far already...but,

The obvious question would be, what other training have you completed, that you are comparing this against?

I'm not trying to compare it to any other training institutions. I am just trying to relate my experience and show how some professional training can benefit anyone that carries or even just owns a gun for home protection. The only other training that I received was in the Army and CCW training, which sometimes had been barely adequate and other times not so.

I am planning on additional training from others like Rob Pincus, Gabe Suarez and John Farnam in the future though.

 

[Robbins290]

I think bolt action rifles and some rimfires cant be dry fired. I had dry fire my 22 thousands of times. And never noticed any wear.

 

[Certaindeaf]

Not to be disrespectful, but you obviously have no idea of the quality of training that can be had at some of the schools available and how it can benefit the average person. I can only relate what I experienced at Front Sight. I wasn't going to publish this on a forum but after reading your post I feel I probably should. And, incidentally, the range masters have always demonstrated their abilities at all of the courses I attended.

The evening of Friday, December 30, 2011, my wife and I had attended a book signing and lecture by John R. Lott, Jr., the author of More Guns Less Crime at a bookstore in Santa Fe, New Mexico. After the lecture, we were to meet some friends at a local restaurant for dinner. We had parked in a downtown parking lot and as we crossed the street we were approached by two men, one I remember had a hooded sweatshirt. They had been walking in the street next to the parked cars and began to separate and one of them started to walk behind us. My wife had been walking a couple of feet behind me as we had learned to do so as not to make us a better target. I was in my normal mental awareness state of yellow so I was immediately aware of these two individuals. As the one who had been walking towards me started to talk, I immediately put up both of my hands and shouted back off! It seemed to surprise him and he instantly changed direction, walked away and said “Ok, brother.” I feel very lucky that all turned out well, without injury to anyone, other than to my nerves. Now, I don’t know for sure that they were planning on anything but I feel thanks to my quick action I never have to know.

I credit my training at Front Sight for the training my wife and I received that helped keep us in the right frame of mind as well as the actions I took to avoid a serious incident.

I did make three mistakes that evening, though. One, we should not have walked across the street in the middle of the block, instead go to the corner and cross. Two, I should have had my flashlight in my hand until we had reached our car and three, I should have immediately called the police to report the incident. The first one reporting the event would most likely believed by the police. I can imagine that if these two had been just innocent individuals or ones that had no police record and had decided to call the police and say I had been brandishing a weapon, which by the way I never had to do, I could have been is some trouble. Anyway, all turned out well and I now have a bit more experience to add to the training I have received at Front Sight.

By the way I sent this experience to NRA's American Rifleman for their Armed Citizen column. I don't know if it will be published but it could be a lesson in how to avoid such an incident.

What on earth does that have to do with dry firing? And who are you to say that someone has no idea? Sounds quite presumptuous of you.

 

[84B20]

What on earth does that have to do with dry firing? And who are you to say that someone has no idea? Sounds quite presumptuous of you.

This thread is getting dangerously close to being closed. The only point I was trying to make was that dry practice (aka dry firing) is an important part of self defense and that it is a mindset that helps to prevent having live ammo around while practicing. I only was using the term I learned at Front Sight suggesting they had in my estimation great training, not to say other institutions weren't as good.

 

[gym]

My training was mostlly from my uncle Mike, a Marine DI, and later became Head of operations for a major airline. Also a Professional Hunter who worked for my father, "we owned land in Fleishmans NY with a Hotel, and this man lived near the property and took me under his wing pre teen years. After I obtained my NYC carry, I joined a pistol club in Roslyn LI, Michael Britt, "who was one of those guys I mentioned" had a lot of great stories, but would not shoot with the club. He offered a combat course and several other courses centered around his selling you another gun. I did geta chance to shoot against the NYPD pistol team, and did quite well, and used the FBI range, I think it was Fishkill, "this is 35 years ago, the Naussau county range was the most common for me, even though it was a trip from Queens. Then again my uncle was treasurer of the Glen Cove pistol and rifle club, he was a nationally ranked shooter and competed in 22 caliber pistol and rifle, along with 45 caliber pistol and skeet and trap. My uncles were all very into guns, they dropped out of a plane in Alaska for Polar bear, where the plane came back a week later and you were on your own. Canada for Moose,with a guide, and just about everything in between. I learned early on that I didn't enjoy killing animals. So for me it was target shooting, I can remember my uncle bringing me to his range the first time, and telling the guys, "old timers", watch this nephew of mine shoot. I just happened to be a good shot from jump street, I guess that's why I took to it like I did. But without going into the past too much, I have mentioned the home invasion, and several gun related incidents I was in over a 40 year span, and my gun saved my life more than once. But it wasn't what anyone taught me that saved me, it was just good old fasioned common sense. And the ability to control my nerves better than most, and being aware of my surroundings. I always said little things bother me more than big ones do. I am a firm believer that you can do the same thing 3 times in a row, and have 3 different outcomes. People all react different. What worked with one doesn't work with another, but we got way off topic, whatever works for you.

 

[230RN]

GoWolfpack:

I'm sorry that you feel that way Terry. I damaged my PF-9 dry firing it but it still functions fine.

Oh, I edited out a bunch of evilnastysnottysinful remarks about mine, since this is The High Road. I once referred to it as a two-shot derringer with a convenient detachable compartment for extra ammo. Do you have the later model with the extended feed ramp, or the older one with the short ramp?

gym:

I expect problems with that pf-9. Having had one of the early ones, it was always something. Too bad the size was great. But too many misfeeds and ejection problems, even after I did get it running right, it failed to fire the 147 grain rounds, which is common on older models.And it did have a warning in the manual about not dry firing it.Mine only fired 115 grain Remington jhp or FMJ. Other than that it was always something. They are the Austin Healys of the gun world.I know some guys swear by them, but it's like women one guy maries her and thinks she's great, and another wonders what the heck he was thinking.

That about sums up my experience, too, except I never used the 147 gr loads, just the two lighter ones. They fluffed and buffed it while they had it, and the turnaround time on it was excellent, but it didn't seem to help. I will admit that the last time I brought it to the range, it made it through a whole magazine without a stoppage, so we'll see. But I still won't trust it for a carry gun until it makes it through, say 100 rounds with both magazines.



Anyhow, enough PF-9 bashing, let's go back to dry firing...

EmGeeGeorge:

I've read about the wall anchors, but there's a generic problem with plastic "dummies." in that they aren't very durable. Neither are the clipped-off empty .22 cases, but at least they're free and you probably have some lying around anyhow. (Does the EmGee mean "machine gun?" )

A while ago Spdracr39 asked:

Question, Instead of using those ridiculously expensive plastic cartridges could you just use a fired round? I suppose that would be a little dangerous but you could color it with a sharpie or something to mark it.

I reload, so I make dummies by just sizing and reloading without powder and primer. Then I clean out the primer pocket thoroughly and pack it with RTV silicone rubber to cushion the firing pin. (I strike off the excess RTV, of course.) I magic-marker these and get real paranoid about making sure I have no live ammo in the room when I dry fire. Reeeeal paranoid. And yes, I announce aloud to myself: "I am dry-fire practicing now," and when done, "I am done dry-firing now and the gun is hot." Go ahead, laugh. I don't care what you do, but I do that little ritual to actively separate the two modes.

The advantage of using a bulleted inert round is that because of the bullet's weight and shape, you can also use them to check cycling and feeding.

Terry, 230RN

 

[barstoolguru]

all due respect to people that say they don't need to buffer the firing pin when pulling the trigger but this is why I don't buy used guns.

Because you can never tell what abuse they have been through before you get them; internal damage is hard to see

 

[Franco2shoot]

Guys,
I'm no expert, and certainly do NOT work for A-ZOOM, but all my firearms have SEVERAL snap caps... almost exclusively from A-ZOOM since I really like their products. Come-on, you spent a good bit of money for that weapon, why not spill the extra four bucks or so for a quality snapcappers?

KKKKFL

 

[ny32182]

Because if you wanted to use them all the time and dryfire a lot, it would become 4 bucks a week when you end up with an aluminum colored jellybean by Friday.

 

[TurtlePhish]

Because if you wanted to use them all the time and dryfire a lot, it would become 4 bucks a week when you end up with an aluminum colored jellybean by Friday.

+1

Especially rimfires.

 

[dampoo]

On this site or another a person gave great advice on dry firing rimfires. He used number 6 wall anchor plugs in his chambers. I have tried them and they work great and they are cheap, approximately $0.10 each.

 

[Loosedhorse]

Great advice. ^

Perhaps it's worth mentioning that in some old centerfire pistols (Colt 1908 .25 acp, for example), dry fire is THE single biggest cause of breaking the firing pin--and those are getting hard to replace!

I have been told that revolvers with frame-retained firing pins (instead of hammer-mounted) are prone to FP breakage with dry-fire. Even top makes, like Freedom Arms.

 

[barstoolguru]

as far a dry firing a.22 goes I just bought a new firing pin for my buckmark and it was 2.00. mine broke in half and the man said they never sell them; it was the first time he has ever heard someone breaking one in half

 

[Capybara]

Interestingly, my new Ruger 10/22 says it is okay to dry fire in the manual. I need to check my SR22 pistol manual, not sure about it.

My Vector Uzi manual specifically says that it is fine to dry fire it.

 

[gym]

I stii don't dry fire my guns very often. It's a mechanical device, and it was designed to hit a primer when the hammer falls. I don't see how the lack of "something", being there to absorb the shock can be ok if done repetedlly. It may work for a while, but I don't feel comfortable with doing this thousands of times. You are just waiting for a malfunction to occur.Like I said when I clean my guns, I dry fire them into an erasor of a #2 pencil to make sure the firing pin is functioning, and I have been doing this for 30 years. Other than that, an Occasional dry fire like with glocks, because it is necessary. But for me that's it. I have seen to many things break that weren't supposed to. It is a hardened piece of metal coming to a sudden stop with nothing to absorb the shock, call me old fashioned, I know at least my first shot is going to fire, and that I don't find out the hard way that the firing pin snapped off.

 

[3Putt]

From page 18 of the Ruger SR22 manual.

DRY FIRING

The RUGER® SR22 TM PISTOLS can be dry- fired without damage to the firing pin or other components as long as the magazine is inserted.