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Hk 45

Discussion in 'Handguns: Autoloaders' started by MoreIsLess, Jun 13, 2015.

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  1. Phaedrus/69

    Phaedrus/69 Member

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    The only way I'd pick the Sig is if you plan to carry it hammer down DA for the first shot. Sig has the best DA I know of in an auto, hands down. The DA shot of the HK45 is mediocre. The best versions of that gun are the LEM or the V1 (to run cocked-and-locked).

    I can't comment on the M&P. It has a good reputation but I've never tried one.
     
  2. Cee Zee

    Cee Zee member

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    When I carried my Sig I trained to cock the hammer every time I pulled the gun. It gets to be second nature pretty quick. If you've ever seen Bob Munden work his single action pistols you'll know that humans can get incredibly fast at such things. Of course I will never be on par with Bob (who is?) but I could draw and fire in SA mode in well under a second. That was a while back though. I couldn't do it now. I carry a striker fired pistol so it is no longer a problem to deal with.
     
  3. Phaedrus/69

    Phaedrus/69 Member

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    That's pretty fast! To be honest I'm kind of moving towards LEM as time goes on. I can't shoot LEM as well as SA or the VP9 striker but I get better as I practice. LEM has some potential advantages that interest. First off is that there's no safety lever to forget to disengage. Despite carrying cocked-and-locked for almost 25 years I'll concede that I could still miss the safety lever even though I practice. The other big thing, and more likely IMO, is that I could forget to put the safety back on and holster the gun still "hot". This can't happen with the LEM.

    I'm no operator and I'm more low-speed, high-drag.:eek: I'm just looking for the best system for a guy that likes guns but doesn't have the chance to do cutting edge training six times a year.
     
  4. Chuck R.

    Chuck R. Member

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    LEM is the route I eventually went, actually a light LEM/Match hybrid due to the springs I'd already replaced. Spend a little time dry firing with a LaserLyte cartridge and I caught on pretty quickly. Really is the best of both worlds with a very light DA pull, pretty short reset, than almost an SA pull for follow up shots provided you only back out to just past reset.

    I'm sold, next HK will be a LEM also.

    Chuck
     
  5. 460Shooter

    460Shooter Member

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    The LEM trigger system is DA only correct? It can't be fired SA.
     
  6. Chuck R.

    Chuck R. Member

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    Correct, it's DA only, cannot be fired in SA. If/when you cock the hammer by racking the slide, or catching it and cocking while working the trigger, it simply returns fully forward again.

    I'd guess it's less than a pound of pressure to move it to the break point. Like I said, it kind of reminds me of a light two-stage trigger. You can stage/prep it very, very easily.

    Chuck
     
  7. PO2Hammer

    PO2Hammer Member

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    The Sigs are nice, but the HK45 is more reliable and accurate IME.
     
  8. Cee Zee

    Cee Zee member

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    I don't know how a gun gets more reliable than my P220 has been. Yes it did wear out a recoil spring after at least 15,000 rounds. But it's back to being as rock solid in the reliability department as it gets.

    And I'd have to see an HK do better than what my Sig can do. I'm not saying it can't but I know my Sig is accurate enough that I drew a crowd of spectators the last time I took it to the range. I had about 25 people watching me shoot it because it was so accurate. They even went after the resident expert to try to do better. He couldn't. He shot a 629 S&W. I have one of those too. To 50 yards the Sig is more accurate than it is. When I ran out of .45 ammo that day I went to the truck and got my Smith. The resident expert turned out to be the range master. When he saw me coming with the 629 he closed the range. Said it was too dark even though we had lights. He said something about how the club didn't want us burning electricity except on designated practice nights or competition nights. He should have let me shoot the 629. He would have beat me if he had. I had just bought that gun maybe a week earlier and I was far from up to speed shooting it.

    Maybe I just got a good one. I don't know. It happens.
     
  9. PO2Hammer

    PO2Hammer Member

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    Try shooting semi wad cutters.
     
  10. PO2Hammer

    PO2Hammer Member

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    Not bashing the P220, great gun, great ergonomics, love the de-cocker. I just got frustrated with my P220 stainless because it didn't like my SWC loads whether they were lead, jacketed or plated.

    All my HKs have been 100% reliable in feed, fire, extract and eject. The only failures I've ever had was my HK45 failed to lock the slide back on some very light target loads when it was new.
     
  11. Cee Zee

    Cee Zee member

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    I've shot them. My friend had some that his wife bought sorta by mistake. We shot them up one day. No problems. I've never had any problems with it with any ammo.

    FWIW all 220's are not created equal or so I'm told. I have the older Made In W. Germany type. Newer models (generally any with a rail) are said to not be as good but I don't really know why or in what way. Maybe that's it. I don't know. I just know for sure that mine works perfect.

    Come to think of it I did have a problem with Winchester WinClean ammo but I think a lot of people did. That's the dirtiest ammo I've ever seen which is pretty odd considering the name. But that was right after I bought the pistol many years ago. It ran perfect through enough rounds to wear out the recoil spring. I replaced that and it's back to running perfect. But when I was running that WinClean (trying to use what I thought was ammo that wasn't dirty) I had to clean the gun after every mag and it still wouldn't run. You can find several people who had similar results with that ammo on this web page:

    http://www.midwayusa.com/product/29...munition-45-acp-230-grain-brass-enclosed-base

    Here's one example of a review of the stuff:

    "I have shot several boxes of Winclean and have been very unsatisfied. The product fails to feed in my Smith and Wesson 1911 from good Wilson Combat magazines. The gun jams every 3 to 4 shots with no apparent pattern. The gun is otherwise reliable. These rounds also are pretty clean as the name implies but the fouling they do leave is very difficult to remove compared to other brands."

    Once I shot up all that ammo I never had any more problems until the recoil spring wore out. That was about 15,000 rounds later. One of these days I'll post photos of what my yard looks like. I finally started picking up my brass but there's a lot of it laying on the ground in my yard.
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2015
  12. DammitBoy

    DammitBoy Member

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    Today I was comparing the HK USP .45 with a Sig P220R. In the interest of transparency, I am an HK fanboy.

    There was no comparison between the two. The USP was nose heavy, felt cheap and sounded loose. Fit and finish were far superior on the Sig. The Sig balanced well, did not rattle, functioned smoothly, and had a better decocking function.

    I was very unpleasantly surprised.
     
  13. Phaedrus/69

    Phaedrus/69 Member

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    Did you have a loaded mag in it? A dozen rounds of 230gr ball makes the USP balance out a lot better. Personally the USP45 Tactical is my all-time favorite .45 ACP handgun. Yeah, it sounds a bit loose because it's a fighting gun designed for hard use. It comes down to personal preference but I loath the Sig decocker. My favorite is the rear button a la the HK P30, with my second favorite being the USP. But to be honest the first thing I do when I get a new USP is to order a Detent Plate #9 to remove the decocker function from the safety lever.
     
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