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Hospitals and CCW

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by JackBurtonJr, Aug 30, 2008.

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  1. JackBurtonJr

    JackBurtonJr Member

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    In Indiana there's no provision in law for businesses to have No Guns signs so you don't often see them. In my county I have not noticed a single one on any of the area hospitals, but I went over to Memorial in South Bend and they had a big one on all their doors.

    It got me curious as to how other states stack up. Is it automatically against the law to carry in a hospital in your state, or do the hospitals have to post... and do the hospitals actually post?

    And BTW, if it is not too off topic... here is the reason I was in the hospital... the first grandchild, Baby Zoe.:) Zoe 116 small.jpg
     
  2. Duke Junior

    Duke Junior member

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    Congratulations,Grandpa!:D

    In North Carolina,hospitals are off limits if a conspicuous sign is posted at the entrances.
    Proper signs have the force of law in NC.
    It is not ,IMO,uncommon to see these signs,unfortunately.
     
  3. Zedo

    Zedo member

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    Bone up on the laws . . . "Grandpa" (Congrats! Where's my cigar? :D)

    Laws vary state to state. Hospitals may post "no guns" because they're the place where the shooting victim ends up after a gang-related ''drive by."

    Logic follows that the other gang members would end up at the ER, and there'd be a "retaliation" mentality going on. Just like the gang-bangers end up at the courthouse, because that's where the other gang-bangers end up appearing before the judge.

    And so . . .

    Hospitals may have a "policy" which is NOT "criminal law." In most cases when a private business posts a "no guns" sign the restriction is legal and enforceable.

    BUT -- a violation is NOT a criminal infraction, but rather a civil infraction. In most cases the "charge" is something on the order of "civil contempt." "Civil contempt" is a Class C misdemeanor -- just a bit more severe than a ticket for a moving violation in a car.

    Management must press charges -- and if you're not being a jerk, will waive prosecution. They can ask you to leave the premises. They can ask you to leave the firearm in your vehicle.

    I seriously doubt that they can bar you from the premises because you've had a firearm in possession and been asked to not carry it into the building -- unless you're being contentious. Being contentious is a different charge than "civil contempt." It's more on the order of "disorderly conduct" or "harassment" -- "threatening behavior likely to provoke escalation into a violent confrontation."

    It's concealed, eh? You're behaving yourself, n'est-ce pas?

    You might be in violation of hospital rules, but I'd be really surprised if you're breaking any "gun laws."
     
  4. loneviking

    loneviking Member

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    In Nevada, they are not off limits but hospitals can post signs. The hospital I work at has one of those obnoxious signs. Ditto for one of the Urgent Care centers in town.
     
  5. jrfoxx

    jrfoxx Member

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    Carry in a hospital in OR is 100% legal, and signs are meaningless here. Just the usual "they can ask you to leave if found out (just like they can ask you to leave for any other reason they want), and if you dont, you are tresspassing" deal.
     
  6. pitbullman

    pitbullman Member

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    i cc'ed in my local hospital here recently and saw no signs up on the main doors but found out later there was one sign posted on a side door where you never enter unless its after hours go figure.i wonder then if you can carry during hours and just not after hours or how that would work:banghead:
     
  7. Duke Junior

    Duke Junior member

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    Whether that sign is legal or not depends on your state,pitbullman.
    Let me know and we'll figure it out.
     
  8. mljdeckard

    mljdeckard Member

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    In Utah, the state has pre-emption. Hospitals are not on the short list of prohibited places. They can post, but the sign holds no weight of law. They can ask you to leave, as they can ask ANYONE to leave for any reason, but if you refuse, you are guilty of trespassing, a misdemeanor. (In the unlikely event it's prosecuted at all.) I recall at the birth of my last child, there was a sign that said something or other about weapons, I didn't even read it. If it's concealed, they have no reason to ask me to leave.
     
  9. pitbullman

    pitbullman Member

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    Quote:
    i cc'ed in my local hospital here recently and saw no signs up on the main doors but found out later there was one sign posted on a side door where you never enter unless its after hours go figure.i wonder then if you can carry during hours and just not after hours or how that would work

    Whether that sign is legal or not depends on your state,pitbullman.
    Let me know and we'll figure it out.



    as best as i can tell the sign's here in nc do hold there weight but having the one sign on the side entrance would seem to me there really not that concernd about it or theyd be all over the main doors
     
  10. bragood

    bragood Member

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    Anyone know about the laws in georgia?
     
  11. Duke Junior

    Duke Junior member

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    They hold weight:

    From the North Carolina Statutes:
    "Where notice of carrying a concealed handgun is prohibited by the posting of a conspicuous
    notice or statement."But it MUST be conspicuous.A side entrance would not qualify,IMO.You are probably correct.
    §14415.11(
    c)
     
  12. Duke Junior

    Duke Junior member

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    Is a hospital in Georgia a "Public Gathering?"
    If not, you are good to go.Good luck on getting rid of this nefarious Statute next session.

    Georgia Code 1611127
    A person is guilty of a misdemeanor when he carries (Police, Military and
    others listed under GC 1611130
    are exempt)
    · To or while at a public gathering any explosive compound, firearm, or knife designed for the
    purpose of offense and defense.
    · (b) For the purpose of this Code section, "public gathering" shall include, but shall not be
    limited to, athletic or sporting events, churches or church functions, political rallies or
    functions, publicly owned or operated buildings, or establishments at which alcoholic
    beverages are sold for consumption on the premises. Nothing in this Code section shall
    otherwise prohibit the carrying of a firearm in any other public place by a person licensed or
    permitted to carry such firearm by this part.
    · (c) This Code section shall not apply to competitors participating in organized sport shooting
    events. Law enforcement officers, peace officers retired from state or federal law enforcement
    agencies, judges, magistrates, solicitorsgeneral,
    and district attorneys may carry pistols in
    publicly owned or operated buildings.
    · (d) It is an affirmative defense to a violation of this Code section if a person notifies a law
    enforcement officer or other person employed to provide security for a public gathering of the
    presence of such item as soon as possible after learning of its presence and surrenders or
    secures such item as directed by the law enforcement officer or other person employed to
    provide security for a public gathering."
     
  13. sharpetop

    sharpetop Member

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    Enjoy your grandchild and congrats!

    My 70 something old mother just had heart bypass surgery this past June in Richmond, IN. [all is well] Naturally, I was a regular visitor for 30 days or so and carried every day. Even if they had a sign I would have still carried. Signs mean nothing in Indiana. If discovered they could ask you to leave. If you refuse you can be arrested for tresspass. Concealed is concealed!
     
  14. px4storm

    px4storm Member

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    In Ohio hospitals are not on the list of prohibited places to carry but they can post and all the ones around my location do post.
     
  15. jad0110

    jad0110 Member

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    The hospital just down the road from me has the obnoxious signs plastered all over every entrance. :fire:

    On the other hand, the local mall has one tiny sign posted at the bottom right corner of one single entrance.
     
  16. TStorm

    TStorm Member

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    In SC, hospitals are off-limits by statute. No sign necessary. This includes all medical facilities, to include doctors offices.

    Have fun figuring out if dentists and vets qualify.

    Places where carry is not allowed by statute...
    (10) hospital, medical clinic, doctor’s office, or any other facility where medical services or procedures are performed unless expressly authorized by the employer.
    A person who wilfully violates a provision of this subsection is guilty of a misdemeanor and, upon conviction, must be fined not less than one thousand dollars or imprisoned not more than one year, or both, at the discretion of the court and have his permit revoked for five years.
    Nothing contained herein may be construed to alter or affect the provisions of Sections 10 11 320, 16 23 420, 16 23 430, 16 23 465, 44 23 1080, 44 52 165, 50 9 830, and 51 3 145.
     
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2008
  17. MachIVshooter

    MachIVshooter Member

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    In CO, hospitals are not prohibited and "no guns" or "no weapons" signs do not hold the weight of law. However, CO statutes state than any place with metal detectors permanently installed at all public entrances are off-limits to CCW. I know Denver General has detectors, but I have carried in other hospitals that didn't.
     
  18. RNB65

    RNB65 Member

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    Hospital carry is legal in VA unless posted otherwise.
     
  19. butters

    butters Member

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  20. rust collector

    rust collector Member

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    No problem in SD, and if they were posted, they'd get the same response the "no cellular phones beyond this point" get.
     
  21. Mason38

    Mason38 Member

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    The one here in Rapid City has the generic "no weapons" sign that includes knives too if I remember right... it's been a while since I've been there... but I think it's one of those 'if you're not stupid about it no one will care' type things.

    -Allen
     
  22. JackBurtonJr

    JackBurtonJr Member

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    A good lawsuit from a private doctor would probably end that part of the nonsense. Otherwise the state would have the power to just reach out willy nilly and declare any business off limits -- the butcher, the baker, the candlestick maker.
     
  23. Happiness Is A Warm Gun

    Happiness Is A Warm Gun Member

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    How would that be more a restriction than states that only issue "may issue" licenses or limited purpose of licenses or simply all no CCW at all.

    Until someone wins a Heller style court case creating a precedent that CCW is a right you can't try to sue and say restricting it is infringement.

    STEP 1: Win court case that affirms carrying is a right protected by 2nd.

    I am 100% convinced "carrying" is a right as in RIGHT TO KEEP AND BEAR ARMS. However I am not SCOTUS so until a court says so it doesn't mean junk.
     
  24. MedWheeler

    MedWheeler Member

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    In Florida, hospitals that exist "for treating the mentally-disabled" (paraphrased) are supposed to be off-limits, but the statute reads something like "except as permitted". It is unclear if a state-issued CCW/CCF permit qualifies as being "permitted".
    I work for a hospital system, in its paramedic unit. Our hospital does not have a "psych ward" to speak of. What it does have, however, is a "no weapons" policy, posted on the doors of all its properties, including both campuses and all outpatient clinics.
    Florida law forbids hospitals and most other businesses or employers from banning the firearms of CCF permit-holders who work, do business with, or visit them, from being locked within those permit-holders' vehicles while parked on the premises (the so-called "take your guns to work law".)
    On the job? No, I cannot carry, but I can have it in my vehicle.
    Off the job? I have to respect the wishes of the property-owner (hospital foundation) and refrain from carrying. If I choose not to refrain, then I would only be guilty of trespassing if asked to leave and failed to comply.
     
  25. Zedo

    Zedo member

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    OK -- on the other hand --

    A Veterans Admin. hospital is a Federal Reservation, like a military post. It's off limits to carry and even to having a gun in the vehicle on the campus/site.

    That's a different "hospital" rule than the standard hospital.
     
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