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How could ammo be made cheaper?

Discussion in 'General Gun Discussions' started by Mooseman, Mar 16, 2009.

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  1. Mooseman

    Mooseman Member

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    Some of the components used to make ammo are expensive. I wonder if alternatives could be chosen to really bring the cost of ammo down. For sake of argument say the ammo is for rifle or pistol and would have to work in existing firearms.

    I remember a while back someone was making cases out of polymer, haven't heard any recent mention of that idea.

    Anyone have some good ideas?
     
  2. Cannonball888

    Cannonball888 Member

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    How about outsourcing to China? I hear they are good at producing lead products.
     
  3. geronimo509

    geronimo509 Member

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    lol thats funny, and sad but true. Also, another sad but true is the cheap labor
     
  4. crazy-mp

    crazy-mp Member

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    I think China had a problem with using steel bullets, they only use lead in toys!
     
  5. Guns and more

    Guns and more member

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    You hit the nail on the head. Just think how much labor costs and government regulation have added to a product when it is cheaper to ship LEAD halfway around the world to save money.
     
  6. 4Freedom

    4Freedom member

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    Everything else is made in china, why not guns and ammo? Actually, I hear the chinese make some pretty dang good AKs.. One chinese product, I definately would advocate us importing.
     
  7. shooter429

    shooter429 Member

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    No, the Chinese AKs are not good, IME

    and their ammo sucks.

    You can lower the costs by reusing the brass and casting lead bullets. Simple and effective.

    As to plastics or the like, I doubt it, but who knows. I will stick with brass for now.

    Shooter429
     
  8. KevinAbbeyTech

    KevinAbbeyTech Member

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    Yeah, but you still have to buy bullets if you want FMJ's (If you can even find them.)
     
  9. TAB

    TAB Member

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    If the demand would go down, the prices just might. Its all supply and demand.
     
  10. LightningCrash

    LightningCrash Member

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    In order for ammunition to be cheaper, commodities pricing has to go down.
    Lead and copper are on the downtick lately, lead is about $.50/lb at the moment. Compare that to over $1.60/lb during Dec 2007.

    IIRC Most of the processes in manufacturing ammunition are completely automated. Labor is not a big factor.
    I know someone who worked at Lake City, I can ask him for more details.

    Smokeless powder manufacturing may be more labor-intensive than the cartridge assembly though, who knows.
     
  11. Speedo66

    Speedo66 Member

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    Yes the prices of metals have gone down, but that's had no effect on prices on the shelf as supply and demand problems continue.

    What's the incentive to a manufacturer or distributor to lower prices when they can't keep the items on the shelves?

    People here whoop and start posts when they find any ammo at Wal-Mart, that should tell you there's a problem.

    Until the panic hoarding stops, prices will remain where they are.

    Don't count on the Chinese ammo ban being lifted any time soon either.
     
  12. Sixtigers

    Sixtigers Member

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    Why not a plastic case?

    For that matter, why a case at all? How about the case is the propellant?

    Bullet is shot from gun, nothing to eject--case consumed during firing.

    If it's plastique-based, the rounds would even be waterproof.



    Maybe it's time to rethink the whole cartridge issue, and come up with something new.
     
  13. foghornl

    foghornl Member

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    IIRC, Daisy (Yes, the BB gun maker..THAT Daisy) at some time in the '60's had a .22 that they called the VL. There was no case, just a blob of some sort of propellant on the back of a .22LR-size bullet. Spring/piston-compressed air heated and set off the propellant.

    Also in that time frame, I seem to sort of very vaguely remember an all-plastic 12-Ga shotgun shell...perhaps Alcan brand? The shell was full-length, no crimp, tapered a bit at the end with sort of a cap/plug over the shot.
     
  14. CoRoMo

    CoRoMo Member

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    The only wise option is to start reloading

    I'm surprised that nobody here has yet mentioned that this 'alternative' idea has already been tried. Blazer aluminum? Wolf steel? They are the least expensive for a reason.

    I'll choose brass because I reload. My ammo is extremely cheap and plentiful.
     
  15. servantofinari

    servantofinari Member

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    look at the H&K G11 and you will see why. i personaly think a polymer would be a posible alternative, hell for all i know you could use cardboard.
     
  16. bigfatdave

    bigfatdave Member

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    Caseless Ammunition isn't a new idea.
    Making it tough enough to be cycled in existing firearms is one of the harder parts.
     
  17. Lightninstrike

    Lightninstrike Member

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    Rail guns, that's the ticket. A little electricity, some magnets, voila!! No primer, powder or case.

    :evil::evil:
     
  18. JohnKSa

    JohnKSa Member

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    Lift the import bans that are currently in place.
     
  19. catspa

    catspa Member

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    Wuuulll...

    This sounds kinda stupid, but I think it's pretty cheap already, especially for a reloader.

    If there were no ammo or components right now and I had to start from scratch, it'd be forever before I could manufacture even one workable round myself. Yet here it all is, boxed up and everything for 25 cents a round. And if I buy the components I can cut that darn near in half. Not to even mention .22's...

    Parker
     
  20. Speedo66

    Speedo66 Member

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    That's assuming of course you can FIND the componants to reload.

    Presently, I can't.
     
  21. TAB

    TAB Member

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    I'm not having any probs getting them for 10 mm or 45 acp.

    Even primers are just a trip to the gun store... never had a single prob finding them.
     
  22. Mt Shooter

    Mt Shooter Member

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    A plastic case bullet has been done before. I believe it was called a tround.
     
  23. -v-

    -v- Member

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    Plastic case has been done in all the major calibers, but it has disappeared for some reason. I recall some company was marketing some polymer .308, .223 and a few other rounds. This was back in early 2000, '02 or '03? The draw-back was non-reloadability. The upside 40% weight reduction and a decrease in chamber heating due to the significantly worse thermal conductivity of high strength plastic versus metal.

    Seems that their product never took off, and since been buried off the face of the internets.
     
  24. servantofinari

    servantofinari Member

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    I think there is a PCA sold in .223 Rem. Don't know the price but the only complaints i have heard is some of the lower grain rounds have week atachment at the neck.
     
  25. raz-0

    raz-0 Member

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    At least for the polymer .223, it didn't take off because it wasn't particulalry hot (little slower than wolf), wasn't great in terms of accuracy, wasn't tons cheaper, and if you rapid fired a bit and left one in the chamber, you might not get it out without tools due to the case deforming.

    It did, hoever, have some of the cleanest burning powder I have run across. Only some of the non-toxic ammo seems to beat it.
     
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